If life is in the blood, does God allow blood transfusions ?

[Ezra]

18 minutes ago, SINNERSAVED said:

okay I get that, so if we die today , does our spirit go directly to him, or are we held waiting until he comes, or we are going to him as soon as we die and show up with him when he calls the ones that are alive,

I suggested that you study Acts 7 and 8, but chances are you did not, since you keep asking these questions. To sum up:

1. Before the resurrection all the righteous dead (souls and spirits) went to Sheol (Abraham s Bosom in Hades) awaiting Christ s resurrection.  The bodies *slept* in their graves.

2. Following the resurrection of Christ, some saints were resurrected, but we are not told of their whereabouts. The righteous dead went with Christ to Heaven (the New Jerusalem) directly from Sheol, and their spirits were perfected.

3. After the resurrection of Christ, the souls and spirits of the saints have been going directly to be with Christ and are indeed alive (e.g. Stephen in Acts 7). Their bodies *sleep* in their graves (e.g. Stephen in Acts 8) awaiting the Resurrection-Rapture of the Church.

4. At the Resurrection-Rapture of the Church, the saints who died will be resurrected and glorified (with their souls and spirits brought by Christ at that time, and joined to their bodies). The saints which are alive will be transformed, perfected, and glorified.  All the saints will then return with Christ to Heaven, following which there will be the Judgment Seat of Christ (for Christians only). Then there will be the Marriage of the Lamb, with the Church as the Bride, and Christ as the Bridegroom. 

[WilliamL]

10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

WHO are you talking to? If you have a question of me, ASK!

I am talking to everyone reading this topic. This is, after all, a public forum, to be used to educate everyone. Nothing private here.

10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

[1] you spout theological assumptions when you quote the words of YESHUA` HIMSELF in Luke 16! Y'know (or you SHOULD know), it's kinda hard to have "tongues," "fingers," have eyes for "seeing," or vocal folds for "speaking," or skin for "being tormented," etc. without a BODY!

[2] Yeshua` was speaking about the time of the General Resurrection, when all who are resurrected are brought before the Great White Throne for judgment!

1. There are various types of bodies, as the scriptures make clear. Your doctrines all derive out of the natural/carnal mind, and so you cannot grasp that in the higher realms, there are bodily forms not made of flesh. For example,

Psalm 104:4 [God] makes His angels spirits,
His ministers a flame of fire.

Ezek. 1:5 Also from within [the whirlwind] came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance: they had the likeness of a man. 6 Each one had four faces, and each one had four wings. 7 Their legs were straight, and the soles of their feet were like the soles of calves’ feet. They sparkled like the color of burnished bronze. 8 The hands of a man were under their wings on their four sides; and each of the four had faces and wings. 

2 Kings 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, “LORD, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” Then the LORD opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha.

Men have non-physical souls that have bodily forms, as well as non-physical spirits that have bodily forms. The bodily forms of Lazarus, the rich man, and Abraham in Hades were soul-forms. Under certain circumstances, these can manifest as ghosts on earth.

2. No, this could not possibly have been the time of the Great White Throne, because the rich man asked Abraham to send Lazarus back to his brothers to warn them -- something past the realm of possibility at the time of the GWT, as you should well know. Jesus put the whole story in the past tense, because it had already occurred while men still lived on earth.

The reason I speak to everyone, and not just to you, is to warn others against the soul-sleep doctrine that you teach.

[Retrobyter]

22 hours ago, Ezra said:

I suggested that you study Acts 7 and 8, but chances are you did not, since you keep asking these questions. To sum up:

1. Before the resurrection all the righteous dead (souls and spirits) went to Sheol (Abraham s Bosom in Hades) awaiting Christ s resurrection.  The bodies *slept* in their graves.

2. Following the resurrection of Christ, some saints were resurrected, but we are not told of their whereabouts. The righteous dead went with Christ to Heaven (the New Jerusalem) directly from Sheol, and their spirits were perfected.

3. After the resurrection of Christ, the souls and spirits of the saints have been going directly to be with Christ and are indeed alive (e.g. Stephen in Acts 7). Their bodies *sleep* in their graves (e.g. Stephen in Acts 8) awaiting the Resurrection-Rapture of the Church.

4. At the Resurrection-Rapture of the Church, the saints who died will be resurrected and glorified (with their souls and spirits brought by Christ at that time, and joined to their bodies). The saints which are alive will be transformed, perfected, and glorified.  All the saints will then return with Christ to Heaven, following which there will be the Judgment Seat of Christ (for Christians only). Then there will be the Marriage of the Lamb, with the Church as the Bride, and Christ as the Bridegroom. 

Shalom, Ezra.

LOL! Let's start with something that often goes unnoticed, ironically. You said, "All the saints will then return with Christ to Heaven, following which there will be the Judgment Seat of Christ (for Christians only)." Let's remember that "Christ" comes from the Greek word "Christos," which is a Greek translation of the Hebrew word "Mashiyach" which was also transliterated as "Messiah." Therefore, the "Judgment Seat of Christ" is the "Judgment Seat of the Messiah."

Now, take this to another level: What was a major occupation of the king of Israel? Let's investigate this:

1 Samuel 8:4-7, 22
4 Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together, and came to Samuel unto Ramah,
5 And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations.
6 But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the LORD.
7 And the LORD said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them.
...
22 And the LORD said to Samuel, Hearken unto their voice, and make them a king. And Samuel said unto the men of Israel, Go ye every man unto his city.
KJV

He then anointed Sha'uwl or "Saul," at God's prompting, in 1 Samuel 9. (Ironically, "Sha'uwl" comes from the same root word as "Sh'owl" or "Sheol," meaning "asked for.")

Later we read this about the next king, David:

2 Samuel 8:15
15 And David reigned over all Israel; and David executed judgment and justice unto all his people.
KJV

Fast-forward to 1 Kings, and the words of Shlomoh or Solomon:

1 Kings 3:7-14
7 And now, O LORD my God, thou hast made thy servant king instead of David my father: and I am but a little child: I know not how to go out or come in.
8 And thy servant is in the midst of thy people which thou hast chosen, a great people, that cannot be numbered nor counted for multitude.
9 Give therefore thy servant an understanding heart to judge thy people, that I may discern between good and bad: for who is able to judge this thy so great a people?
10 And the speech pleased the LORD, that Solomon had asked this thing.
11 And God said unto him, Because thou hast asked this thing, and hast not asked for thyself long life; neither hast asked riches for thyself, nor hast asked the life of thine enemies; but hast asked for thyself understanding to discern judgment;
12 Behold, I have done according to thy words: lo, I have given thee a wise and an understanding heart; so that there was none like thee before thee, neither after thee shall any arise like unto thee.
13 And I have also given thee that which thou hast not asked, both riches, and honour: so that there shall not be any among the kings like unto thee all thy days.
14 And if thou wilt walk in my ways, to keep my statutes and my commandments, as thy father David did walk, then I will lengthen thy days.
KJV

And, we are told about some of his judgment ability:

1 Kings 3:16-28
16 Then came there two women, that were harlots, unto the king, and stood before him.
17 And the one woman said, O my lord (Hebrew: adoniy, same as in Psalm 110:1, btw), I and this woman dwell in one house; and I was delivered of a child with her in the house.
18 And it came to pass the third day after that I was delivered, that this woman was delivered also: and we were together; there was no stranger with us in the house, save we two in the house.
19 And this woman's child died in the night; because she overlaid it.
20 And she arose at midnight, and took my son from beside me, while thine handmaid slept, and laid it in her bosom, and laid her dead child in my bosom.
21 And when I rose in the morning to give my child suck, behold, it was dead: but when I had considered it in the morning, behold, it was not my son, which I did bear.
22 And the other woman said, Nay; but the living is my son, and the dead is thy son. And this said, No; but the dead is thy son, and the living is my son. Thus they spake before the king.
23 Then said the king, The one saith, This is my son that liveth, and thy son is the dead: and the other saith, Nay; but thy son is the dead, and my son is the living.
24 And the king said, Bring me a sword. And they brought a sword before the king.
25 And the king said, Divide the living child in two, and give half to the one, and half to the other.
26 Then spake the woman whose the living child was unto the king, for her bowels yearned upon her son, and she said, O my lord (Hebrew: adoniy), give her the living child, and in no wise slay it. But the other said, Let it be neither mine nor thine, but divide it.
27 Then the king answered and said, Give her the living child, and in no wise slay it: she is the mother thereof.
28 And all Israel heard of the judgment which the king had judged; and they feared the king: for they saw that the wisdom of God was in him, to do judgment.
KJV

Now, let's fast-forward to the coming of the Messiah Yeshua`, the Messiah (Anointed One) to be KING:

John 5:19-30
19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
20 For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel.
21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.
22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
KJV

So, when the Scriptures say:

Romans 14:6-12
6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
KJV

1 Corinthians 6:2
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
KJV

2 Corinthians 5:10-11
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.
KJV

2 Timothy 4:1-2
1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
KJV

Hebrews 10:30-31
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
KJV

James 2:12-13
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.
KJV

it is the MESSIAH who reigns! Finally, for this set of reasoning, one should also include Revelation 20:

Revelation 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ (the Messiah) a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ (the Messiah), and shall reign with him a thousand years.
KJV

A mere 7 years? A mere 3.5 years? No, He shall reign on this earth, judging in all matters as Shlomoh did, for the last 1000 years of this age, and then FOREVER! Therefore, the "Judgment Seat of the Messiah will last MUCH LONGER than a THOUSAND YEARS!!!

And, don't forget Revelation 22:5:

Revelation 22:5
5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.
KJV

Oh, yes. And, just to "put the cherry on top," He shall reign and judge from earth, not some "Heaven!"

[Retrobyter]

13 hours ago, WilliamL said:

I am talking to everyone reading this topic. This is, after all, a public forum, to be used to educate everyone. Nothing private here.

1. There are various types of bodies, as the scriptures make clear. Your doctrines all derive out of the natural/carnal mind, and so you cannot grasp that in the higher realms, there are bodily forms not made of flesh. For example,

Psalm 104:4 [God] makes His angels spirits,
His ministers a flame of fire.

Ezek. 1:5 Also from within [the whirlwind] came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance: they had the likeness of a man. 6 Each one had four faces, and each one had four wings. 7 Their legs were straight, and the soles of their feet were like the soles of calves’ feet. They sparkled like the color of burnished bronze. 8 The hands of a man were under their wings on their four sides; and each of the four had faces and wings. 

2 Kings 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, “LORD, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” Then the LORD opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha.

Men have non-physical souls that have bodily forms, as well as non-physical spirits that have bodily forms. The bodily forms of Lazarus, the rich man, and Abraham in Hades were soul-forms. Under certain circumstances, these can manifest as ghosts on earth.

2. No, this could not possibly have been the time of the Great White Throne, because the rich man asked Abraham to send Lazarus back to his brothers to warn them -- something past the realm of possibility at the time of the GWT, as you should well know. Jesus put the whole story in the past tense, because it had already occurred while men still lived on earth.

The reason I speak to everyone, and not just to you, is to warn others against the soul-sleep doctrine that you teach.

Shalom, WilliamL.

OH, HO! So, you weren't addressing me at all; you were talking ABOUT me to others! Hmmm.... Sounds like gossip to me. You're right, though; being a public forum, at least you could not technically be talking BEHIND MY BACK! Although it makes me wonder if you wouldn't have had you had the chance.

You said, "1. There are various types of bodies, as the scriptures make clear. Your doctrines all derive out of the natural/carnal mind, and so you cannot grasp that in the higher realms, there are bodily forms not made of flesh. ... Men have non-physical souls that have bodily forms, as well as non-physical spirits that have bodily forms. The bodily forms of Lazarus, the rich man, and Abraham in Hades were soul-forms. Under certain circumstances, these can manifest as ghosts on earth."

You're just spouting rhetorical, "theological" assumptions without real Scriptural evidence. These passages prove nothing, because it's all a matter of how one reads them! They're all a matter of PERSPECTIVE!

Then, you said, "2. No, this could not possibly have been the time of the Great White Throne, because the rich man asked Abraham to send Lazarus back to his brothers to warn them -- something past the realm of possibility at the time of the GWT, as you should well know. Jesus put the whole story in the past tense, because it had already occurred while men still lived on earth." But, you DON'T KNOW THAT! Indeed, isn't it possible that He DID know that they were in the past and believed that an Almighty God could send one back, like He sent images of the future back to the prophets?

You can "warn" them, if you so choose. All I'm doing is offering a BETTER interpretation of Scripture based on the words of Scripture and the verses that contain those words.

[Retrobyter]

23 hours ago, SINNERSAVED said:

okay I get that, so if we die today , does our spirit go directly to him, or are we held waiting until he comes, or we are going to him as soon as we die and show up with him when he calls the ones that are alive, I am trying to see what the scripture is talking about in timing and what takes place, for I read that the non believer will all be raised and the end to face judgment so they are staying some where or hades or grave , this is what I am asking to get a clear and better understanding , thank you very much for the info, so can you give me what you believe is or happens as soon as you die a believer,  for many are saying we go to God immediately, but if we do , when the dead in Christ is raised first on the call , then we cannot be there yet, ?

 sorry but this is the best way to try to ask on this. thank you

I believe, according to the Scriptures, that we wait. BUT, if we don't and some "non-physical" part of us goes to "Heaven," it goes to the New Jerusalem. And, being without body (which is to say without ourselves [???}), then we are "disembodied spirits" and could not enjoy the New Jerusalem, anyway! We would be longing for our bodies! "How long, O Lord?"

No, the active need of everyone who dies is the RESURRECTION, not some mythical place called "Heaven."

[WilliamL]

1 Cor. 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

[simplejeff]

On March 12, 2016 at 4:34 AM, Esther4:14 said:

I don't know Jeff, healing made a pretty big impact.  Most of the people were exposed to the message of the Gospel through healing.  

 

I don't know if it was "through" healing, per se.  Salvation = Healing.  and the Gospel was ALWAYS accompanied /one with/ healing IN JESUS NAME. 

Still is, btw.

[Ezra]

17 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

No, the active need of everyone who dies is the RESURRECTION, not some mythical place called "Heaven."

If Heaven is a "mythical place", why do you bother with the Bible, or resurrection, or anything else pertaining to the Gospel?

[Retrobyter]

6 hours ago, WilliamL said:

1 Cor. 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Isn't it amazing how many things - whatever we don't like - we can throw these Scriptures at? All we have to do is say that <whatever> is "carnal teaching" and what WE believe is "spurtual!" (And, YES; I spelled it wrong on purpose because that's how some people say the word!), and VOILA! Instantly the verses "apply!"

[simplejeff]

that's why Yahweh gives as a gift , discernment.   to a few, born again of Him from heaven.

the natural man is the normal, everyday, crowd, everywhere man, the regular pew warmer in buildings with pews,

held in place by unspeakable things and doesn't even know it.

the redeemed man goes outside the gates with Jesus, to suffer with Him, as it is written.