Is Maryology Idolatry?

[wingnut-]

10 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Because the discussion is in Mariology 

 

 

 

Then discuss Maryology from your JW position and stop misrepresenting catholocism whilst casting false accusations against others.

[wingnut-]

7 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Who said I was JW? Perhaps its best you not mischaracterize??? Seems to be the theme in this thread

The only people who has been misrepresenting what the Catholics believe is from you guys.....unless you can post libks directly feom the Vatican that mary is mediator between God the father and man.....good luck with that!!

 

I said you are arguing a JW position.  And again, catholics acknowledge Jesus as God, thereby placing a mediator between the two by involving Mary.  I am well aware of both belief systems, and would prefer if you simply argue your own beliefs and stop muddying the waters.  You continue to specifically state God the Father in your argument, which you are doing because you don't acknowledge God the Son, and that is a JW position.  You may not be a JW, but that is the basis of your argument.

 

[wingnut-]

20 minutes ago, inchrist said:

You turning this into about me, while im flattered, you're masking the inability of actually providing support for your accusation that catholics hold mary as mediator between man and father.....yet I have asked everyone here for this evidence, and you can not provide it.

 

 

Again, God the Father.  There is an easier way to get to the truth.  Who is Jesus to you?

[wingnut-]

7 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Wingnut this thread is called "Is Maryology Idolatry".....not who is Jesus to inchrist?

 

I expected as much.  As you should recall from previous discussions, I am not interested in your circular arguments.  The wheels on the bus go 'round and 'round, and the nut wants no part of it.

God bless

[BobRyan]

On 5/5/2017 at 5:00 PM, inchrist said:

You might also consider the prophecy Of Luke 1:46-48

Quote:

 all generations will call me blessed (Mary)[/quote]

My point is not that we should be saying bad things about Mary or that we should not regard her as having been blessed to be chosen as the mother of Christ.

But the Bible never calls her the "mother of God" - because in fact God is from eternity past - is eternal , has no mother, and this is NOT a case of procreation which has a mother but rather "incarnation" of an already EXISTING person.

 

And then of course the one-and-only time someone tried the "blessed be Mary for being the mother of Jesus" proposal on Him. His response starts with "on the contrary".

But He said, "On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the word of God and observe it."  - Luke 11:28

Quote

The translation of "On the contrary" is a faulty one.

The accurate translation was "Yes, and additionally".[/quote]

 the translations are consistent. Christ is not denying any blessing to Mary only that believing on him and obeying him is a greater blessing.

 

Young's Literal Translation

²⁷ And it came to pass, in his saying these things, a certain woman having lifted up the voice out of the multitude, said to him, `Happy the womb that carried thee, and the paps that thou didst suck!'

²⁸ And he said, `Yea, rather, happy those hearing the word of God, and keeping [it]!'

 

New King James

²⁷ And it happened, as He spoke these things, that a certain woman from the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”

²⁸ But He said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the word of God and keep it!”

 

KJV

²⁸ But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.

 

Holeman

²⁸ He said, “Even more, those who hear the word of God and keep it are blessed!”

 

NASB

²⁷ While Jesus was saying these things, one of the women in the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You and the breasts at which You nursed.” ²⁸ But He said, “On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the word of God and observe it.”

Edited May 7, 2017 by BobRyan

[BobRyan]

On 5/5/2017 at 5:00 PM, inchrist said:

Quote

BobRyan said

Mary is not in Rev 12  

 

Oh did Mary not give birth to Christ?

[

 

1. God the Son was incarnated as Jesus - not procreated. Incarnation is very different from procreation

2. Christ said to the Samaritan woman "Salvation is of the JEW" John 4. Not "salvation is of Mary". The Bible attributes this birth of Christ in John 4 and in Rev 12 (also written by John) to the Jewish nation church. The Church of God in the OT and then in Rev 12 shows how that church is persecuted after the ascension of Christ for 1260 years in the dark ages that follow.

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by BobRyan

[BobRyan]

On 5/5/2017 at 5:00 PM, inchrist said:

Quote

BobRyan said

 Communion with the Dead -- CCC 958 is what they claim. Isaiah 8:19 forbids it. The Bible does not allow Christians to go to the dead "on behalf of the living

 

Quote

When you prasie God you are praising in communion?

Again the word in Isaiah is consult

When you ask someone to pray for you, you are not consulting with that person you are praying with that person.

Catholics do not sit around in a circle holding hands and conjuring up spirits and asking for advise on a one on one consultation with the spirit.

The text says that the living should not go to the dead for requests on behalf of the living.

¹⁹ And when they say to you, “Seek those who are mediums and wizards, who whisper and mutter,” should not a people seek their God? Should they seek the dead on behalf of the living? (NKJV)

¹⁹ And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?(KJV)

¹⁹ When they say to you, “Consult the mediums and the spiritists who whisper and mutter,” should not a people consult their God? Should they consult the dead on behalf of the living? (NASB)

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by BobRyan

[BobRyan]

On 5/5/2017 at 5:00 PM, inchrist said:

Quote

BobRyan said (Regarding the Psalms)

That text refers to no dead beings only the living. David does not say that any of the beings listed are "dead" or even "Dead in Christ" the way that Paul says about the saints that have died in 1Thess 4. So then we could insert it, via bold inference, but it is not in the text explicitly.

Well then we must conclude that the dead saints are not hosted in Heaven.

 

On the contrary - 1 Thess 4 says that they are the "Dead in Christ" and "those who have fallen asleep in Jesus" that Christ "brings with him" at the 2nd coming for the resurrection of the saints.

In heaven - but dormant.

⁷ then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it. Eccl 12:7

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by BobRyan

[TheMatrixHasU71]

On 5/6/2017 at 0:23 PM, inchrist said:

True spirit filled Christians no better than to bear false witness (Exodus 20:16)

 

It is YOU and Catholics who believe in the lies of the RCC who are bearing false witness not genuine believers who will have nothing to do with the blasphemy of putting a created dead woman on par with her creator.

[TheMatrixHasU71]

On 5/6/2017 at 11:28 AM, inchrist said:

What is a fact is the Catholic view Mary as co-mediator between man and Jesus not between man and God the Father

SCRIPTURE PROOF PLEASE.

Twisting words again. 2+2=5. You cant justify your stance this way. There is no CO-anything with Mary. There is no mediator between man and Jesus. Even when we ask someone here on earth to pray for us and with us, that means just that. Praying with us is not in a mediatorial context. WE cannot mediate for anyone, neither can a dead woman. Jesus Christ is our only mediator. A Mediator is like a defense lawyer. Actually it IS pretty much. That is not our function, or Mary's.

Edited May 8, 2017 by TheMatrixHasU71