Oneness or Trinity?

[Jesus_Freak_2003]

On 11/3/2017 at 11:18 PM, missmuffet said:

I do not agree. That is not biblical. God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Three persons one God.

Those are titles... God started out as a spirit (the holy spirit), then he created Adam and Eve and took up the title of father, and then we he came to Earth as man he took on the title of father.

 

[Jesus_Freak_2003]

On 11/3/2017 at 12:06 AM, missmuffet said:

Oneness Pentecostal also do not believe in the Holy Trinity.

That is what I am

[Denadii]

Genesis 1   In the beginning, Elohim created.....Elohim is a plural word, it would not be used for a one being.

Genesis 1:26–27. There we read that “God said, ‘Let us make man in our image’ . . . God created man in His image.” Here God is a plurality in unity.

Isaiah 48:12–16 we find the speaker in the passage describing himself as the Creator and yet saying that “the Lord God and His Spirit have sent Me.” This is further hinting at the doctrine of the trinity, which becomes very clear in the New Testament. There are many other Old Testament Scriptures that hint at the same idea.

In Matthew 28:18–20 Jesus command His disciples to baptize His followers in the name (singular) of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. John’s Gospel tells us that “the Word” is God who became man in Jesus Christ

John 1:1–3, 14. Jesus was fully man and fully God. Many other verses combine together to teach that God is triune.

There are many verses that refer to the triune nature of God

May I suggest you read with an attitude of learning, rather than trying to prove a misunderstanding?

[Justin Adams]

Oh, maybe before time God traveled around in a Throne-Ship.

Might have made a few pretty time warps and auroras and such.

The Father was Nav, the Spirit was Power and the Son was the Pilot...

What FUN....

[simplejeff]

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

You said:

I provided proof that  'elohiym  refers to God and you say it refers to men.  I would like to see the proof of your claim.

See below, which you already quoted once or more times:

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

  3 hours ago, simplejeff said:

"Elohim" ,   "Echad",   find same in Old Testment and New Testament

referring to men.

(particular,  'peculiar' men)

hint: (or help:)  Find a translation or a word study that retains "elohim" and "echad" .....

[OneLight]

16 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

You said:

I provided proof that  'elohiym  refers to God and you say it refers to men.  I would like to see the proof of your claim.

See below, which you already quoted once or more times:

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

  3 hours ago, simplejeff said:

"Elohim" ,   "Echad",   find same in Old Testment and New Testament

referring to men.

(particular,  'peculiar' men)

hint: (or help:)  Find a translation or a word study that retains "elohim" and "echad" .....

I have many word studies and do not agree, which is why I asked you to provide your resource.  Otherwise, I will have to continue to tell you that your definition of elohiym is wrong.

[simplejeff]

9 minutes ago, OneLight said:

I have many word studies and do not agree, which is why I asked you to provide your resource.  Otherwise, I will have to continue to tell you that your definition of elohiym is wrong.

Do you have one,  even not a word study,  just a BIBLE, 

where Jesus says 'is it not written, ye all are elohim' ?!

Then "echad" in OT and NT,  the many (or several) times it refers to believers ?!

[OneLight]

12 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Do you have one,  even not a word study,  just a BIBLE, 

where Jesus says 'is it not written, ye all are elohim' ?!

Then "echad" in OT and NT,  the many (or several) times it refers to believers ?!

You don't have to default to insults, Jeff.

The verse you are referring to is a small god, not God.  John 10:34 - "Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your law, ‘I said, “You are gods”’"".

Did you bother to look up the 4000+ times God, capital G, is found in the bible, or are you just referring to the one verse that is not talking about God, but gods?

Let me help ... https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=God&t=KJV&ss=1#s=s_primary_0_1

 

[simplejeff]

4 minutes ago, OneLight said:

You don't have to default to insults, Jeff.

The verse you are referring to is a small god, not God.  John 10:34 - "Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your law, ‘I said, “You are gods”’"".

Did you bother to look up the 4000+ times God, capital G, is found in the bible, or are you just referring to the one verse that is not talking about God, but gods?

Let me help ... https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=God&t=KJV&ss=1#s=s_primary_0_1

 

ooops....  there was no insult in the past posts..... just a recognition of a lack of full understanding as noted below in contrast to your own 'definition' (which is not wrong,  just not encompassing all Scripture) .....

https://www.biblegateway.com/resources/encyclopedia-of-the-bible/Elohim

Encyclopedia of The Bible – Elohim
Resources » Encyclopedia of The Bible » E » Elohim
Elohim

ELOHIM ĕl’ ō hĭm (אֱלֹהִים, H466, many suggestions for the meaning of the root but no consensus, perhaps related to “El” meaning mighty or strong). A most commonly used Heb. word for God, gods, angels, or magistrates.

It has been demonstrated to the writer’s satisfaction that 14th cent. b.c. Ugaritic lit. when referring to a single deity sometimes uses the “plural of majesty” (cf. Anchor Bible, 16, pp. XXIV and 43 etc.). Since the pl. word Elohim when used for God in the OT is most emphatically sing. in meaning (Deut 4:35, 39; 1 Kings 8:60; 18:39; Isa 45:18, etc.), there is real probability that the Hebrews looked on it as a “plural of majesty.” Often but not always when referring to the true God, the definite article is employed with the word in Heb. This usage was an overtone of the root’s basic meaning, hence “the Mighty (?) One,” but this is not carried over into the Eng. Bible which has simply “God” with a capital letter.

The word is frequently used to refer to heathen gods (Exod 18:11; 20:23; 1 Sam 4:8; 2 Kings 18:33, etc.). Less frequently the word refers to a heathen god in the sing., Dagon (1 Sam 5:7), Chemosh (Judg 11:24), Baal (1 Kings 18:24) etc.

There are a number of references where the word can be rendered magistrates, judges, or rulers. Noteworthy are Exodus 21:6 where the slave is brought “to God” or perhaps “to the judges” where his ear is bored, and Exodus 22:28 which may mean “You shall not revile the magistrates (God?), nor curse the ruler of your people” (cf. 1 Kings 21:13). Other passages should be studied in this light (i.e. 1 Sam 2:25 and Judg 5:8).

==================================================

The 'same' can be said about "echad" - it appears you have a very small understanding of it,  thus looking it up

particularly in reference to John 17,  is very encouraging to all believers born again, and to all who are "ONE" with JESUS ........

[JTC]

Many people have a hard time with this. "How can 3 be just 1 God, it's either 3 gods or 1". Oh, Jesus Freak thank you for giving us your birthday. And I'm glad you live in America because this is how I explain this.

How many Congresses do we have? I was taught it's only 1. But that 1 congress has many members. But it's still only 1 congress. Likewise, we have 1 God but 3 personalities make Him up. If that helps you grab it and run with it.

Personally, I get more mind twisted by what God said in Genesis. " Let us make man in our image". Huh. Who is "us". Maybe we can learn something from the Catholics here. In the CC they have mysteries. They clearly admit they don't know what they mean but they believe them. Jesus_Freak I dare say even in 40 yrs you won't understand everything about God you hope to. God is like a genius in physics and we are like a sparrow. That little bird doesn't have a brain that can understand what an atom is, never mind quantum mechanics. You can explain it to the bird forever, he will understand it. There are several verses in the OT where God tells man He is beyond our minds. I often think, poor God. He's trying to explain to a 5 day old baby what milk is, or where it comes from. He simply says, from mommy. (I'm not even sure how the glands in the breast make milk. Just don't ever stop asking God. He will amaze you when He explains a thing.