Legalism

[LadyKay]

38 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

As Neighbor basically said: If you do not agree with me and quote lots of scriptures, (rightly or wrongly) then you are legalistic.

Well I don't call people legalistic who don't agree with me. I may call them wrong though. LOL 

[LadyKay]

44 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Why do people ask this question ?

Well your telling us we must follow God's laws so I thought maybe you did follow all the Old Testament Laws. There are people who do I guess. I know there are many who follow some of them. And if you tell them they don't have to follow them they get mad at you and beat you over the head with the Bible. So I was just asking really. But if my asking is going to upset anyone I am sorry and you don't have to answer. 

[LadyKay]

58 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

The ten commandments are for us all. The Torah is God's everlasting law - until heaven and earth pass away.

Lots of people follow the Sabbath rule #4 because it is said by Yahweh to be His Everlasting Law. So to honor the Lord that Created Heaven and Earth and all that is, seen and unseen, is a reminder to us who He is and of His Creative Genius.

Many twist scripture and say the Ten Commandments are not for today - why? Only because of rule #4. Satan hates the Sabbath like Rome did and does all he can to confuse and cause strife over it. But rule #4 stands forever - see it in Ezekiel's vision for the millennium kingdom where everyone will be expected to observe it.

Many of the items in the Torah have benefited humans down thru the ages - washing for instance, saved countless thousands of  ladies early on when operations were done without cleanliness. So many great ideas for cleanliness and such are to be found in Torah. Some say there are 613 laws to be kept, but they are just being legalistic. The unclean (vacuum cleaner) animals and fishes are also a very good guide. Japanese million would have not died to biological multiplication of mercury might have been saved.

There are so many that are vitriolic about not observing the Sabbath, that I wonder, in the coming tribulation if they will be easy prey for the beast-system.

I try not to get caught up in all of this. I try to allow God to direct me in the way I should go. If others feel they should dress a certain way or not eat certain foods, well I just let people be. Maybe God is leading them on a path that is different then mine. After all he has his own plan for each of us. As I think we are all called to do different work for him.  

[Justin Adams]

11 minutes ago, Yowm said:

Because...

James 2:10 KJV
[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point , he is guilty of all.

Galatians 3:10 KJV
[10] For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

 

 

He was merely putting it into perspective for the Judaizers and other sects that had crept in. That is all.
We have no problem with OVER-KEEPING the law today, so this is a moot point.
Perhaps a misquoted sense of what Saul was saying. Later He says that we should abide by the Law and not dismiss it.

Saul had great difficulty with getting early Christians to see the Law as a shadow of what had followed in the Crucifixion. Putting it in perspective for them. To attempt to do away with the law is a grave error. Yeshua said that not one jot or tittle will pass from it.... Saul repeatedly states that we should uphold the law.

1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. 5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

[LadyKay]

37 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Try counting the number of traffic laws in any fair sized city.   ......   It is beyond most people's knowledge,  as well as being so many that no one can keep them,   (the laws will be used against them, and enforced, often on a whim by authorities or business men with a greedy agenda) .....

Yet people insist on passing a test before being allowed to drive.

Even diplomatic immunity does not relieve a person of obeying the traffic laws if they want to have any integrity, et al.

Thus also,   "no adultery" remains in effect,  morally, civilly and for righteousness sake (living right and not licentiously and not immorally).

Who here , or anywhere,  wants to come out of the closet and admit to daily adultery ?  (notwithstanding, so many publicized do, and even brag about this ! !  Though they have , of course,  given their souls over to satan and the flesh)

I guess it is a good thing that God does not run things like the DMV.  

But in all seriousness we should thank him for his mercy and grace. 

[simplejeff]

30 minutes ago, LadyKay said:

I guess it is a good thing that God does not run things like the DMV. 

 

Perhaps,  not as you think:

while you are driving,  it is OKAY (legal?)  to THINK about running a red light, or to THINK about running over the criminal insane drivers or pedestrians on the road.

However,  as you are partly aware - GOD LOOKS AT what you are thinking - at the heart.

Remember it is NOT the jewelry on the outside that makes a beautiful woman in HIS SIGHT,

but a HUMBLE and CONTRITE SPIRIT/HEART on the inside.

So ,  then,  as JESUS says IF YOU THINK OF SIN,  in your heart/mind,   you are guilty.

See?   JESUS said GOD is much much much more strict, and GOD knows the heart ,  so no one can get away with evil thoughts in HIS SIGHT ......

The DMV , so far,  does NOT arrest nor fine someone for what is in their mind or heart.

But GOD'S JUDGMENT as written in HIS WORD includes sin (lack of beauty) on the inside.(in the heart,  disobedience)

[Justin Adams]

7 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Perhaps,  not as you think:

while you are driving,  it is OKAY (legal?)  to THINK about running a red light, or to THINK about running over the criminal insane drivers or pedestrians on the road.

However,  as you are partly aware - GOD LOOKS AT what you are thinking - at the heart.

Remember it is NOT the jewelry on the outside that makes a beautiful woman in HIS SIGHT,

but a HUMBLE and CONTRITE SPIRIT/HEART on the inside.

So ,  then,  as JESUS says IF YOU THINK OF SIN,  in your heart/mind,   you are guilty.

See?   JESUS said GOD is much much much more strict, and GOD knows the heart ,  so no one can get away with evil thoughts in HIS SIGHT ......

The DMV , so far,  does NOT arrest nor fine someone for what is in their mind or heart.

But GOD'S JUDGMENT as written in HIS WORD includes sin (lack of beauty) on the inside.(in the heart,  disobedience)

Excellent thoughts.

Not in the good/evil tree, (how much can I get away with) but in the following and striving for the better way. The PERFECT way of Yahweh.

[simplejeff]

9 minutes ago, Yowm said:

The point Paul and James were making was that if you are seeking righteousness via the law you are on a dead end course.

So far,  only innuendo and presumption has been used to claim ANYONE is doing this.   I don't think anyone has been identified EVEN OFF SITE (non-posters),   who is seeking righteousness via the law.

Perhaps some people actually , for whatever reason,  mistakenly think someone else is expecting or hoping or trying to gain righteousness via the law,

but they / no one / has shown this yet.  

Only,  and the objections ,  to obeying the law have been as if from those who think there is some advantage in not obeying the law,  even though that would of course be or lead to anarchy,  not to Christ and not to YHWH'S Kingdom and certainly not to forgiveness of sin,   so obviously not to redemption or atonement for sin.

[missmuffet]

4 hours ago, LadyKay said:

I am not sure what  legalism as to do with Trump. But it seem all topics on here lead to him. Since I just came back out of hiding I am trying to avoid "Trump" issues for the time being. So I guess I don't have anything to say about that right now. 

That is a wise choice to avoid Trump issues Nice to see you back Lady.

[Justin Adams]

So He could circumcise their hearts, Yahweh wanted them to physically show their heart attitude. By faith in action as James would say.

When we are just spirits floating around, then we can be altogether doing stuff non-physical. Yahweh gave us his Sabbath to observe so that inwardly and outwardly we could do just that. Similar to baptism that people talk a lot about. The outward witness to a spiritual imperative. Similar to tithes and offerings. It is a physical action witnessing to our spiritual life. And some of the Commandments, if not all, imply a benefit and blessing for our obedience. That is it in a nutshell - man's laws or God's.