Original Sin

[Butch5]

 

I don't buy into the doctrine of original sin. I believe it is Augustine's doctrine.

 

What do you mean you don't buy into it, it's not being sold. It's a fact of life and scripture. Original sin comes from man. You believe Genesis is false Butch?

 

Ditch those commentaries.

[Guest DRS81]

 

 

I don't buy into the doctrine of original sin. I believe it is Augustine's doctrine.

 

What do you mean you don't buy into it, it's not being sold. It's a fact of life and scripture. Original sin comes from man. You believe Genesis is false Butch?

 

Ditch those commentaries.

 

 

What do you mean you don't believe in original sin. What are you talking about, that you don't believe sin started with Adam and Eve?

[Butch5]

 

 

 

I don't buy into the doctrine of original sin. I believe it is Augustine's doctrine.

 

What do you mean you don't buy into it, it's not being sold. It's a fact of life and scripture. Original sin comes from man. You believe Genesis is false Butch?

 

Ditch those commentaries.

 

 

What do you mean you don't believe in original sin. What are you talking about, that you don't believe sin started with Adam and Eve?

 

I mean I don't believe in the doctrine. It can't traced back to the apostles and the Scriptures refute it. The doctrine of original sin says that everyone is guilty because of Adam's sin. The Scriptures don't teach that. That teaching came from Augustine.

[Guest DRS81]

I mean I don't believe in the doctrine. It can't traced back to the apostles and the Scriptures refute it. The doctrine of original sin says that everyone is guilty because of Adam's sin. The Scriptures don't teach that. That teaching came from Augustine.

 

But everyone is guilty of sin, and sin came into the world by Adam and Eve. We all fall short of the glory of God, and the cross is the path to forgiveness. The scriptures do teach this. That's why it's called the fall of man Butch.

[saved34]

 

 

 

 

I don't buy into the doctrine of original sin. I believe it is Augustine's doctrine.

 

What do you mean you don't buy into it, it's not being sold. It's a fact of life and scripture. Original sin comes from man. You believe Genesis is false Butch?

 

Ditch those commentaries.

 

 

What do you mean you don't believe in original sin. What are you talking about, that you don't believe sin started with Adam and Eve?

 

I mean I don't believe in the doctrine. It can't traced back to the apostles and the Scriptures refute it. The doctrine of original sin says that everyone is guilty because of Adam's sin. The Scriptures don't teach that. That teaching came from Augustine.

 

Not only is everyone guilty because of Adam's transgression (We were all in his loins when he sinned) but he also passed on to us a corrupt nature that scripture calls "the flesh". Not the body, but "the flesh" or once we become saved, "The Old man or nature". Man has a natural propensity to rebel against God, in fact scripture says the natural man who is not born again cannot please God, neither does he even want any parts of God.

 

 Rom 7:18  For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 

 

Gen 6:5  The LORD saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time. 

 

Job 25:4  How then can a mortal be righteous before God? How can one born of woman be pure? 

 

Scripture is full of passages that teach that sin comes from within man. The Law was simply the mirror to show man just how wicked he is. To deny original sin is only to deceive ourselves. Just as scripture speaks of the Spirit bringing forth fruit in our lives, it also speaks of the "fleshly nature" bringing forth all manner of sin, because it is corrupt. 

 

Gal 5:19  The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 

Gal 5:20  idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 

Gal 5:21  and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 

 

Eph 4:22  You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 

 

Sin comes out of the heart of man. Unfortunately we are born in sin and shaped in iniquity.

 

Mat 15:18  But the things that come out of a person's mouth come from the heart, and these defile them. 

Mat 15:19  For out of the heart come evil thoughts--murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. 

 

Psa 51:5  Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me. 

 

 

 

[other one]

every two year old I've ever been around exhibits the true nature of the human......   and if they are not taught different before they are ten they are generally a major problem the rest of their lives.

 

 

Don't know if it came from Adam, or God just made us all that way including Adam.

[saved34]

The bible says Jesus was of the seed of David and Abraham now those two were men.

 

Hebrews 2:16

¹⁶  For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Romans 1:3

³  Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

 

I think Jesus was definitely flesh head to toes, inside and out, just like us.

 

Now where could a sin be if it is a particle  be located ?

 

Jesus wasn't born with sin and neither are we.

 

Sinners are convicted sinner (law breaker)

 

Jesus was not born with sin, because of who he is and HOW he was born. Make no mistake, he took on a body just like ours, one that was susceptible to weaknesses just like ours, but he is still the Eternal Logos, God in the flesh. Sin could find no place in him because he is the Lord of Glory. We are ONLY Human where as Christ was fully God, and Fully man. A great mystery to be sure, but him being who he is is why he was able to secure Eternal Redemption for us. Scripture even goes so far to say God shed his blood for us. 

 

Act 20:28  Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God, which he bought with his own blood. 

 

Praise God Christ lowered himself to become one of us, but He is the second Adam, not sold under sin like the rest of us were. The Holy One of God straight from the womb. 

[Butch5]

 

 

 

 

 

I don't buy into the doctrine of original sin. I believe it is Augustine's doctrine.

 

What do you mean you don't buy into it, it's not being sold. It's a fact of life and scripture. Original sin comes from man. You believe Genesis is false Butch?

 

Ditch those commentaries.

 

 

What do you mean you don't believe in original sin. What are you talking about, that you don't believe sin started with Adam and Eve?

 

I mean I don't believe in the doctrine. It can't traced back to the apostles and the Scriptures refute it. The doctrine of original sin says that everyone is guilty because of Adam's sin. The Scriptures don't teach that. That teaching came from Augustine.

 

Not only is everyone guilty because of Adam's transgression (We were all in his loins when he sinned) but he also passed on to us a corrupt nature that scripture calls "the flesh". Not the body, but "the flesh" or once we become saved, "The Old man or nature". Man has a natural propensity to rebel against God, in fact scripture says the natural man who is not born again cannot please God, neither does he even want any parts of God.

 

 Rom 7:18  For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 

 

Gen 6:5  The LORD saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time. 

 

Job 25:4  How then can a mortal be righteous before God? How can one born of woman be pure? 

 

Scripture is full of passages that teach that sin comes from within man. The Law was simply the mirror to show man just how wicked he is. To deny original sin is only to deceive ourselves. Just as scripture speaks of the Spirit bringing forth fruit in our lives, it also speaks of the "fleshly nature" bringing forth all manner of sin, because it is corrupt. 

 

Gal 5:19  The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 

Gal 5:20  idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 

Gal 5:21  and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 

 

Eph 4:22  You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 

 

Sin comes out of the heart of man. Unfortunately we are born in sin and shaped in iniquity.

 

Mat 15:18  But the things that come out of a person's mouth come from the heart, and these defile them. 

Mat 15:19  For out of the heart come evil thoughts--murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. 

 

Psa 51:5  Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me. 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, Scripture doesn't teach that. I came from Augustine. These passages need to understood in the context in which they were written. One can claim a passage says many things if they remove it from teh context in which it was written.

[saved34]

Sorry, Scripture doesn't teach that. I came from Augustine. These passages need to understood in the context in which they were written. One can claim a passage says many things if they remove it from teh context in which it was written.

 

The Apostle Paul said he had a "sinful nature". He said absolutely no good dwelled in this nature. Explain. 

 

Rom 7:18  For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 

 

[Butch5]

 

 

Sorry, Scripture doesn't teach that. I came from Augustine. These passages need to understood in the context in which they were written. One can claim a passage says many things if they remove it from teh context in which it was written.

 

The Apostle Paul said he had a "sinful nature". He said absolutely no good dwelled in this nature. Explain. 

 

Rom 7:18  For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 

He said "he" had. How do you equate that to every single human who ever lived?