fire on the earth

[other one]

 

 

 

ultimately the heavens and the earth will be destroyed by fire and rebuilt for Gods followers....    

Incorrect interpretation. The bible teaches this physical earth and heaven will be around forever:

 

Psa 104:5 KJV - Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

 

and

 

Psa 148:1-6 KJV - Praise ye the LORD. Praise ye the LORD from the heavens: praise him in the heights.

- Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.

- Praise ye him, sun and moon: praise him, all ye stars of light.

- Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens.

- Let them praise the name of the LORD: for he commanded, and they were created.

- He hath also stablished them for ever and ever: he hath made a decree which shall not pass.

 

So they won't be destroyed if they are decreed to last for ever. There is a coexistence. 

 

 

 that is the ultimate end of this time period......   

How do you come to this conclusion?

 

The Hebrew for "forever" doesn't mean, "for all eternity."  It means "the most distant time."  Essentially means 'till the end of the age.   There are a number of things in the Old Testament that are said to be "forever" like the Levitical sacrificial system, which is no longer around and will not be brought back again by the Lord.  The english word "forever" doesn't always do the Hebrew justice.

 

Psalm 148:6 KJV - He hath also stablished them for ever and ever: he hath made a decree which shall not pass.

 

for ever: (Strongs HT5703)

I. perpetuity, for ever, continuing future

A. ancient (of past time)

B. for ever (of future time)

i. of continuous existence

C. for ever (of God's existence)

 

used 49x in the KJV

- ever: 41x

- everlasting: 2x

- end: 1x

- eternity: 1x

- ever (with H5769): 1x

- evermore (1x)

- old (1x)

- perpetually (1x)

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=H5703&t=KJV

 

In Psalm 148:6, looks like it means for ever.

 

You really should listen to Shiloh...    Sometimes we use words like that but the cultural context really doesn't mean the exact meaning of the word.    In taking the word at face value, you can cause contradictions in the word that some people use to say it's not Gods word.

If you really want to do that I guess I do not have the authority to say you can't.......

[OneLight]

What is meant by this? 

 

Luk 12:49 KJV - I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?

 

The answer is found in the following verses.

 

Luke 12:49-53

“I came to send fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled! But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how distressed I am till it is accomplished! Do you suppose that I came to give peace on earth? I tell you, not at all, but rather division. For from now on five in one house will be divided: three against two, and two against three. Father will be divided against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against her daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law.”

The fire speaks of our love to Him and His to us. This will, and does, bring division within a family who are divided in their faith.

[Guest shiloh357]

 

 

 

ultimately the heavens and the earth will be destroyed by fire and rebuilt for Gods followers....    

Incorrect interpretation. The bible teaches this physical earth and heaven will be around forever:

 

Psa 104:5 KJV - Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

 

and

 

Psa 148:1-6 KJV - Praise ye the LORD. Praise ye the LORD from the heavens: praise him in the heights.

- Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.

- Praise ye him, sun and moon: praise him, all ye stars of light.

- Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens.

- Let them praise the name of the LORD: for he commanded, and they were created.

- He hath also stablished them for ever and ever: he hath made a decree which shall not pass.

 

So they won't be destroyed if they are decreed to last for ever. There is a coexistence. 

 

 

 that is the ultimate end of this time period......   

How do you come to this conclusion?

 

The Hebrew for "forever" doesn't mean, "for all eternity."  It means "the most distant time."  Essentially means 'till the end of the age.   There are a number of things in the Old Testament that are said to be "forever" like the Levitical sacrificial system, which is no longer around and will not be brought back again by the Lord.  The english word "forever" doesn't always do the Hebrew justice.

 

Psalm 148:6 KJV - He hath also stablished them for ever and ever: he hath made a decree which shall not pass.

 

for ever: (Strongs HT5703)

I. perpetuity, for ever, continuing future

A. ancient (of past time)

B. for ever (of future time)

i. of continuous existence

C. for ever (of God's existence)

 

used 49x in the KJV

- ever: 41x

- everlasting: 2x

- end: 1x

- eternity: 1x

- ever (with H5769): 1x

- evermore (1x)

- old (1x)

- perpetually (1x)

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=H5703&t=KJV

 

In Psalm 148:6, looks like it means for ever.

 

Yeah this is what happens when people depend on Strong's concordance.  Strong's Concordance is an exhaustive work, not an analytical work.  If you notice in the definitions you give from Strong's dictionary,  not all of them are the same.  Old doesn't mean the same as perpetual.   Strong's gives you all of the possible definitions available, but it doesn't tell you which definition apply to which verse. 

 

In addition, "forever" in Hebrew only applies to the current age and doesn't apply to the world to come in the strictest sense.  There are all kinds of "forevers" used in the Bible that simply refer to the time we have here on  earth.

 

The verse you cite from Psalms is a good example of this.  Psalm 148:6 is talking about the sun and the moon and the stars and physical heavens, which we KNOW from Scripture will not last forever into the New Heaven and New Earth.    At some point everything in this universe will pass away and God is going to renovate the whole thing and it will be something that we have no point of reference for in this day and age.

 

So even in the verse you cite, "forever" doesn't mean "for all eternity."

[silviawang]

just try to find out can i still be permitted to speak

[other one]

just try to find out can i still be permitted to speak

I hope so....

[mevosper]

Strong's gives you all of the possible definitions available, but it doesn't tell you which definition apply to which verse. 

 

 

But if you click on the link I supplied, it does tell you in which verses H5703 is used, and what English word it was translated into. Beware of the warning that was given to the lawyers and scribes of Christ's day. 

 

Luk 11:52 KJV - Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

 

But it is not like the old testament in which we would need to rely on the levitical priesthood to teach these things. For whoever asks, receives, for it was also given to the Gentiles.

 

Jhn 16:24 KJV - Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full.

Mat 21:22 KJV - And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

 

Isa 11:10 KJV - And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

Isa 42:6 KJV - I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Isa 49:22 KJV - Thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I will lift up mine hand to the Gentiles, and set up my standard to the people: and they shall bring thy sons in their arms, and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders.

 

Rev 3:20 KJV - Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. (bids to sit down with Warren Buffet have gone into the millions of dollars. Jesus is just asking to be invited in).

 

Be mindful and be sure to have a child's heart, spirit, mind when learning. 

 

Luk 18:16-17 KJV - But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.

- Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein.

 

What to ask for:

 

Jas 1:5 KJV -  If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

 

But also know

 

Job 28:28 KJV - And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

 

Psa 111:10 KJV - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth for ever.

 

Pro 1:7 KJV - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

 

 

With that in our hearts, Christ received his reward before his death,  

 

2Pe 1:16-18 KJV - For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

- For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

- And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. (transfiguration)

 

but had to make a way for everyone else.

 

Jhn 19:30 KJV - When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

 

Jhn 20:17 KJV - Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

 

Rev 5:6-9, 12, 14 KJV - And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

- And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.

- And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

- And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

12 - Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.

14 - And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

 

an endless number 

 

Rev 7:9 KJV - After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

 

Isa 60:11 KJV - Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought.

 

The gates of New Jerusalem will be open forever, to continually receive the innumerable followers of Christ. There is no end to the influx. If there is no end to the influx of those coming in, there is no end to the redeemed on the earth. If there is no end to the redeemed on the earth, there is no end to the physical earth. 

 

There is no end to the numbering. As a comparison - even the hairs on our heads are numbered - everyone's head - everyone's hairs. The number of hairs on the head continually change, yet God knows the number of them. Because in our lifetime there is a beginning hair and an ending hair, and then we are dead.

 

Mat 10:30 KJV - But the very hairs of your head are all numbered.

Luk 12:7 KJV - But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows. 

[mevosper]

God is almighty. 

 

Anyone saying the bible is just a book written by a bunch of authors needs to be taught the righteousness of God.

 

Check this out:

A book of 66 books spanning 1500 years with 30-40 authors (I don't know the exact number),

 

And it is all cohesive. ONLY GOD.  - mind blowing

[Guest shiloh357]

 

Strong's gives you all of the possible definitions available, but it doesn't tell you which definition apply to which verse. 

 

 

But if you click on the link I supplied, it does tell you in which verses H5703 is used, and what English word it was translated into. Beware of the warning that was given to the lawyers and scribes of Christ's day. 

 

Yes, but the problem is that you are not paying attention to the context of Ps. 148:6.   It is talking about the moon, stars and sun lasting forever, and we know that they will not for forever into the New Heavens and New Earth.  The universe is going to be completely renovated and all that we know of this physical universe will be gone and a refurbished universe will be in its place.  So  "forever" in that verse cannot mean what you are trying to make it mean.

[Qnts2]

 

Yeah this is what happens when people depend on Strong's concordance.  Strong's Concordance is an exhaustive work, not an analytical work.  If you notice in the definitions you give from Strong's dictionary,  not all of them are the same.  Old doesn't mean the same as perpetual.   Strong's gives you all of the possible definitions available, but it doesn't tell you which definition apply to which verse. 

 

 

 

 

In addition, "forever" in Hebrew only applies to the current age and doesn't apply to the world to come in the strictest sense.  There are all kinds of "forevers" used in the Bible that simply refer to the time we have here on  earth.

 

The verse you cite from Psalms is a good example of this.  Psalm 148:6 is talking about the sun and the moon and the stars and physical heavens, which we KNOW from Scripture will not last forever into the New Heaven and New Earth.    At some point everything in this universe will pass away and God is going to renovate the whole thing and it will be something that we have no point of reference for in this day and age.

 

So even in the verse you cite, "forever" doesn't mean "for all eternity."

 

 

 

Agreed. L'olam is often translated forever, which can mean 'till the end of this age'. "Til the end of this age' is basically, as far as we as humans can see, or it is like til you reach the horizen. It is a long long way, and we can not see beyond that point from where we are.  

 

L'olam va'ed, is very common, and is often translated as 'forever and ever', which would mean the end of this age, and into the next age. Psalm 148:6 says la'ad l'olam. To the end of this age, and into the next age.

[mevosper]

 

 

Strong's gives you all of the possible definitions available, but it doesn't tell you which definition apply to which verse. 

 

 

But if you click on the link I supplied, it does tell you in which verses H5703 is used, and what English word it was translated into. Beware of the warning that was given to the lawyers and scribes of Christ's day. 

 

Yes, but the problem is that you are not paying attention to the context of Ps. 148:6.   It is talking about the moon, stars and sun lasting forever, and we know that they will not for forever into the New Heavens and New Earth.  The universe is going to be completely renovated and all that we know of this physical universe will be gone and a refurbished universe will be in its place.  So  "forever" in that verse cannot mean what you are trying to make it mean.

 

Psa 148:1-6 KJV - Praise ye the LORD. Praise ye the LORD from the heavens: praise him in the heights.

 - Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.

 - Praise ye him, sun and moon: praise him, all ye stars of light.

 - Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens.

 - Let them praise the name of the LORD: for he commanded, and they were created.

 - He hath also stablished them for ever and ever: he hath made a decree which shall not pass.

 

2 questions. They are actually rhetorical, but I'm sure you will supply some sort of response. 

1. Since the angels and hosts are being told to praise him like the heavens of heavens, and waters above the heavens, and the sun, moon and stars; are they for a limited time also?

2. verse 6 confirms the forever with "he hath made a decree which shall not pass". Is this decree just a limited time decree which will pass eventually? 

 

There was a dream once that was confirmed by doubling. Maybe the doubling is confirmation here as well: 

 

Gen 41:32 KJV - And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass.