The Battle of Gog and Magog

[Last Daze]

17 hours ago, WilliamL said:

One thing to keep in mind is that at the 6th Seal, which comes before the events being considered here, "every mountain and island [shall be] moved out of its place." Rev. 6:14 So we cannot presume that the hydrology of the region will be exactly the same as today.

Good point.

[WilliamL]

13 hours ago, Sister said:

Edom is the "spiritual land". 

4 hours ago, Sister said:

There is no battle in physical EDOM. 

Edom is the spiritual land of Esau's children, who sold their inheritance.

You have not provided a single scripture to back up your doctrine. Show us the scriptural evidence for what you teach, as I have.

[Sister]

1 hour ago, Last Daze said:

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

You have not provided a single scripture to back up your doctrine. Show us the scriptural evidence for what you teach, as I have.

Good point.

William,

Do you love the truth brother?  Everything I have shared with you, you have rejected.  I am not more intelligent than you or treat this as a "competition" of who knows the most, but simply stating the "facts" written in the scriptures, so that you too can have the love of the truth and correct some parts of your doctrine that is in error.  Some things you have good knowledge of brother, and some things you really need to go over again.  I am only trying to help, not belittle you.

I will give you proof at your request.  Are you going to read all this? 

I'll start here;

Revelation 16:12   And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
(Here the Kings of the East are making their way into ISRAEL, this is not the war of the Lamb yet, but troops coming in to war the False Prophet and his beast who is occupying Israel, because this is his headquarters. This starts WW3)

Revelation 16:13   And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

Revelation 16:14   For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

(God is gathering all the troops of the "whole world" now into Israel for this 3rd WW, because he has mustered a plan to have all the armies of the world there in the same place for  preparation of the Coming. (God is preparing his sacrifice).  God will cut short that 3rd ww (man against man) by distracting them.  Christ will appear in the sky.  The armies will then re-assemble as one army now at Armageddon to prepare for war against the Lamb). 

Revelation 16:16   And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

(They will come down from the top all the way down West of Jerusalem spreading out in that Valley of Hinnom that goes a little south of Jerusalem. This is just outside the city. That valley called Hinnom, which used to be called "Tophet" in the old days, but will now be called "The Valley of Slaughter" because that is where Christ is going to kill all these armies - in that one place he has gathered them - right there just outside Jerusalem, not in Edom).
 

This is the evidence I already gave; but you dismissed it?

Jeremiah 7:32   Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be called Tophet, nor the valley of the son of Hinnom, but the valley of slaughter: for they shall bury in Tophet, till there be no place.

This is a prophecy about that day of the Lord that is coming.  The winepress.

and now here is the second piece of evidence I gave which you also dismissed?

Revelation 14:20   And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

Put them both together, and the winepress where all the armies of the whole world are gathered will die in the Valley of Hinnom.  This is that battlefield that Christ has come from with his stained garments, because he has trodden the winepress of all those troops (spiritually speaking). This place was chosen from the beginning for this purpose.  Next he will destroy all the CITIES of BABYLON, to give the rest of the ungodly world JUDGEMENT.

The armies are judged first in that one place Valley of Hinnom, THEN the remainder of all nations will be judged.

The war is not in EDOM, but just outside the city of Jerusalem.  When God speaks of Edom, he is speaking of "the spiritual land".  All men who did not want to claim their inheritance, are Esau's children (spiritually), because they fought the Lord instead, at the day of his coming. 

Listen to God's speech and you will pick up his rythmn.  The spirit is showing us something that not just anyone who picks up the book can understand.

 

[WilliamL]

You have provided no evidence that there is not more than one period of battle. You have merely presumed it, using selected scriptures while ignoring others.

Speaking of "the spiritual land" of Edom is akin to speaking of "spiritual Israel." Both terms are deceptive, because God is not done with either the RACE of Israel nor the RACE of Edom; just as he is not done with "the LAND of Israel" nor "the LAND of Edom." These are all scriptural terms from the prophets about real racial groups and real places.

You are cherry-picking scripture when you recognize the LAND of Israel while denying the LAND of Edom.

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, Sister said:

Jeremiah 7:32   Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be called Tophet, nor the valley of the son of Hinnom, but the valley of slaughter: for they shall bury in Tophet, till there be no place.

This is a prophecy about that day of the Lord that is coming.  The winepress

Sister

This has nothing to do with the end times.  It is of times past.  Read Jer 19:6,7 - So, beware, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when people will no longer call this place Topheth or the Valley of Hinnom, but the valley of Slaughter.  In this place I will ruin the plans of Judah and Jerusalem.  I will make them fall by the sword before their enemies, at the hands of those who seek their lives and I will give their carcasses as food to the birds of the air and beasts of the earth.

This is a fulfilled prophecy about Judea and those who live in Jerusalem.  Not about the armies of the North, South, East and West.

William is right, you are cherry picking Scripture.  And the Scriptures you do pick do not reinforce one an other.  They are totally opposite of what you are trying to convey.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Sister]

10 hours ago, WilliamL said:

You have provided no evidence that there is not more than one period of battle. You have merely presumed it, using selected scriptures while ignoring others.

Speaking of "the spiritual land" of Edom is akin to speaking of "spiritual Israel." Both terms are deceptive, because God is not done with either the RACE of Israel nor the RACE of Edom; just as he is not done with "the LAND of Israel" nor "the LAND of Edom." These are all scriptural terms from the prophets about real racial groups and real places.

You are cherry-picking scripture when you recognize the LAND of Israel while denying the LAND of Edom.

William

The soil here is barren, I keep trying to water, but nothing grows.

Edom is Babylon.  Not the Edom back then, but the Edom now.  Spiritual Edom.  We have to divide the scriptures.

  Hebrews 12:15   Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;

  Hebrews 12:16   Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.

  Hebrews 12:17   For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

 

 

 

Edited March 5, 2016 by Sister
corrected spelling. Barren, not Barron.

[Montana Marv]

Sister

The Northern 10 tribes of Israel had already been taken into captivity by the Babylonians.  Jeremiah is writing about what will happen to the Southern 2 tribes (Judea), if they do not repent.  They were laid siege by the Babylonians after the 10 Northern tribes went into captivity.  It is the Southern 2 tribes whose bodies and bones are buried in the valley of Hinnom.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Sister]

30 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Sister

This has nothing to do with the end times.  It is of times past.  Read Jer 19:6,7 - So, beware, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when people will no longer call this place Topheth or the Valley of Hinnom, but the valley of Slaughter.  In this place I will ruin the plans of Judah and Jerusalem.  I will make them fall by the sword before their enemies, at the hands of those who seek their lives and I will give their carcasses as food to the birds of the air and beasts of the earth.

This is a fulfilled prophecy about Judea and those who live in Jerusalem.  Not about the armies of the North, South, East and West.

William is right, you are cherry picking Scripture.  And the Scriptures you do pick do not reinforce one an other.  They are totally opposite of what you are trying to convey.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Montana Marv

When did this happen?  Could you please provide scripture.

  Isaiah 30:33   For Tophet is ordained of old; yea, for the king it is prepared; he hath made it deep and large: the pile thereof is fire and much wood; the breath of the LORD, like a stream of brimstone, doth kindle it.

Jeremiah 19:11   And shalt say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaketh a potter's vessel, that cannot be made whole again: and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury.

[WilliamL]

Sister, in the passage for this string, the historical nations/bloodlines of Meshech, Tubal, Magog, Persia, Cush, Libya, Gomer, Sheba, Dedan, Tarshish, and Israel are all mentioned. In Daniel 11:40, we find Edom, Moab, Ammon, and Egypt to boot.

Are all these "spiritual nations" too? Or is Edom the only one that becomes a spiritual nation? Is your interpretation of scripture consistent?

 

[Sister]

3 hours ago, WilliamL said:

Sister, in the passage for this string, the historical nations/bloodlines of Meshech, Tubal, Magog, Persia, Cush, Libya, Gomer, Sheba, Dedan, Tarshish, and Israel are all mentioned. In Daniel 11:40, we find Edom, Moab, Ammon, and Egypt to boot.

Are all these "spiritual nations" too? Or is Edom the only one that becomes a spiritual nation? Is your interpretation of scripture consistent?

 

William

Yes, these are the descendants of Ishmael.  The muslem nations today.  I do not doubt that they exist and are mentioned.

Ishmael's descendants were never offered the promises, but through Isaac were the promises made.  Shem and Japeth's descendants are under the same tent.  The same God.  Their descendants are Israel and Europe.  The Christian nations have been serving the same God of Israel, they know of him through the gospels and our basic laws were according to the 10 commandments.  It's these Christian nations that have gone whoring, giving up their inheritance also, because in the end, they gather to war the Lamb.  They have done what Esau did, gave up their inheritance.  They are the ones that sold their birthright, not the muslem nations, for they were never promised in the first place.

Esau a Hebrew, also intermarried outside the circle.  The Christians under that same umbrella as Israel, have done the same spiritually, gone fornicating with other beliefs.

All together, those who gave up their inheritance (the christian nations) and Ham's descendants make up one big rebellious group, spiritually called Edom.  They are all uncircumcised, and together they are called Edom - for at the coming they all war against the Lamb, and are of Babylon spiritually.

The Muslem nations are mentioned during the 1000 year reign, so they are not wiped out completely.