The Emerging Church Movement

[jackie d]

GymRose said:

All too often I have seen people come to church and be told to change their ways by leadership and it hasn't been an inward change through relationship with God, they've changed for leadership and then fallen away because it was just to keep leadership happy and not a reall inward change. For instance we had a couple come to church that were in a defacto relationship, as soon as they gave their lives they were pounced on to change. They were told to stop living in sin, he was to move out and they were not to be together until such time as they married. This all occured, they married and then the stress of all the pressure to "get their lives right" blew their marriage apart. The woman I know has not been to church and her children have a very unstable life. I know this because this lady was once married to my cousin who had a daughter with her, it just turned out she walked into my church one day with her defacto family. The other side of this is that the man that she was with in the defacto relationship had got her out of prostitution, I have no idea if she has gone back to it or not but I do know one of her teen daughters is now pregnant and gone off the rails.

Had this couple not been forced to take these steps so quickly they would have eventually come to that change through their own conviction and I would dare say even still be in the church. These were not christians who chose to live together, these were people of the world who became christians while living together.

so it looks like what we are seeing is that both sides, those who aren't "right" in their walk and those who are trying to get them "right", being wrong.

It is good that there are those who want people to live lives that God has outlined for them. And it is good that people make those changes. The problem is those who want people to get their lives straight push so hard and make it very difficult especially for those who are young in the faith to do things in God's time and not people's time.

Neither side of the fence is in the right. Those who are playing God's advocates that push so hard people feel as if they are being brow beaten into conforming that eventually they push people away by their actions. And those who are trying so hard to please those people loose sight of God and His power to create change many times give up with the thought of what' the use, I'll never be good enough for God since I am surely not good enough for people.

In every way that God has changed me, especially when it comes to using drugs, was such a gentle and tender way that it wasn't until I realized that my life was different and had changed to recognize His miracle of healing. I push so hard against people who try to push me into change before I have received something from the Lord to indicate that I am wrong or living in sin because of something I am doing. It isn't because I don't want to be right with the Lord, and it certainly isn't because I want to be rebellious and stubborn, it is because I know that those who are pushing so hard are in the wrong to consider that taking such a stance with me is going to bring a delightful desire in me to change. But I don't push hard against the things that the Lord teaches me or convicts me of because I know that when the Lord is convicting me, it has no personal agenda tied to it....He is in fact doing it for my good simply because He loves me....pure and simple.

One of the many freedoms we have been given in Christ is to grow and change and become perfected in His time and not ours or another's

sorry if I have stepped off topic here......

[eric]

That's okay Jackie. You were a bit off topic, but Gymrose was making a good point. There are some pentecostal and baptist gatherings who make their own rules and tell people what they are to do or wear, However this thread is about the emerging or emergent post modern, mega churches and so called pastors who are preaching different means to have eternal life in heaven with Jesus.

[jackie d]

That's okay Jackie. You were a bit off topic, but Gymrose was making a good point. There are some pentecostal and baptist gatherings who make their own rules and tell people what they are to do or wear, However this thread is about the emerging or emergent post modern, mega churches and so called pastors who are preaching different means to have eternal life in heaven with Jesus.

Thanks eric...I have nothing to say but shame on them and it is for these reasons that the Lord tells us to be armed with the Truth of His Word.

[jackie d]

The so-called Emmergent Church rarely, if ever mentions the Name of Jesus. Does not rebuke sin. does not preach righteousness and holiness. Does not preach justification and sanctification by faith, in fact doesn't preach on those things at all, but spends most of the time preaching a secular humanist Positive Mental Attitude message.

hey would Joel Osteen be like these you have described?

[jackie d]

The so-called Emmergent Church rarely, if ever mentions the Name of Jesus. Does not rebuke sin. does not preach righteousness and holiness. Does not preach justification and sanctification by faith, in fact doesn't preach on those things at all, but spends most of the time preaching a secular humanist Positive Mental Attitude message.

hey would Joel Osteen be like these you have described?

Just remember you were the first to use names, but "Ye rightly say so".

well he came to mind...oops was that against the rules

[jackie d]

well he came to mind...oops was that against the rules

Well, his name and certain others get thrown around a lot because they are so popular, but there is an aweful lot of this going on in your local church as well, and even in churches that aren't directly associated with him or other "big names".

true...the church I attend at times seems to focus on this learning how to have a better personality stuff and whenever I sit through one of those, about half way through this blanket of fatigue falls over the top of me and I could literally fall asleep. But it could be that the guy just doesn't have a knack for it I don't know. I'll just read the word and let the Lord teach me anyhow. I've pretty much given up on man's capabilities to preach the Word and make it 100% about God and not about them....<sigh>

[OneLight]

well he came to mind...oops was that against the rules

Well, his name and certain others get thrown around a lot because they are so popular, but there is an aweful lot of this going on in your local church as well, and even in churches that aren't directly associated with him or other "big names".

I agree that slights of the emerging church, as well as new age teachings, name it and claim it preaching and so forth have been finding there way into the local churches for some time now. Their ideas came in unsuspected, moved from one to another in the not so obvious ways and have become accepted a little at a time. That is why it is so important to know the word of God, taught to us by His Spirit, and become close enough to Him to hear His leading, even as a slightest whisper. The unlearned will be led astray very easily.

Study with the Holy Spirit as your teacher, Worship the one and only true God for who He is, Fast to to fed spiritually and Pray to the Lord with all your heart. Always be filled with His Spirit and strong in the Lord so you can where the Whole Armor of God. The battle is just ahead.

[GymRose]

That's okay Jackie. You were a bit off topic, but Gymrose was making a good point. There are some pentecostal and baptist gatherings who make their own rules and tell people what they are to do or wear, However this thread is about the emerging or emergent post modern, mega churches and so called pastors who are preaching different means to have eternal life in heaven with Jesus.

Thanks for the acceptance of my point Eric, I din't think it was off topic though, but maybe I didn't explain myself well enough to the point of what it is relevent here....... I do that talking too, I think so fast it doesn't come out as well as I would have like, just ask Hubby

I was trying to make the point of why we need churches who are accepting and why people are turning to the Emerging church in regards to their feeling not quite accepted in the traditional church.

I noticed Eric, that you put mega churches in with Emerging. Do you see the mega churches as Emerging and somewhat false ??? I ask because of what I have been seeing and what I have experieneced in church within recent years that has led to my departure from church walls due to a lack of faith in the doctrine that seems to be changing and a BIG TIME lack of trust in leadership.

I'm not going to name names but we have one major one here in Australia and what I see going on in the structure of the denomination as a whole because of this to me is frightening. So I'm really keen to hear as to where others world wide do see mega churches, are they a part of the Emerging church ???

[eric]

That's okay GymRose no need to apologise......first quote one,

I was trying to make the point of why we need churches who are accepting and why people are turning to the Emerging church in regards to their feeling not quite accepted in the traditional church.

What I am trying to say, is people are not turning to the ECM, because they are shunned by other attendees that don't accept them. They going to the ECM, because of the 'easy believing' friend seeking style of preaching thay does't offend their guilt feeling and they preach that there are alternatives to eternal security. I am not pointing at any particular post modern church, but seems to be the coming trend.

And no I am not lumping all mega churches together, sorry, that was a bad choice of words. Nathele, I think, gave some links to visit and there are plenty more. I could mention a few names, but it's not my place to do so. Any ministry is only as good as the leadership in my view.

Nice talking with you,

have great day,

eric

[artsylady]

When I first became saved, I was a punk. Half my head was shaved, I wore Doc Martens, dressed in just about all black except for my then cherished red plaid kilt. The person who made me feel most welcome was a lady who had long hair to her waist, and wore long beautiful flowing skirts every single day. I never did ask her about the skirts thing. She certainly showed me that one can dress very modestly, feminine and not look frumpy at all, and be very loving towards others who look very 'different'. I am not sure what exactly my point is, but thought I'd share

What if the person closest and most accepting of you wore denim every day? It wasn't what she wore that drew you to Christ, it was her attitutude toward you. You can look feminine and modest in pants or jeans too.

Too often people take their own person experiences and apply it across the board as if that is the only way it can happen for others too. God works differently in different people.