election/freewill- GOT IT !!!!

[simplejeff]

Correct.    There is nothing good nor profitable in the flesh,  no reason YHWH should care about us, except HE CHOSE TO - HE DELIGHTS IN US !!!!!!!!!!!

On 3/29/2017 at 10:46 PM, woundeddog said:

I don't think anywhere in the Bible it says there is any innate "Good" in us-

 

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YHWH grants wisdom in CHRIST JESUS, and understanding,  same as HE did in the first century to the first disciples.  YHWH and Y'SHUA never changed.
" Then opened HE their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,"

HE gave the disciples understanding BEFORE HE put them to work for the GOSPEL'S SAKE.

On 3/29/2017 at 11:30 PM, woundeddog said:

Yowm-- come on-- if I fully understood this Id be up there with the Lord-- this is the best I can do with my old mind--- lol

 

On 3/30/2017 at 3:43 AM, ghtan said:

I find it easier to think that all who are in Christ are chosen/elect. But it is our choice whether we want to be in Christ, hence the freewill.

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Yes,  everyone chooses, at some (or many) points in their lives,  who they serve.  YHWH or the devil.

Most everywhere refuse(same as Pharoah) to turn to YHWH,  to stop serving demons, so they PERISH, like Pharoah..

On 3/30/2017 at 6:51 AM, ghtan said:

Everyone has a choice. Even Pharoah did. He chose to oppose God.......

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Yes.  YHWH'S chosen people are still YHWH'S chosen people.  YHWH blesses whoever blesses them(us),  and YHWH curses whoever curses them(us) or seeks our harm.  This never changes.

On 3/30/2017 at 7:53 AM, warrior12 said:

This is a profound statement from the Lord.  Maybe, i am not interpreting it correctly.  Explain to me these words.

Exodus 9King James Version (KJV)

¹⁶ And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.

 

I also see in the OT, that the Lord had CHOSEN, Isarel as his people and told them when they go into the promise Land, they were to wipe out the Philistines and other pagan tribes there.  Was not this God choosing directly a people for himself ?.    It is the pattern here i am looking at.   

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Some Egyptians (foreignors not originally of nor with Israel) and other nationalities went with the Israelites.

They trusted and believed in YHWH ,  in the ONE TRUE GOD of the Israelites,  and were saved as YHWH directed.

 

On 3/30/2017 at 7:54 PM, ghtan said:

............

As for Israel, God chose the nation, not individual Israelites. Those who belong to (spiritual) Israel - were saved. The choice to belong was up to every Israelite. Some chose to opt out - e.g. those who started worshiping idols instead - whereas some non-Israelites, e.g. Ruth, chose to opt in. Same today, God chooses (elect) the group who follows Christ to be saved. Whether we choose (freewill) to be in that group is up to each of us.

There has not been a group, per se,  saved by YHWH since Y'SHUA'S ascension.  

Also not one person here, one there,  to remain as if one alone.   No, rather,  all part of a body, as YHWH raises up as HE desires,  and fits the "LIVING STONES" together (very remarkable!) ...  Members of ONE BODY (not one group) who willingly and joyously give their lives to YHWH as living sacrifices for YHWH to do with as HE PLEASES,

then who willingly and joyously die to self and to the world, and

who willingly and joyously lay down their lives for others.  No large groups anywhere that I know of ever did this since the ascension.   (thousands may seem large,  but compared to those who denied CHRIST and oppose HIM, not many)

[FresnoJoe]

On 3/29/2017 at 2:36 PM, Neighbor said:

About as good an explanation as any I have read....
I just state that I am a freewill Calvinist....

and let the other ducks in the pond quack....
and shake their tail feathers....

Quack

Seek the Lord while he may be found; call on him while he is near. Let the wicked forsake their ways and the unrighteous their thoughts. Let them turn to the Lord, and he will have mercy on them, and to our God, for he will freely pardon.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways,”

Quack

But you must not forget this one thing, dear friends: A day is like a thousand years to the Lord, and a thousand years is like a day. The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent. But the day of the Lord will come as unexpectedly as a thief. Then the heavens will pass away with a terrible noise, and the very elements themselves will disappear in fire, and the earth and everything on it will be found to deserve judgment. Isaiah 55:6-8 (New International Version) 2 Peter 3:8-10

Shake

No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man. And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.  “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. John 3:13-16 (English Standard Version)

Shake

“I, Jesus, have sent My angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the bright Morning Star.”

The Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” Let the one who hears say, “Come!” And let the one who is thirsty come, and the one who desires the water of life drink freely. Revelation 22:16-17

~

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:
The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27 (King James Bible)

Love, Your Brother Joe

~

Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. Psalms 119:160 (King James Bible)

The Bible contains the mind of God, the state of man, the way of salvation, the doom of sinners, and the happiness of believers. Its doctrines are holy, its precepts are binding, its histories are true, and its decisions are immutable.

Read it to be wise, believe it to be safe, and practice it to be holy. It contains light to direct you, food to support you, and comfort to cheer you.

It is the traveler’s map, the pilgrim’s staff, the pilot’s compass, the soldier’s sword and the Christian’s charter. Here too, Heaven is opened and the gates of Hell disclosed.

Christ is its grand subject, our good its design, and the glory of God its end. It should fill the memory, rule the heart and guide the feet. Read it slowly, frequently and prayerfully.  It is a mine of wealth, a paradise of glory, and a river of pleasure.

It is given you in life, will be opened at the judgment, and be remembered forever. It involves the highest responsibility, rewards the greatest labor, and will condemn all who trifle with its sacred contents.

From The Inside Of My Gideon New Testament

[warrior12]

9 hours ago, ghtan said:

Moses' Israelites worshiped golden calf (freewill). Pharoah's Egypt opposed God (freewill). Both deserved punishment. God chooses (elect) to have mercy on Israelites but to harden Egyptians (sovereignty).

Hi ghtan.  I like you line of reasoning and this discussion for me is very interesting.    But clarify for me a term being used here and what exactly does it mean and in the context of God sovereign plan of salvation.  The word "election".    So let' take a 360 degrees pie chart as a measure or reference.  Are all people ever born elected or is there a portion of that chart that will never be elected .     Are there some that will be elected from that chart, but in that election, has the choice to choose to be faithful to God or the free will to reject him.   Let me hear yours   thoughts on  this.    

[ghtan]

20 hours ago, warrior12 said:

Hi ghtan.  I like you line of reasoning and this discussion for me is very interesting.    But clarify for me a term being used here and what exactly does it mean and in the context of God sovereign plan of salvation.  The word "election".    So let' take a 360 degrees pie chart as a measure or reference.  Are all people ever born elected or is there a portion of that chart that will never be elected .     Are there some that will be elected from that chart, but in that election, has the choice to choose to be faithful to God or the free will to reject him.   Let me hear yours   thoughts on  this.    

Hi warrior. I think of election in general terms i.e. it simply means 'choice' or 'choosing'. It can be for a variety of things e.g. privilege, service. But with salvation I don't believe God chose beforehand (i.e. from eternity past as it is usually argued) whether a person should be saved. God's desire is for everyone to be saved. God makes the offer of salvation. We decide whether to accept that offer; it is resistible.