Bible flaws, in interpretation of Gods true word ?

[thereselittleflower]

Hi SINNERSAVED,

 My thoughts will be with specific scriptures, words, that have been altered & actually change the whole meaning of what God has said.

1. Eph. 5: 25 - 27 (NAS) uses the word `her` when the correct word is `it.` Thus people have thought the body is female where as it is the new man. The `it` refers to the word `body.`

2. Rev. 5: 8 -10. Bibles have used the word `on` (for on the earth) whereas the meaning of the Greek word `epi` means` over`, thus `over the earth.` Note the KJ Bible I have does put `over` in the margin.

3. Jude 14,  Zech. 14: 5. many Bibles have written `saints` whereas the Greek word is `hagio` & the Hebrew word is `quodos` both meaning sacred, holy. They can mean saints or angels. Thus to find out which we need to read other scriptures on that topic.

 

Actually these very scriptures have lead to great error in people`s understanding of God`s great purposes.

Hope they are of help, Marilyn.

Hi SINNERSAVED,

I thought I would show how those errors I posted lead people to the wrong understanding of their eternal inheritance.

ERROR

So if someone thinks that Eph. 5 is speaking of the body of Christ as `her,` a female`, then they get led to the thought of the `bride.` Then they read Rev. 19: 7 about the `wife` & think that is them. They then read about the army that comes with the Lord & think that is the `saints` ( errors from Jude 14 & Zech. 14: 5). Finally they read in Rev. 5 about reigning `on` the earth. Thus they have been deceived into believing that they are a `bride` that will come back with Christ to fight the world`s armies, then rule on the earth.

 

TRUTH

The Body of Christ is the `new man,` & sits with Christ in the third heaven, (Rev. 3: 21) & rules `over` not `on` the earth. The `wife/bride` is Israel whom God `divorced` when they turned from Him. When the Lord comes to connect (marry again) to Israel He will come in power & great glory with His holy angels as He tells us in - Matt. 24: 30 & 31,  Matt. 25: 31, Luke 9: 26  &  2 Thess. 1: 7) 

So we can see that those few small errors have led many people into wrong interpretation of God`s word. This also is the reason why there is so much error in pre-mid-post tribulation discussions. Once we understand the correct words then God`s word is very clear as to what group goes where.

 

Marilyn.

 

 

 

 

This, of course, is the interpretation and understanding of some.  Others have a different interpretation and understanding.

Let's look at the context in Eph 5

Ephesians 5

Wives and Husbands
22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit fin everything to their husbands.
25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.1 28 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, 30 because we are members of his body. 31 o“Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.” 32 This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church. 33 However, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband.

 

The entire context is about wives and husbands and the relationship between them.

The context where it refers to the Church as "her" is set in the husband/wife relationship.
Husbands are to love their wives as their own bodies.  So if the Church is the Bride of Christ, then of course it would also be referred to as Christ's body.    He goes on to say:

"a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.   This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church."

He clearly states he is specifically saying the husband/wife relationship refers to Christ and the Church.   This is unequivocal.  There is no ambiguity here.  It is clearly and explicitly stated.  

This is the context of his words in this passage and so the translators use feminine personal pronoun to refer to the Church correctly in this passage.

Without the insertion of a personal pronoun, the verse would say  

That he might sanctify, and cleanse with the washing of water by the word.

Sanctify and cleanse what?

The context provides the answer - The church.

But there is no individual word for church or even a pronoun in that verse.

There is no word to actually translate as "it" or "her" just as there is no word to actually translate "the church"

It is the context that the translators use to make the English translation grammatically correct.

And given the context is about the husband and wife relationship and Paul explicitly and clearly states he is referring to Christ and the Church in this relationship, the use of the pronoun "her" to refer to the Church is very appropriate and not an error in translation.

 

 

Edited November 22, 2015 by thereselittleflower

[Marilyn C]

Hi SINNERSAVED,

 My thoughts will be with specific scriptures, words, that have been altered & actually change the whole meaning of what God has said.

1. Eph. 5: 25 - 27 (NAS) uses the word `her` when the correct word is `it.` Thus people have thought the body is female where as it is the new man. The `it` refers to the word `body.`

2. Rev. 5: 8 -10. Bibles have used the word `on` (for on the earth) whereas the meaning of the Greek word `epi` means` over`, thus `over the earth.` Note the KJ Bible I have does put `over` in the margin.

3. Jude 14,  Zech. 14: 5. many Bibles have written `saints` whereas the Greek word is `hagio` & the Hebrew word is `quodos` both meaning sacred, holy. They can mean saints or angels. Thus to find out which we need to read other scriptures on that topic.

 

Eph 5:25-27 The word 'it' actually refers to the church.

Rev 5:8-10  Epi also means 'on', and that is how it is most often translated.

Hi Deborah,

Pleased to meet you. Yes `epi` in Rev. 5: 9 `And we shall `epi` the earth.` is most often translated `on.` However is that the reason we should believe that - because most often used? So how do we know what God means - Have our own opinion or some one else`s opinion or the `most used?` I believe that God reveals His meaning in His word. Thus we need to look at other scriptures concerning the topic.

So is it `on or over.` `And we shall `epi` (on or over) the earth.` (Rev. 5: 9)

`Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling,....` (Heb. 3: 1)

`...the hope which is laid up for you in heaven...` (Col. 1: 5)

`For our citizenship is in heaven,....` (Phil. 3: 20)

`the church of the first-born who are registered in heaven,...` (Heb. 12: 23)

`To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with me on my throne...` (Rev. 3: 21)

God `seated Him (Christ) at His right hand in the heavenly places far above all....` (Eph. 1: 20)

 

Thus to me it is quite clear that God desires for the Body of Christ to rule with Christ in heaven ( `epi`) OVER the earth.

Marilyn.

 

 

 

  

 

 

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi thereselittleflower,

Yes there is no pronoun, however as the doctrine of the Body of Christ, the new man has just been laid out in the first 4 chapters of Ephesians - the revelation given to the Apostle Paul, then the correct pronoun to use is `it` as it refers to the Body.

`Christ is head of the church; & He is the saviour of the Body.......for we are members of His flesh & of His bones....` (Eph.5: 23  & 30)

Marilyn. 

[thereselittleflower]

Hi thereselittleflower,

Yes there is no pronoun, however as the doctrine of the Body of Christ, the new man has just been laid out in the first 4 chapters of Ephesians - the revelation given to the Apostle Paul, then the correct pronoun to use is `it` as it refers to the Body.

`Christ is head of the church; & He is the saviour of the Body.......for we are members of His flesh & of His bones....` (Eph.5: 23  & 30)

Marilyn. 

This seems to harken back to what Adam said of Eve:

Genesis 2

The Creation of Woman
…22The LORD God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man.23The man said, "This is now bone of my bones, And flesh of my flesh; She shall be called Woman, Because she was taken out of Man." 24For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.

Paul was referring directly back to these words of Adam and applying them to the Church and her bridal relationship with Christ.

The parallels between the fashioning of Eve as the bride of Adam and the fashioning of the Church as the bride of Christ are very strong and clear.

Just as Adam's side was opened and his rib removed so that Eve would be formed, so a spear pierced the side of Christ from which flowed His water and blood so the Church would be formed. 

 

When we look back at Eph 2:15 where Paul speaks of the "one new man"  we must look deeper than the superficial words used in our English translation.  The word translated "man" here is not gender specific.  It is not referring to a "male."

Eph 2:15

Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

The word translated "man" here is ἄνθρωπος ánthrōpos,  and it simply means a human being.

a human being, whether male or female

1. generically, to include all human individuals

2. to distinguish man from beings of a different order

   1. of animals and plants

   2. of from God and Christ

   3. of the angels

 

There is nothing specifying the male gender here, so there is no contradiction between Paul calling the Church "one new man" meaning  "one new being" (which is in keeping with him telling us we are a new creation) and then speaking of the Church in a bridal relationship with Christ of that between a husband and a wife, and then translators thus referring to the Church as Her.

 

Given even the larger context of these words, there is no apparent error in translation here when translators use the word  "her."

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 22, 2015 by thereselittleflower

[Deborah_]

Hi SINNERSAVED,

 My thoughts will be with specific scriptures, words, that have been altered & actually change the whole meaning of what God has said.

1. Eph. 5: 25 - 27 (NAS) uses the word `her` when the correct word is `it.` Thus people have thought the body is female where as it is the new man. The `it` refers to the word `body.`

2. Rev. 5: 8 -10. Bibles have used the word `on` (for on the earth) whereas the meaning of the Greek word `epi` means` over`, thus `over the earth.` Note the KJ Bible I have does put `over` in the margin.

3. Jude 14,  Zech. 14: 5. many Bibles have written `saints` whereas the Greek word is `hagio` & the Hebrew word is `quodos` both meaning sacred, holy. They can mean saints or angels. Thus to find out which we need to read other scriptures on that topic.

 

Eph 5:25-27 The word 'it' actually refers to the church.

Rev 5:8-10  Epi also means 'on', and that is how it is most often translated.

Hi Deborah,

Pleased to meet you. Yes `epi` in Rev. 5: 9 `And we shall `epi` the earth.` is most often translated `on.` However is that the reason we should believe that - because most often used? So how do we know what God means - Have our own opinion or some one else`s opinion or the `most used?` I believe that God reveals His meaning in His word. Thus we need to look at other scriptures concerning the topic.

So is it `on or over.` `And we shall `epi` (on or over) the earth.` (Rev. 5: 9)

`Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling,....` (Heb. 3: 1)

`...the hope which is laid up for you in heaven...` (Col. 1: 5)

`For our citizenship is in heaven,....` (Phil. 3: 20)

`the church of the first-born who are registered in heaven,...` (Heb. 12: 23)

`To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with me on my throne...` (Rev. 3: 21)

God `seated Him (Christ) at His right hand in the heavenly places far above all....` (Eph. 1: 20)

 

Thus to me it is quite clear that God desires for the Body of Christ to rule with Christ in heaven ( `epi`) OVER the earth.

Marilyn.

However is that the reason we should believe that - because most often used?

If that is the most natural meaning of the word (and makes sense in the context) then you can't claim that it is an incorrect translation - at best, it's a matter of opinion.

When a king 'reigns over' a country, he is normally resident in that country, otherwise his rule would not be very effective. Even if you translate it as 'reign over', it doesn't necessarily follow that we shall be 'absentee' rulers.

Don't we pray for God's kingdom to come and His will to be done on earth, as well as in heaven? The heavenly reign is now, the earthly reign is to come.

 

[Ezra]

So we can see that those few small errors

have led many people into wrong interpretation of God`s word... [/quote]

Marilyn,

When someone is trying to determine which Bible is free from errors, and you come along and present your own imaginary errors, it does not help anyone.  The whole premise of rationalistic textual scholars (and their followers, the translators of the modern versions) was to falsely accuse the KJV translation of errors so that they could promote their *superior* Bibles to the public. 

But the whole idea of having 54 translators (which most people are not aware of) who were not only outstanding scholars, but also godly and devout men, was to ensure that the Authorized Version would be free from errors, and would be a faithful rendering of the Hebrew and Greek traditional texts. So for all those who may be misled about *errors* in the KJV, that is pure propaganda.

Your own error, which keeps coming up repeatedly, is to constantly talk about "the Body of Christ" and fail to reiterate that the Body of Christ is the Church, which is also the Bride of Christ, the Building of Christ, the Temple of God, and the Lamb's Wife.

What is the Church? Redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body, of which Christ is the Head. These are the saints referred to in Revelation and other places.

[SINNERSAVED]

https://www.blueletterbible.org/       is an excellent, free, online source of all these material and much more.

thank you that's great,

[Marilyn C]

Hi thereselittleflower, Deborah & Ezra,

We`ve all had our say, however to continue would take this thread off topic, so I will leave further discussion for the appropriate thread.

Marilyn.

[JohnD]

The limitations of the Word of God are due to the imperfections in human languages (communication and reception, processing and understanding). God subjected his perfect Word to these imperfections in order to save us.

Edited November 23, 2015 by JohnD

[Tiger Eye]

Hello ,Brothers and Sisters, I came across, what I find a stumbling block for many ,and me ,for as we know,

in truth of Gods word we believe that the bible is the whole word and truth of Gods inspired word ,for us to learn and teach and use as our guideline and ,to live a Godly life, we all agree with that,

But our Book of life, depending on the bible you are using, even the original King James version , from the niv, and others , we see that there is flaws in the interpretation of some words , which, has been used that are not adequate to the scripture and its body for reference and use of  a few words,

there is also missing scripture verses with in some of the NIV, and just the verse number, are there,  so I know for a fact ,that many are deceived by how we read and translate the scriptures to know Gods word, by the words used to describe key words , that makes all the difference in the world , in understanding  what we need to understand,

So because this is a obstical, we need to check it out, like the word hell, is in place of three other meanings , also like in the KJV, its states Giants, and in the NIV it says nephilims

so this brings us to learn the true meanings of words being translated to English, that could ,cause big problems when teaching or understanding what we need to learn

I still believe the bible to be Gods awesome ,and powerful words from him, and will not deny it, but we have to watch the few words ,that make all the difference in the world, so if there is any other words that are different or translated different meanings , please write them, down that would be great  and thank you all ,for your support and responses. 

Hi sinnersaved,

Bible flaws all seem to start with the King James Version.

Here we first found the entire Apocrypha.

The phrases like "the flight of the Phoenix" and words such as Easter and Calvary and many others.

The King James Version is more of an extension of the Latin Vulgate than any other protestant Bible I know of.

It is more like the Douay Bible than any other.

Now I'm not saying this is bad, but it does put a damper or those that push the King James Bible as being above the others.

I believe, as said before, that the Spirit of God will guide you into all truth, and any translation of the Bible will not prevent him from doing so.