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The Overrighteous

gamnot

By gamnot
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gamnot

gamnot

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Posted

"Do not be over righteous,

neither be over wise

Why destroy yourself?

Do not be over wicked

and do not be a fool--

Why die before your time?

It is good to grasp the one

and not let go of the other.

The man who fears God will avoid

all extremes."

This is from Ecclesiastes 7; 16,17,18

What is the meaning of the phrase "over righteous?" Would this apply to the Pharisees in the time of Jesus who as I understand it, were divided into different sects in which those of one sect would walk leaning forward and those of another sect would walk leaning backwards, as if they were in a competition as to which sect was the more righteous.

gamnot

gamnot

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Could this relate to the concept of humility as being as much the opposite of self-abasement as it is of self-exaltation? Or of avoiding what is referred to as spiritual narcissism?

nebula

nebula

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Yes, I perceive it as being self-righteous and arrogant about your "righteousness".

MorningGlory

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Yes, I perceive it as being self-righteous and arrogant about your "righteousness".

 

 

I would agree with that; one can't call THEMSELVES righteous.  That determination can only be made by God and the brethren.

*Zion*

*Zion*

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Posted

I suppose I haven't read David calling himself a righteous man but the psalms are peppered with statements of being right before God and keeping himself from wicked men and wicked ways and that he has not sinned before God (Psalm 18 comes to mind).  Was David self-righteous?  Was he over righteous?

And what does Jesus then mean by saying "Be ye perfect, even as your heavenly Father is perfect?"

 

Thoughts?

gamnot

gamnot

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Yes, I perceive it as being self-righteous and arrogant about your "righteousness".

I am thinking that making such statements about righteousness could be interpreted as to the motives of the speaker. Motives can be self-serving or for edification etc.

 

 

I would agree with that; one can't call THEMSELVES righteous.  That determination can only be made by God and the brethren.

gamnot

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I suppose I haven't read David calling himself a righteous man but the psalms are peppered with statements of being right before God and keeping himself from wicked men and wicked ways and that he has not sinned before God (Psalm 18 comes to mind).  Was David self-righteous?  Was he over righteous?

And what does Jesus then mean by saying "Be ye perfect, even as your heavenly Father is perfect?"

I am thinking that making such statements about righteousness could be interpreted as to the motives of the speaker. Motives can be self-serving or for edification etc. It is God who can see into the hearts of people and see their intentions.

 

Thoughts?

gamnot

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Posted (edited)

I suppose I haven't read David calling himself a righteous man but the psalms are peppered with statements of being right before God and keeping himself from wicked men and wicked ways and that he has not sinned before God (Psalm 18 comes to mind).  Was David self-righteous?  Was he over righteous?

And what does Jesus then mean by saying "Be ye perfect, even as your heavenly Father is perfect?"

I am thinking that making such statements about righteousness could be interpreted as to the motives of the speaker. Motives can be self-serving or for edification etc. It is God who can see into the hearts of people and see their intentions.

 

Thoughts?

Jesus made the statements: "Be perfect as your Father in Heaven is perfect." and "The way to life is straight and narrow and few there be that find it." I don't believe that anyone can adequately strive for those things without the right vital interests and faith and that is something that relates to motives and what is inside the person. It cannot be done through legalism or license as cutting corners for whatever reason. Some televangelists have tried to use sophistry in their ministries and it sure to backfire.

Edited by gamnot
Willa

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Posted

My Amplified Version says Be not [morbidly exacting and externally] righteous overmuch, neither strive to make yourself [pretentiously appear] overly wise--why should you get puffed up and destroy youself [with presumptious self-sufficiency]?

It seems that these virtues are for the sake of appearances--a person making himself appear more righteous and wise than he is. It is hippocricy and pride that he is warning about. We can strive to be righteous and wise, or we just are righteous and wise. These things are not something we can work at being and then be able to boast about it. Like faith itself, they are workings of the Holy Spirit within us that we cannot boast about. So the warning is against hypocricy and pride. We need to be ourselves and be transparent, letting God change us from the inside to more fully reflect Jesus.

Guest DRS81

Guest DRS81

Posted
Posted

"Do not be over righteous,

neither be over wise

Why destroy yourself?

Do not be over wicked

and do not be a fool--

Why die before your time?

It is good to grasp the one

and not let go of the other.

The man who fears God will avoid

all extremes."

This is from Ecclesiastes 7; 16,17,18

 

Wow. That's a powerful verse I must say.

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