Why I am a Post-Millennialist

[Guest shiloh357]

12 minutes ago, Limey_Bob said:

Exactly, his present rule (since the ascension until his second coming) is spiritual in heaven and is NOT UPON THIS EARTH SITTING ON SOME THRONE IN JERUSALEM. However, Christ will return to this earth and when he does, then the rule (reign / kingdom of God) will be literal, physical and he will literally rule from a throne in Jerusalem over some physical geographic locality. The trouble is that we are using the word "kingdom" in one way, i.e. that it is currently spiritual, and in heaven, whilst most people in this forum being American Fundamentalists understand the word "kingdom" as only referring to a physical, literal geographic rule of Christ from the city of Jerusalem. So when I explain that to me the "kingdom" is currently spiritual and in heaven and it is not some literal geographic location upon this earth, they look incredulously at me, as to them you cannot have a spiritual kingdom in heaven, a kingdom must always be literal and physical and geographic upon this earth. So they are not allowing me to define my own terms, as it happens Robert Redmond in his reference book:   "New Systematic Theology of the Christian faith" on page 990, footnote 18 confirms this interpretation of mine, that the "Kingdom of Heaven / Kingdom of God," both terms being fully interchangeable: "refers primarily to the reign, dominion or rule of God, and only secondarily to the realm over which his reign is exercised."

 

So when does that physical reign start and how does it relate to the 1,000 years of Rev. 20:4?

[Limey_Bob]

Just now, shiloh357 said:

So when does that physical reign start and how does it relate to the 1,000 years of Rev. 20:4?

The Physical reign starts when the spiritual reign ends (this is a great and intelligent question by the way), that will happen at the second coming.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 minute ago, Limey_Bob said:

The Physical reign starts when the spiritual reign ends (this is a great and intelligent question by the way), that will happen at the second coming.

But how does that relate to the 1,000 year of Revelation 20:4?  Where do the 1,000 years fit in?

[Limey_Bob]

22 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

But how does that relate to the 1,000 year of Revelation 20:4?  Where do the 1,000 years fit in?

The 1,000 year reign is a spiritual reign in heaven, it is NOT geographic or a physical location, as in Christ’s eternal reign from Jerusalem after the second coming and in eternity, notice Revelation 20:4: "SOULS" are said to be presently reigning with Christ, but as the throne of God is set in heaven, then this must be a spiritual and heavenly reign: “At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it” (Revelation 4:2). The phrase "a thousand years" is used six times, and I believe that this refers to the entire period of Church History, four times one thousand equals four thousand years from Adam to Christ. Whilst at verses 20:4 and 20:6 this phrase "a thousand years" is linked to the throne of God (which is in heaven), so 1,000 plus 1,000 equals 2,000 years, which I believe is the period of Church history from the ascension unto the second coming.

Edited April 4, 2017 by Limey_Bob

[Marcus O'Reillius]

On ‎4‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 6:45 AM, Limey_Bob said:

Thank you for your patience with me.

Excuse the glitch in the programing here.  I did not "quote" you.  It simply inserts itself sometimes when I hit the reply button.

My first question has to do with the Millennium period from a Pre-Millennial perspective that is rejected by Amillennialists and Post-Millennialists because it conflicts with their tried and true prescriptions for Salvation in the Church Age whereby we all are granted one prize (the single denarius given to those who work the field no matter how long): eternal life.

What is faith?

This will lead to my second question, but only after you answer the first.  After reading your post above, I have a third question for you, but it can wait its turn.

[Limey_Bob]

21 hours ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

Excuse the glitch in the programing here.  I did not "quote" you.  It simply inserts itself sometimes when I hit the reply button.

My first question has to do with the Millennium period from a Pre-Millennial perspective that is rejected by Amillennialists and Post-Millennialists because it conflicts with their tried and true prescriptions for Salvation in the Church Age whereby we all are granted one prize (the single denarius given to those who work the field no matter how long): eternal life.

What is faith?

This will lead to my second question, but only after you answer the first.  After reading your post above, I have a third question for you, but it can wait its turn.

Marcus, I think that your question is for me? I am still getting used to these forums. Faith is basically trust and more than that, it's acting upon that trust. In the Christian faith, our faith (trust) is in Jesus Christ as he is the messiah, the saviour, who died and rose again for our sins. Christ saves us by a covenant, which he made with his Father, and which is mediated by the Holy Spirit (Hebrews 9:13-15). A covenant needs two parties, the old covenant was between God and man, the latter of whom always failed in keeping his or her part of the covenant, so that is why the Old Covenant failed. In the New Covenant, Christ being fully God and fully man, the covenant is still between God and man (ie. Father and Christ who is a man), but now this New Covenant will never be broken, as Christ keeps it perfectly, also as Christ is also fully God, his sacrifice on the cross, death and resurrection from the dead is of infinite worth, and thus his death can and does secure the salvation of millions, because it is of infinite value. My faith is in this, I trust Christ as my saviour that through his covenant with the Father, he has secured the salvation of me and millions of other sinners just like me.

[Limey_Bob]

21 hours ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

Excuse the glitch in the programing here.  I did not "quote" you.  It simply inserts itself sometimes when I hit the reply button.

My first question has to do with the Millennium period from a Pre-Millennial perspective that is rejected by Amillennialists and Post-Millennialists because it conflicts with their tried and true prescriptions for Salvation in the Church Age whereby we all are granted one prize (the single denarius given to those who work the field no matter how long): eternal life.

What is faith?

This will lead to my second question, but only after you answer the first.  After reading your post above, I have a third question for you, but it can wait its turn.

Marcus, I am not really keen to go off topic. This thread is on eschatology sir.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

2 hours ago, Limey_Bob said:

Marcus, I am not really keen to go off topic. This thread is on eschatology sir.

And on eschatology it will go... but theology is as much a part of eschatology as it is any thing related to God.

[Limey_Bob]

1 hour ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

And on eschatology it will go... but theology is as much a part of eschatology as it is any thing related to God.

OK well with regard to eschatology, the rule is to use the clearer (new Testament passages), to interpret the less clear (old Testament passages), and not the other way around, otherwise we can make the Bible appear to mean almost anything.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Limey_Bob

[Marcus O'Reillius]

On the question: What is faith?

3 hours ago, Limey_Bob said:

Faith is basically trust and more than that, it's acting upon that trust. In the Christian faith, our faith (trust) is in Jesus Christ as he is the messiah, the saviour, who died and rose again for our sins. Christ saves us by a covenant, which he made with his Father, and which is mediated by the Holy Spirit (Hebrews 9:13-15).

Essentially faith is a belief in facts.

We believe the facts set forth in the New Testament concerning Jesus.

We believe Jesus, then, is the Messiah.

Now, if Jesus were before us, in person, would change?  What if He proved He was not only the Servant Messiah, but also the Messiah King?