The original text.

[other one]

Why do we have to make all this so complicated?

[apothanein kerdos]

I guess I would say He spoke in there language, in greek, thus we can look at the two main Greek texts, the majority texts, and the Minority texts, and we can see for the most part in them when they are different, that is because the Greek spoke of different truths, which are summerized in the Aramaic. Normally in the Aramaic the Aramaic words show, more then one meaning.

For instance Luke 13:24 either in Greek has gate, or door. The Aramaic word "tarea" can be translated as both door, and gate. Thus both are true, The Aramaic shows both the Greek Translations are correct, but adds them together to make them fully correct.

Romans 8:24 In Greek texts either to hope, or wait. In Aramaic ("saky") can mean both.

John 3:15 In Him, on Him, or into Him. The one Aramaic letter when added, or atached to the beginning of a word means "By, into, in, inside, etc". Thus The Aramaic with the full word means In Him, On Him, through Him, into Him, etc..

So the thought is different texts were used, or different words were used to understand what was fully being explained. Thus The Aramaic Words explain fully what is meant.

This doesn't mean that aramaic interpretations are superior to Greek interpretations. What it means is Aramaic simply has the ability to take multiple Greek words and make them one. Yet, so does the English (love is a perfect example of this), so does that man English superior to Greek?

[AnotherTraveler]

Why do we have to make all this so complicated?

Excellent question. The answer is, of course, because we can.

...English superior to Greek?

Of course, ask any Englishman, he will tell you English is superior at all.

One of the greatest miracles of all is the fact that God's word arrives in our generation in any way recognizable at all.

The peshitta bible that was translated by George Lamsa has enough variations to cause us all to pause and I would recommend much prayer if you are going to try to put much stock in this translation.

[ayin jade]

One of the greatest miracles of all is the fact that God's word arrives in our generation in any way recognizable at all

I agree

[ayin jade]

Do you think so? Jesus quoted psalm 22. Look at the psalm, it describes His death.

To the Chief Musician, on the deer of the dawn. A Psalm of David. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me, and are far from my deliverance, and from the words of my groaning?

O my God, I cry in the daytime, but You do not answer; and in the night, and am not silent.

But You are holy, enthroned on the praises of Israel.

Our fathers trusted in You; they trusted, and You delivered them.

They cried to You, and were delivered; they trusted in You, and were not ashamed.

But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised by the people.

All who see Me mock me; they shoot out the lip; they shake the head, saying,

He trusted on Jehovah; let Him deliver Him; let Him rescue Him, since He delights in Him!

For You are He who took Me out of the womb, causing Me to trust while on My mother's breasts.

I was cast on You from the womb; You are My God from My mother's belly.

Be not far from Me; for trouble is near, for there is none to help.

Many bulls have circled around Me; strong bulls Of Bashan have surrounded Me.

They opened wide their mouths on Me, like a ripping and a roaring lion.

I am poured out like water, and all My bones are spread apart; My heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of My bowels.

My strength is dried up like a potsherd, and My tongue clings to My jaws;

and You have brought Me into the dust of death. For dogs have circled around Me; the band of spoilers have hemmed Me in, piercers of My hands and My feet.

I can count all My bones; they look and stare at Me.

They divide My garments among them and cast lots for My clothing.

But You, O Jehovah, be not far from Me; O My strength, hurry to help Me!

Deliver My soul from the sword, My only one from the dog's hand.

Save Me from the lion's mouth; from the wild oxen's horns. You have answered Me.

I will declare Your name to My brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise You.

You who fear Jehovah, praise Him; all of you, the seed of Jacob, glorify Him; and fear Him all the seed of Israel.

For He has not despised nor hated the affliction of the afflicted; and He has not hidden His face from him, but when he cried to Him, He heard.

My praise shall be of You in the great congregation; I will pay My vows before the ones who fear Him.

The meek shall eat and be satisfied; those who seek Jehovah shall praise Him; your heart shall live forever.

All the ends of the world shall remember and turn to Jehovah; and all the families of the nations shall worship before You.

For the kingdom is Jehovah's; and He is the ruler among the nations.

All the fat ones on the earth shall eat and worship; all those who go down to the dust shall bow before Him; and none can keep alive his own soul.

A seed shall serve Him; it shall be spoken of Jehovah to the coming generation.

They shall come, and shall declare His righteousness to a people that shall yet be born, that He has done this.

In Matthew 27:46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

the word used for "frosaken" is

egkataleipō

eng-kat-al-i'-po

From G1722 and G2641; to leave behind in some place, that is, (in a good sense) let remain over, or (in a bad one) to desert: - forsake, leave.

[Leonard]

I enjoy Lamsa's translation a great deal, however, with the finding of ever older and older bits and pieces of the New Testament...all written in Greek, it is becoming ever more clear that the originals were probably all in Greek.

The fairly recent discovery of Matthew's Gospel dated ca. AD 60-65--a document so early many think it is probably the autograph--in Greek, has practically made any serious consideration of Aramaic originals, absurd.

[apothanein kerdos]

I enjoy Lamsa's translation a great deal, however, with the finding of ever older and older bits and pieces of the New Testament...all written in Greek, it is becoming ever more clear that the originals were probably all in Greek.

The fairly recent discovery of Matthew's Gospel dated ca. AD 60-65--a document so early many think it is probably the autograph--in Greek, has practically made any serious consideration of Aramaic originals, absurd.

Hmmm, I'd be interested in a link to this copy. I was under the impression that Matthew would have been written in Hebrew seeing as how it was written to the Hebrews...however....considering the times it could have easily been written in Greek.

[Leonard]

I have never done a web search about it. I heard about it firsthand from a Professor, Fr. Gerald O'Collins of the Gregorian Institute in Rome. I know his phone # is available on the web, through the Gregorian Institute. I've spoken with him by phone a couple of times in the last few years. If you phone Fr. O'Collins, bear in mind Italy is about 8 hours ahead of US time.

[apothanein kerdos]

I have never done a web search about it. I heard about it firsthand from a Professor, Fr. Gerald O'Collins of the Gregorian Institute in Rome. I know his phone # is available on the web, through the Gregorian Institute. I've spoken with him by phone a couple of times in the last few years. If you phone Fr. O'Collins, bear in mind Italy is about 8 hours ahead of US time.

Id' just be really interested in hearing about the text or even getting a chance to read it....

[Fr Chuck]

Yes he very well spoke Aramic, but that would not have been the written language of most of the disciples, we have to look to see first at what group of people the letters and books of the bible is being written, the education and background of each author,

And with that, no actual orginal text survived, we have bits and pieces, and confirmed in the dead sea scrolls,