Paul's authority

[Absolem]

I admire Paul's letters greatly.

[BobRyan]

On 5/17/2017 at 7:53 PM, creativemechanic said:

Im confused about something.  Why do people dismiss Paul's letters as biblical  authority about issues . Thats basically contradicting 2 Timothy 3.16. God's word  is absolute.  Only exception being aspects of the old covenant which was explained as having passed away. When people do this its basically  rebellion to parts f Gods word they don't like

Who does that?

[BobRyan]

26 minutes ago, Davida said:

Just read Paul what he teaches & note the issues it touches upon & look at who , what groups make all sorts of human rationale for dismissing his teachings. For eg. those who reject that God made Adam & Eve to fulfill different roles as husband & wife & in the Church. It is just human rebellion against God & those the Lord appointed. These people want to make God into their own image and there are many.

Ok so then we have the LGBT affiliated Christians, the Muslims.. two groups that would tend to reject Paul.

[notsolostsoul]

On Saturday, May 20, 2017 at 8:33 AM, Davida said:

Not really Bob, Christians is who is referred to in this thread.

Agreed. 

I don't think People are denouncing Paul's authority. 

The scriptures they are disputing are Timothy 1 and 2 and Titus.

These are not just being disputed by individuals but have been debated on for quite some time by the very authorities that decided what books should be in the bible.

At least from the information I have found.

They are debating that these were not written by Paul directly but given as advice to how a church should be organized. Since Timothy was running his churches.

Other factors to consider are context. Who wrote it, why it was written, who it was addressing and the era it was written in. 

Also some of the teachings are not in one accord with Jesus' teachings.

Example: Men and Women are equal in Christ -Jesus teaching written by Paul.

Then Women can only be saved by childbearing and succumbing to their husbands-Timothy's writings.

It has been a long debate.

This is where I choose to go with Jesus, directly in scripture and The Holy Spirit.

 

Edited May 21, 2017 by notsolostsoul

[notsolostsoul]

2 minutes ago, Davida said:

I disagree , in my view and understanding of the Bible , to oppose Paul - Is to Not be in Accord with JESUS and His teachings. Those who do that , show they don't understand Jesus or His message and they do not understand Paul's writings either.  The Lord Jesus Christ conscripted for HIS ministry -  Saul of Tarsus on the Road to Damascus and HE  Appointed Paul to SERVE HIM.  Did Jesus not know who Paul was and what He would write that would become part of the NT?  That seems silly to me.  Jesus is the Son of God, the second person in the Holy Trinity.  If we read that  JESUS who knew Nathaniel was sitting by a tree and that their was no guile in him - of course Knew everything Paul would say and was the HOLY SPIRIT that Paul was bond slave to. Jesus is the CHRIST the Son of GOD who is ONE with GOD the Father.  John 1:47 "47When Jesus saw Nathanael approaching, He said of him, “Here is a true Israelite, in whom there is no deceit.” 48“How do You know me?” Nathanael asked. Jesus replied, “Before Philip called you, I saw you under the fig tree.”…Get where I'm going with this?

The parts of the Pauline Letters that are in dispute were not written by Paul.

Just an example to think on.

If the disciples had trouble understanding Jesus' teachings and parables, and needed more of a direct explanation from Jesus himself. Why would someone be so accepting of information given to a follower of a disciple without comparing it or testing it against the direct teachings of Christ. Some of it don't even line up with Paul's other teachings.

My Spirit tells me go with Jesus and Paul's teachings of Jesus. Not a third party where things may be misconstrued.

Isn't this why Jesus gave us the grace to go to God individually.

Past scripture, Old Testament has taught us Man can misrepresent scripture but Jesus, The Holy Spirit and God are the Word.

[Guest shiloh357]

6 minutes ago, notsolostsoul said:

The parts of the Pauline Letters that are in dispute were not written by Paul.

All of the epistles in the NT that bear Paul's name were written by Paul.

 

Quote

If the disciples had trouble understanding Jesus' teachings and parables, and needed more of a direct explanation from Jesus himself. Why would someone be so accepting of information given to a follower of a disciple without comparing it or testing it against the direct teachings of Christ. Some of it don't even line up with Paul's other teachings.

There is nothing contradictory about what Paul taught and what Jesus taught. 

Quote

 

My Spirit tells me go with Jesus and Paul's teachings of Jesus. Not a third party where things may be misconstrued.

Isn't this why Jesus gave us the grace to go to God individually.

 

No, we can go to God directly because of Jesus' sacrifice on the cross.   He made the way for man to be able go to God without a human priest or human mediator. 

We need to go with the WHOLE Scripture, all 66 books.  They all come from God and are inspired by Him.

[notsolostsoul]

Just now, Davida said:

Don't listen to "your spirit" any "spirit"  that teaches confusion & contrary to the Word of God is not of the Holy Spirit . 

I can say the same to you. 

I am not disputing your beliefs. It is not my place to tell anyone how to have their relationship with God. 

I was just sharing info I have come across and my way of my relationship with God.

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, notsolostsoul said:

I can say the same to you. 

I am not disputing your beliefs. It is not my place to tell anyone how to have their relationship with God. 

I was just sharing info I have come across and my way of my relationship with God.

Well, we are disputing your beliefs, and they are contrary to God's word and are not fruit of any relationship with God as God doesn't promote confusion over His Word.

[notsolostsoul]

1 minute ago, shiloh357 said:

Well, we are disputing your beliefs, and they are contrary to God's word and are not fruit of any relationship with God as God doesn't promote confusion over His Word.

Only God can tell me his Word. Not Man. Nor can Man determine my relationship with God. 

As stated before the information is what has been debated by the very authorities that approved the books in the bible. This is not of my doing.

I was simply sharing the information. Addressing the OP that is all. No confusion.

 

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, notsolostsoul said:

Only God can tell me his Word. Not Man. Nor can Man determine my relationship with God. 

 

God has given us His word.   The Bible is God's Word, all of it. 
 

Quote

 

As stated before the information is what has been debated by the very authorities that approved the books in the bible. This is not of my doing.

I was simply sharing the information. Addressing the OP that is all. No confusion.

 

Do you dispute that the Bible is 100% God's Word to mankind?