Lying and deceiving...

[Guest man]

 

I believe lying or deceiving for personal gain is wrong.

 

 

However, I wouldn't balk at the idea of lying or deceiving for the benefit of another's health or safety.

Do you have New Testament support for that?

 

 

 

It's a personal conviction.

[angels4u]

I believe lying or deceiving for personal gain is wrong.

 

 

However, I wouldn't balk at the idea of lying or deceiving for the benefit of another's health or safety.

Agree...

[NeedYouLord]

I'm thinking above the "accusing" level...into the let's reason together level...getting out of the "box" level where we are just kicking against the sides and can't get out...God is Bigger Than a Box...And Full of Love and Compassion...

 

Jesus simply changed His mind-after being led by The Holy Spirit Into The Will of The Father...

 

Love you In Him, Kathy

[enoob57]

Is it always wrong to lie or to intentionally deceive someone?

 

It is my view that the Bible gives clear examples of what some call "righteous" deception.

 

The most obvious example is Rahab, but there are many others.

 

It has been put forth in a different thread that it is always wrong to lie or deceive and that even a country is wrong for doing so.

 

What do you all think?

There is no such thing as that which is opposed to God's Ways  'lies' -for God is the truth Jn 14:6  and God is the only righteousness in

exist.... so placing righteousness with lie is just what the devil wants to put in your head!  Love, Steven

[enoob57]

 

 

I believe lying or deceiving for personal gain is wrong.

 

 

However, I wouldn't balk at the idea of lying or deceiving for the benefit of another's health or safety.

Do you have New Testament support for that?

 

 

 

It's a personal conviction.

 

So are you saying you have personal convictions non Biblically based?

[JDavis]

 

Is it always wrong to lie or to intentionally deceive someone?

 

It is my view that the Bible gives clear examples of what some call "righteous" deception.

 

The most obvious example is Rahab, but there are many others.

 

It has been put forth in a different thread that it is always wrong to lie or deceive and that even a country is wrong for doing so.

 

What do you all think?

There is no such thing as that which is opposed to God's Ways  'lies' -for God is the truth Jn 14:6  and God is the only righteousness in

exist.... so placing righteousness with lie is just what the devil wants to put in your head!  Love, Steven

 

 

Then why is Rahab famous only for a lie?

 

Why did God use deception to win the battle with Gideon?

 

Why did God tell Joshua to use deception and send spies into the promised land?

[enoob57]

Let me ask you all a question...

 

John 7:1-10.  Jesus tells his brothers this...

 

⁶ Therefore Jesus told them, “My time is not yet here; for you any time will do. ⁷ The world cannot hate you, but it hates me because I testify that its works are evil. ⁸ You go to the festival. I am not going up to this festival, because my time has not yet fully come.”

 

then this happens...

 

¹⁰ However, after his brothers had left for the festival, he went also, not publicly, but in secret.

 

So, I have to ask...Did Jesus lie?

Jesus said this about everything He did

John 8:28-30

  29 And He who sent Me is with Me. The Father has not left Me alone, for I always do those things that please Him."

NKJV

Now at the time of His brothers asking and their leaving The Father did not want His Son to go! The Father must of indicated to His Son that He wanted Him to

go secretly to the event for then He went! So no it was not lie but what we see is a moment by moment walk of the Son doing always The Will of His Father!

Love, Steven

[GoldenEagle]

 

I believe lying or deceiving for personal gain is wrong.

 

 

However, I wouldn't balk at the idea of lying or deceiving for the benefit of another's health or safety.

Do you have New Testament support for that?

 

 

I find this question strangely ironic coming from you brother.

 

Perhaps when others ask you the same thing you will be willing to answer in the future. After all, that would be fair.

God bless,

GE

[Fez]

 

 

I believe lying or deceiving for personal gain is wrong.

 

 

However, I wouldn't balk at the idea of lying or deceiving for the benefit of another's health or safety.

Do you have New Testament support for that?

 

 

I find this question strangely ironic coming from you brother.

 

Perhaps when others ask you the same thing you will be willing to answer in the future. After all, that would be fair.

God bless,

GE

 

Amen GE.

[enoob57]

 

 

Is it always wrong to lie or to intentionally deceive someone?

 

It is my view that the Bible gives clear examples of what some call "righteous" deception.

 

The most obvious example is Rahab, but there are many others.

 

It has been put forth in a different thread that it is always wrong to lie or deceive and that even a country is wrong for doing so.

 

What do you all think?

There is no such thing as that which is opposed to God's Ways  'lies' -for God is the truth Jn 14:6  and God is the only righteousness in

exist.... so placing righteousness with lie is just what the devil wants to put in your head!  Love, Steven

 

 

Then why is Rahab famous only for a lie?

No this is your focus not God's! God's  focus is that she had value in God but did not have the means to implement that value in a righteous way

 but through carnality in which she was born into and raised in!

 

Why did God use deception to win the battle with Gideon?

There was no such thing but what was done was misinterpreted by an evil ungodly enemy to God's people advantage!

 

Why did God tell Joshua to use deception and send spies into the promised land?

To not reveal all about one's self is not deception but a thing called privacy... while acting in that privacy God was showing

them His Promises of the place were true!

 

 

 

Here is your lack in Scripture to reason with... If your thinking were implemented to the n^th degree  God would have placed us all into

hell by righteous judgment! However God 'IS' Love  and that Love has mercy and grace woven within it for eternity... it is why we love

God because He first Loved us!

1 John 4:8-11

 who does not love does not know God, for God is love. 9 In this the love of God was manifested toward us,

that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him. 10 In this is love,

not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved,

if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.

NKJV

God satisfied His Justice through His Son to forgive sin... although this place is filled with sin and we sin in our flesh, even though

we fight moment by moment not to, and yet still do- the miracle of His Son shines through ->the sin is dealt with and will be eradicated

completely one day and only righteousness will be eternal... Your basic premise- because sin is present and God accepts us God accepts sin.

However The Bible clearly teaches us to separate ourselves from sin for God will judge it with eternal wrath! 

Rev 20:11-15

11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away.

And there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books

were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to

their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death

and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.

14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.  15 And anyone not found

written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

NKJV

 

The understanding-

Rom 6:7-11

7 For he who has died has been freed from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,

9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. 10 For

the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. 11 Likewise you also, reckon

yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

NKJV

 

Love, Steven