Judgment

[MorningGlory]

The problem becomes compounded even further when applying judgment to the other members of a site such as Worthy (since most of us have never met ANY fellow member in person.) How often do we see character assessments typed up and delivered, (to be read by thousands) of other members by people who don't know them, their values, their standards or their idealogy? I would suggest that phrases such as 'you seem to', 'you always' and 'you obviously' be kept for occasions when we are talking to people we actually know. The only valid judgments WE can make here (or on any Christian forum) are based on heretical or blasphemous statements and, in cases like that, we SHOULD judge those posting those things.....not to condemn but to correct.

[fromIslam2Christ]

Very edifying post, Nebula.

I believe that somewhere in one of the epistles, there is a set of instructions on how to handle "incorrect" or "sinful" behaviours within our Christian community. I would have to look them up, but most of you probably already know what verses I am referring to.

The emphasis on love should definitely be the beginning and end of all our actions and words. Ideally. Lately, my pastor said that the difference between our sinfulness and God's holiness is so great, yet Jesus came down to our level and walked among us. The difference between us sinners and other sinners is much less than the difference between God and us, yet we have a tendency to be quick to judge and condemn and exclude.

So I feel Nebula's post on the topic is definitely on point.

[Jesusplusnothing]

In the Gospels, we see a time a group of people (Samaritans) refused to welcome Jesus. The brothers James and John wanted to call down fire from heaven in judgment against them.

But Jesus rebuked them, saying, "You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men's lives but to save them."

(Luke 9: 51-56)

By the end of John's life, we an interesting occurance.

It is recorded that in his last days his body was so frail he had to be carried into the assembly (in case you didn't know, he had been released from the prison of Patmos). While there, he would continuously say, "Little children, love one another."

When asked why he kept saying that, his response was, "It is the Lord's command. If this alone be done, it is enough" (Jerome Commentary on Galatians at Gal 6:10]).

Why would he keep saying this if he did not deem it needful to be spoken?

So the question is, do you consider it loving to be focused on and point out the sin in others?

Jesus is the Christ.

I will attempt to answer, "to be focused on".

If our focus is on "the sin", we ourselves are not being obedient to Phil. 4:8.

If we focus on the what so ever things, first, ....

We should be telling each other of the what so ever things we see them doing.

If we go to them often with these, they will listen better when we come with something less then these.

Praise the Lord!

[nebula]

One of my pastors spoke this tonight at the prayer meeting. Rather, this is my attempt to share what he did.

1 John 5

16 If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask and God will for him give life to those who commit sin not leading to death. There is a sin leading to death ; I do not say that he should make request for this. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not leading to death.

What do we do when we see a brother or sister in sin?

"he shall ask and God will for him give life"

Pray the Lord's life into the person's life! As the Father for His life to fill the person, and trust Him to do it.

What's with the "sin leading to death"? It's possible John may have been thinking of Annanias and Saphira - their sin led to death. Do not pray the Father's life back into those He took on account of sin.

So if the person is still alive (!) pray for the Father's life in them.

My addition: Let the Holy Spirit do His job - He's the convictor.

[Guest man]

What's with the "sin leading to death"? It's possible John may have been thinking of Annanias and Saphira - their sin led to death. Do not pray the Father's life back into those He took on account of sin.

Their sin was lying. Or was it greed? Or was it a combination of both?

Personally I believe he's talking about Blasphemy.

All sin is forgiven except for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. If someone were to commit this sin, it would be kind of pointless to ask God to forgive that sin.

[nebula]

What's with the "sin leading to death"? It's possible John may have been thinking of Annanias and Saphira - their sin led to death. Do not pray the Father's life back into those He took on account of sin.

Their sin was lying. Or was it greed? Or was it a combination of both?

Personally I believe he's talking about Blasphemy.

All sin is forgiven except for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. If someone were to commit this sin, it would be kind of pointless to ask God to forgive that sin.

The point is, the Lord struck them dead on account of their sin. No use praying for life to be returned to them at this point.

If the Lord has not struck the person dead for their sin - pray for God's life to enter them!

[Guest shiloh357]

In the Gospels, we see a time a group of people (Samaritans) refused to welcome Jesus. The brothers James and John wanted to call down fire from heaven in judgment against them.

But Jesus rebuked them, saying, "You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men's lives but to save them."

(Luke 9: 51-56)

By the end of John's life, we an interesting occurance.

It is recorded that in his last days his body was so frail he had to be carried into the assembly (in case you didn't know, he had been released from the prison of Patmos). While there, he would continuously say, "Little children, love one another."

When asked why he kept saying that, his response was, "It is the Lord's command. If this alone be done, it is enough" (Jerome Commentary on Galatians at Gal 6:10]).

Why would he keep saying this if he did not deem it needful to be spoken?

So the question is, do you consider it loving to be focused on and point out the sin in others?

No, I would not think so. But it is easier to judge than it is lay down your life in prayer and intercession for the person being judged. It is easier than fasting and praying for the person until the the Lord supplies the virtues you feel are lacking in that person's life.

[Guest man]

What's with the "sin leading to death"? It's possible John may have been thinking of Annanias and Saphira - their sin led to death. Do not pray the Father's life back into those He took on account of sin.

Their sin was lying. Or was it greed? Or was it a combination of both?

Personally I believe he's talking about Blasphemy.

All sin is forgiven except for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. If someone were to commit this sin, it would be kind of pointless to ask God to forgive that sin.

The point is, the Lord struck them dead on account of their sin. No use praying for life to be returned to them at this point.

If the Lord has not struck the person dead for their sin - pray for God's life to enter them!

I don't think that's the point of 1 John 5:16.

[JCISGD]

Good post Neb its always good to remind ourselves that God wants mercy to triump over Judgement, but we can be sure there are times we must confront sin and even "deliver over to Satan for the destruction of flesh, that the soul may be saved.

We cant control what others do, we can only control our reaction to them. If someone is judgemental they probably need our love, rebuking such a one may not the best result.

John was known as the Apostle of love, Peter was somewhat more confrontational but both were living under the power of the Holy Spirit with their respective personalities. God doesnt remove our personality, He just tweaks it to bring it inline with His character. Those that are abit harsh need softening, those that are bit too soft need toughening up.

Prov 28:20 "He who rebukes a man will find more favour afterward, than he who flatters with the tongue."

Imo the sin that we are not to pray for is that that leads to reprobation, these are lost and cannot return. God would need to clearly reveal this, and reuire prayer that our heart be kept right toward them.

[enoob57]

In the Gospels, we see a time a group of people (Samaritans) refused to welcome Jesus. The brothers James and John wanted to call down fire from heaven in judgment against them.

But Jesus rebuked them, saying, "You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men's lives but to save them."

(Luke 9: 51-56)

By the end of John's life, we an interesting occurrence.

It is recorded that in his last days his body was so frail he had to be carried into the assembly (in case you didn't know, he had been released from the prison of Patmos). While there, he would continuously say, "Little children, love one another."

When asked why he kept saying that, his response was, "It is the Lord's command. If this alone be done, it is enough" (Jerome Commentary on Galatians at Gal 6:10]).

Why would he keep saying this if he did not deem it needful to be spoken?

So the question is, do you consider it loving to be focused on and point out the sin in others?

"to be focused on and point out" If I understand your meaning as to that is all we see NO... but motivated to get them to see this truth: because

in myself all that is sin is a separation or a part of me that is not joined in my pursuit of becoming The Love of God in Christ Jesus hence it is

not with all of me that His love resides in me! So as I know this in myself and fight to rid it from me. The reward is to know more fully that what I

am is His ---goal 100%---- so I urge others as well ... Never in condemnation but encouragement toward a more fulfilled presence in the coming

Kingdom of our Lord. I see it as this- that which is sin in myself that whether seen or not it will not be present with me when in death I am in His

presence... so the more I live and reside in the truth of His Word the more of me that will not suffer loss... in fact I would like to not miss any of

what I am in His presence yet because of my wretchedness I know that will never be... so it has become the pressing to the High Calling of

Christ Jesus in me that I move and work... it is with the motive of all my heart, mind, soul and strength to the obedience of true Love...

1 John 4:17-5:5

17 Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world.

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.

19 We love Him because He first loved us.

Obedience by Faith

20 If someone says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love

God whom he has not seen? 21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also.

Obedience by Faith

5 Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him.

2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments.

3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.

4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory

that has overcome the world