NIV vs KJV. You decide.

[pg4Him]

This thread has some of the most disingenuous passive-aggressive behavior I've seen in a while. There is no debate to be had here. We should seriously let this thread fall dormant.

[wingnut-]

Hey Folks,

I just pulled out my 30 year old original NIV Bible. I read the entire chapter of 1 Samuel 17. It mentioned Goliath by name only a few times. For the remainder of the chapter Goliath is referred to as the Philistine. It's not at all confusing as to who The Philistine was. I suppose if the NIV translators would have known people would doubt this story they could have easily translated the Philistine as Goliath. As for who actually slew the Philistine, the NIV says it was David, and it uses the name of David more than once. See 1 Samuel 17:50 & 51, in the original NIV.

I just checked the copyright data of my Bible and it's 1978. That was about 1 year before I became aware of it. It also says it was published by the New York International Bile Society. If the forces of darkness have polluted the later versions of the NIV, then I am saddened indeed. I have compared my NIV to the KJV often, and there was never a difference in the facts. The only differences is that my NIV is much more easy to read. Sometimes I thought the KJV made the point better. But usually I couldn't grasp the way old English is spoken, so I had to stay with my NIV.

I guess now I will have to compare my NIV with the various online NIV's.

Thanks JTC, has been awhile since i read my NIV, but i was questioning that as well, because mine did not give credit to anyone other than David either according to my recollection, just hadn't found the time to research and reply yet.

[Miss Agapelove]

Hello.. NIV Application Study Bible for me... love to you all....

[pg4Him]

Here is the relevant text from the NIV at Biblegateway (relevant parts in bold):

20 Early in the morning David left the flock in the care of a shepherd, loaded up and set out, as Jesse had directed. He reached the camp as the army was going out to its battle positions, shouting the war cry. 21 Israel and the Philistines were drawing up their lines facing each other. 22 David left his things with the keeper of supplies, ran to the battle lines and asked his brothers how they were. 23 As he was talking with them, Goliath, the Philistine champion from Gath, stepped out from his lines and shouted his usual defiance, and David heard it. 24 Whenever the Israelites saw the man, they all fled from him in great fear.

25 Now the Israelites had been saying, “Do you see how this man keeps coming out? He comes out to defy Israel. The king will give great wealth to the man who kills him. He will also give him his daughter in marriage and will exempt his family from taxes in Israel.”

26 David asked the men standing near him, “What will be done for the man who kills this Philistine and removes this disgrace from Israel? Who is this uncircumcised Philistine that he should defy the armies of the living God?”

27 They repeated to him what they had been saying and told him, “This is what will be done for the man who kills him.”

28 When Eliab, David’s oldest brother, heard him speaking with the men, he burned with anger at him and asked, “Why have you come down here? And with whom did you leave those few sheep in the wilderness? I know how conceited you are and how wicked your heart is; you came down only to watch the battle.”

29 “Now what have I done?” said David. “Can’t I even speak?” 30 He then turned away to someone else and brought up the same matter, and the men answered him as before. 31 What David said was overheard and reported to Saul, and Saul sent for him.

32 David said to Saul, “Let no one lose heart on account of this Philistine; your servant will go and fight him.”

[...]

48 As the Philistine moved closer to attack him, David ran quickly toward the battle line to meet him. 49 Reaching into his bag and taking out a stone, he slung it and struck the Philistine on the forehead. The stone sank into his forehead, and he fell facedown on the ground.

50 So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.

Let's compare to KJV at the same site:

20 And David rose up early in the morning, and left the sheep with a keeper, and took, and went, as Jesse had commanded him; and he came to the trench, as the host was going forth to the fight, and shouted for the battle.

21 For Israel and the Philistines had put the battle in array, army against army.

22 And David left his carriage in the hand of the keeper of the carriage, and ran into the army, and came and saluted his brethren.

23 And as he talked with them, behold, there came up the champion, the Philistine of Gath, Goliath by name, out of the armies of the Philistines, and spake according to the same words: and David heard them.

24 And all the men of Israel, when they saw the man, fled from him, and were sore afraid.

25 And the men of Israel said, Have ye seen this man that is come up? surely to defy Israel is he come up: and it shall be, that the man who killeth him, the king will enrich him with great riches, and will give him his daughter, and make his father's house free in Israel.

26 And David spake to the men that stood by him, saying, What shall be done to the man that killeth this Philistine, and taketh away the reproach from Israel? for who is this uncircumcised Philistine, that he should defy the armies of the living God?

27 And the people answered him after this manner, saying, So shall it be done to the man that killeth him.

28 And Eliab his eldest brother heard when he spake unto the men; and Eliab's anger was kindled against David, and he said, Why camest thou down hither? and with whom hast thou left those few sheep in the wilderness? I know thy pride, and the naughtiness of thine heart; for thou art come down that thou mightest see the battle.

29 And David said, What have I now done? Is there not a cause?

30 And he turned from him toward another, and spake after the same manner: and the people answered him again after the former manner.

31 And when the words were heard which David spake, they rehearsed them before Saul: and he sent for him.

32 And David said to Saul, Let no man's heart fail because of him; thy servant will go and fight with this Philistine.

[...]

48 And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came, and drew nigh to meet David, that David hastened, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine.

49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.

50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.

That looks to me like essentially the same text. According to Biblegateway's citation, Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.

Edited August 21, 2012 by pg4Him

[appy]

1 Samuel 17:40

KJV

And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in a shepherd's bag which he had, even in a scrip; and his sling was in his hand: and he drew near to the Philistine.

NIV

Then he took his staff in his hand, chose five smooth stones from the stream, put them in the pouch of his shepherd’s bag and, with his sling in his hand, approached the Philistine.

21st Century King James Version

And he took his staff in his hand, and chose for himself five smooth stones out of the brook and put them in a shepherd’s bag which he had, even in a pouch, and his sling was in his hand; and he drew near to the Philistine.

American Standard Version

And he took his staff in his hand, and chose him five smooth stones out of the brook, and put them in the shepherd's bag which he had, even in his wallet; and his sling was in his hand: and he drew near to the Philistine.

English Standard Version

Then he took his staff in his hand and chose five smooth stones from the brook and put them in his shepherd's pouch. His sling was in his hand, and he approached the Philistine.

Complete Jewish Bible

Then he took his stick in his hand and picked five smooth stones from the riverbed, putting them in his shepherd’s bag, in his pouch. Then, with his sling in his hand, he approached the P’lishti.

New King James Version

Then he took his staff in his hand; and he chose for himself five smooth stones from the brook, and put them in a shepherd’s bag, in a pouch which he had, and his sling was in his hand. And he drew near to the Philistine.

As we all can see, all versions tell us David chose 5 stones and put them in a bag. *** edited out insults ***

Edited August 22, 2012 by OneLight

[upnorthfan]

*** edited insults ***

Good Lord. I truely don't mind getting reprimanded from a Mod from time to time, but I do take exception when others act so much worse and they are neither singled out or reprimanded.

When I first heard about Zondervan and Harper Collins, I wasn't offended or get my nose bent out of shape, I went and researched it, and sure enough it was true. I simply went back to my trustee ole KJV. You guys make it out like it's the worst thing in the world if your NIV translation is tainted.

But, when is spreading God's Word ever been easy, especially amoug "Christians". I will no longer participate in this thread. There is a nice discussion going on in earth and science.

See you there.

As the thread starter in this thread I request it be locked. My point has already been made

Edited August 22, 2012 by OneLight

[Guest]

.... But, when is spreading God's Word ever been easy, especially amoug "Christians"....

lol~! Although I Am A Christian

I Am Not Offended

~

I Love The Bible

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts. Jeremiah 15:16

And I Love The KJV

Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee. Psalms 119:11

And I Love My Heavenly Father Too

And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. Galatians 4:6

And Beloved, I Love You

A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. John 13:34

Love, Joe

~

Praying

Now also when I am old and grayheaded, O God, forsake me not; until I have shewed thy strength unto this generation, and thy power to every one that is to come. Psalms 71:18

Amen

Set a watch, O LORD, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips. Psalms 141:3

[OneLight]

Up, I think you are missing the point. If you feel convicted on the matter, then by all means do as the Lord tells you, deal with your own "house". If God has not convicted someone else on this, then maybe you should assume their house is in order. It would appear to me that you are implying there is something wrong with their walk with God, and that is not your call to make. Christians are called to go out and preach the gospel, our fellowship should be edifying, and nothing about this is edifying, it is more along the lines of finger pointing.

You don't feel this is a dig toward my belief? "When I read about those who worry about this, I often wonder if they investigate every single purchase they make to ensure that no portion of their money would go to any ungodly purpose? If this is the case, and they do, their house must be sparse and their cupboards empty".

It's mocking me plain and simple, yet here you are defending those who constantly attack me. In fact, I have had several barbs thrown my way, I just sit there and take it politely, play nice, smile and continue on as if nothing was said.

I am not mocking you one bit. I am showing how if one is to worry about where the money goes, then they show follow this in every aspect of their purchasing. If it is what we should do for books, which this is a publishing company, why not do it for everything. Yes, it does expand on your concept, but it is still your idea. I choose not to trace where my money goes, for God knows my heart.

We all choose how we are going to reply to situations that arise. If you feel called to trace where your money goes, than do so. Because you feel called, or concerned, does not equate that everyone else should follow suite. This is a personal choice, not a universal rule that all need follow.

[OneLight]

At the OP's request, this thread is now closed.

It is unfortunate that people cannot discuss different translations of scripture without insulting, attacking and demeaning others.