Does the Spirit always remain in the born-again believer?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, ZacharyB said:

'Tis not God who breaks covenants ... 'tis man.

I'll send you a Bible, and then you can read about the covenants God made with His "chosen people"

... and what happened. It's interesting reading!

News Flash! - There are many parallels between God's chosen people in the OT and in the NT.

News Flash!! I probably know the Bible better than you. Please don't try and insult me. It is against the TOS.

[Willa]

 Rom 6:23  NKJV For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

 Rom 5:15  But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man's offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many.

I am not sure at what point a person is sealed by the Holy Spirit or born again.  Those who don't receive or understand God's word are probably not born again. Genuine faith is based on God's word.  

We are told that those who produce good fruit that remains are saved.  And those who do not produce good fruit will be cut off and burned.  There are those who don't withstand trials and prove not to be true believers.  There are those who have the fruit choked out by the world and the cares of this life and bring no fruit to maturity.  It shows that they have not made God the center that their lives revolve around.  He is just an added interest.  That is why we are warned in Hebrews to not neglect so great a salvation.  God and His word must be of paramount importance to us, our first love, for us to produce good fruit to maturity.  We must remain attached to the Vine to produce fruit.  

God knows who are truly His from the beginning.  The condition rests on Him   Like the Abrahamic covenant in which he put Abe to sleep and walked between the halves of the sacrifice alone, Our covenant also depends on God.  It does not depend on our works.  Our works are produced by our salvation, by the life of Jesus in us.  

We know in our hearts that we belong to God by the Holy Spirit within us crying ABBA!. Daddy!  But as far as others are concerned, we will know them by their fruit.  

 

The statement that every branch is a born again believer may be false.  It may be a tare if does not bear good and lasting fruit.  It may be a dead branch.  It may be a graft that didn't "take".  

[Behold]

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The HSpirit is in a believer exactly the same way a believer is "in Christ".  And this is the  reason a believer is currently reading this, yet is also "seated in heavenly places".

A Believer has a duel existence, as we are both in an earth suit confined by time within the natural realm, YET< , we are also become Children of Light, and our Father is the Father of Lights with Jesus being the MAIN "Light of the World",  and we are now a living breathing part of a living and literal spiritual kingdom.

Each individual believer is a part of "the body of Christ", and God's spirit dwells within US.

Another way the NT clarifies the literal manifestation of both "Christ in you the hope of Glory" and us being "in Christ", is by the scripture that says that  (we the born again)  are bone of Christ's bones and flesh of Christ's flesh in Ephesians 5:30

This "One-ness with God and Christ" is so connected, so completed that it is described in Genesis 2:23., and is the defining principle that truthfully and exactly defines and proves OSAS.

And remember that Jesus said....."if you've done this to the least of these (mine), then you've done it to ME". = we are "ONE" in Him.

So, yes, we are One with God and Christ, and the Holy Spirit is forever a part of us, and our NT tells us that "if we have not the Spirit of God then we are NONE OF HIS".

Edited April 10, 2017 by Behold

[kwikphilly]

Quote

“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father,

and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever —

the Spirit of truth … you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 

… you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. 

He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me.

And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and

manifest Myself to him … If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word;

and My Father will love him, and We will come to him

and make Our home with him.” (John 14:15-23)

Thats it Bro Zach........IF.....biggest & loudest Word in the entire Bible                                                With love-in Christ,Kwik

[Jeff2]

3 hours ago, Behold said:

This "One-ness with God and Christ" is so connected, so completed that it is described in Genesis 2:23., and is the defining principle that truthfully and exactly defines and proves OSAS.

And in the very next chapter, God says that OSAS is the original lie of the devil. Gen. 3:3, "but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God said, "You shall not eat from it or touch it, lest you die." Verse 4, "And the serpent said to the woman, "You surely shall not die! OSAS is certainly proved to be the very doctrine of the devil that Adam and Eve believed. The sin-and-win teaching of today is no different.   

[enoob57]

Paul used the word adoption here

Romans 8:15 (KJV)

[15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

[16] The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

[17] And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

[18] For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

[19] For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

At this time contextually everyone had been under Roman rule quite some time and adoption could not be reversed and the readers would have understood this in the letter Paul wrote... this is the study to show oneself approved a workman that need not be ashamed!
 

[Danger Noodle]

2 hours ago, Jeff2 said:

And in the very next chapter, God says that OSAS is the original lie of the devil. Gen. 3:3, "but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God said, "You shall not eat from it or touch it, lest you die." Verse 4, "And the serpent said to the woman, "You surely shall not die! OSAS is certainly proved to be the very doctrine of the devil that Adam and Eve believed. The sin-and-win teaching of today is no different.   

I don't believe you're reading those scriptures correctly. Eternal salvation is the grace of God and the sacrifice for which Jesus died to insure. 

 

John 10:27-30 "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”

[Jeff2]

I don't believe you're reading those scriptures correctly. 

Well, they say what they say. The devil's doctrine is alive and well today!

BTW, John 10 that you quote is a conditional clause. Only those that (present tense) hear and (present tense) follow are the Sheep. If one does not continue to hear and follow, they are not His sheep. Jesus says so.  

 

[Danger Noodle]

10 hours ago, Jeff2 said:

I don't believe you're reading those scriptures correctly. 

Well, they say what they say. The devil's doctrine is alive and well today!

BTW, John 10 that you quote is a conditional clause. Only those that (present tense) hear and (present tense) follow are the Sheep. If one does not continue to hear and follow, they are not His sheep. Jesus says so.  

 

No it is not a conditional clause.  It is a certain fact of God the Father's grace through the sacrifice of his only begotten son Jesus Christ. Jesus tells us no one comes to him but the Father calls them. And those whom he called had their names written in the Lamb's book of life before Father created the world. God doesn't use White-Out. Those names blotted out of the book are spoken of in scripture because God's foreknowledge knew those whom would not be in the book because they would not hearken unto the truth of God through Christ.

Jesus did not die on the cross to assure the worlds people tentative salvation and temporary life. 

[enoob57]

If anyone base their salvation on themselves as to ability to perform saving effort >their lost< and will not make it as these

Matthew 7:22 (KJV)

[22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

[23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

because they were relying on their works... their taking of that set out for burning and expecting eternal significance! The world's cursed and filled with sinners so you really think you can manipulate that which is here and gain eternal life with it ... wake up and know when the Son was begging The Father in prayer in the garden with His Own Blood flow for another way-> there was none and He alone 'The Perfect Sacrifice' was sent by The Father to the cross... throw the necessity of works in this and you loose the whole point of salvation that is shown, written, and known by His born of Him.... Love, Steven