The Distinction between Israel and the Church

[Guest shiloh357]

8 minutes ago, n2thelight said:

Go a little deeper, like before Adam

There was no one before Adam.   Sorry, but the Bible contradicts you.

[Guest shiloh357]

10 minutes ago, n2thelight said:

 

I just can't see how one seperates the Church and Israel...

The NT does.

[n2thelight]

9 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

There was no one before Adam.   Sorry, but the Bible contradicts you.

So where was satan and what was happening in the world before he decided he wanted to be God?

[angels4u]

On 1/25/2018 at 3:50 PM, shiloh357 said:

He didn't.   But Abraham wasn't an Israelite.   Israelites are the physical descendants of Jacob (Israel).

Shiloh,I listened to him a couple of days ago, he's difficult to follow because of his accent , I thought he knew very well what he was talking about? I was thinking about getting one of his books,is there anything wrong with his teaching?

[Heleadethme]

1 hour ago, shiloh357 said:

You are wrong.   Nowhere does it say that Christians are Jews inwardly or otherwise.  That is a complete misinterpretation of Paul.   Paul was talking to Jews about what it means be a Jew.   He was not telling Gentiles that they were inwardly Jewish.   That is just absurd.

Not when we realize the Jews were chosen/elect.

[Quasar93]

9 hours ago, n2thelight said:

Non believers can't and are not God's people 

 

The fact of the matter is:  Non-believing Israel are still God's people - as well as all of us who belong to Jesus, His Church.  Review the following:

All of non-believing Israel will be saved

Paul's Concern for the Jews
…Rom.9:2I have deep sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart. 3For I could wish that I myself werecursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of mybrothers, my own flesh and blood, 4the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption as sons; theirs the divine glory and the covenants; theirs the giving of the Law, the temple worship, and the promises."

Rom.11:1"I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin.2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew. Don’t you know what Scripture says in the passage about Elijah—how he appealed to God against Israel: 3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars; I am the only one left, and they are trying to kill me”[a]?4 And what was God’s answer to him? “I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”[b] 5 So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6 And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.

7 What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened, 8 as it is written"

Rom.11:25 "I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way[e] all Israel will be saved. As it is written:

“The deliverer will come from Zion;
    he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27 And this is[f] my covenant with them
    when I take away their sins.”[g]

28 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29 for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. 30 Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, 31 so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now[h] receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you. 32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all."

JESUS SECOND COMING WHEN ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED

Zech.12:10 ""I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn."

 

Quasar93

 

[Quasar93]

8 hours ago, ScottA said:

Perhaps that is it...you are interpreting. I'm not.

I didn't say that Israel did not "reject" their Messiah - I said they "believed in Messiah." In fact they were indeed "a light unto the gentiles." They believed in the promise of His coming - and He came, and they were saved and now are "in Him."

As for His second coming, He came "quickly", just as He said, "with ten thousands of His saints." And, yes, they recognize Him.

 

Negative!  Israel, as a nation, DOES NOT believe Jesus is their Messiah, and won't until Jesus second coming, in Zech.12:10.  Review the following:

 All of non-believing Israel will be saved

Paul's Concern for the Jews
…Rom.9:2I have deep sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart. 3For I could wish that I myself werecursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of mybrothers, my own flesh and blood, 4the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption as sons; theirs the divine glory and the covenants; theirs the giving of the Law, the temple worship, and the promises."

Rom.11:1 "I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin.2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew. Don’t you know what Scripture says in the passage about Elijah—how he appealed to God against Israel: 3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars; I am the only one left, and they are trying to kill me”[a]?4 And what was God’s answer to him? “I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”[b] 5 So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6 And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.

7 What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened, 8 as it is written"

Rom.11:25 "I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way[e] all Israel will be saved. As it is written:

“The deliverer will come from Zion;
    he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27 And this is[f] my covenant with them
    when I take away their sins.”[g]

28 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29 for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. 30 Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, 31 so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now[h] receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you. 32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all."

JESUS SECOND COMING WHEN ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED

Zech.12:10 ""I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn."

The Church and Israel are two completely separate entitoes at this time.

 

Quasar93

 

[Quasar93]

10 hours ago, n2thelight said:

Israel can't be seperated from the Church as Israel are Christians ,heirs to the promise seed,whom is Christ

 

The separation of Israel from the Church is:  Israel = Non-belie in Jesus as their Messiah.  The Church: = Believers in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.  The Church and Israel are two completely separate entities at the present time.  And will be until Jesus second coming, when Israel will finally recognize Him as their Messiah, according to Zech.12:10.

 

Quasar93

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Heleadethme said:

Not when we realize the Jews were chosen/elect.

The Jews are still the chosen people.  And the Church is not Israel and the Bible never calls Christians, "Jews."   Sorry, but the Bible is not on your side.  You need to talk less and study more, 'cause you are out in left field.

[Guest shiloh357]

2 hours ago, n2thelight said:

So where was satan and what was happening in the world before he decided he wanted to be God?

To clarify, there were no humans before Adam. Adam and Eve were the first people.   That is what the Bible teaches.   Unfortunately, you subscribe to some kooky, half-baked nonsense.   I will stick with the Bible and the loony-toon garbage you're putting out.