The merchants of the earth

[ask21771]

In revelation 18 the "merchants of the earth" are mentioned several times my question is are they referring to all the merchants of the earth or at least most of them?

Edited October 27, 2018 by ask21771

[Omegaman 3.0]

I do not think myself an expert here, but it seems to me, that the context is about this whole of Babylon, and that the merchants of the earth here, are participating with her in her fornications and the like. 

This is symbolic, apocalyptic language, and not always easy to be certain of what all is being said. Some things in the BIble, are left to be understood in later times. Mysteries are often revealed progressively when the time has come for that.

Many see this as an apostate church, some as the church in Rome, since those whore sits on 7 hills. Whatever the actual case or meaning, those who have bee faithful to God and His Christ, Jesus, need not worry, they will not come under the judgments of God.

Sorry that my answer is not better.

[Your closest friendnt]

On 10/26/2018 at 10:27 PM, Omegaman 3.0 said:

I do not think myself an expert here, but it seems to me, that the context is about this whole of Babylon, and that the merchants of the earth here, are participating with her in her fornications and the like. 

This is symbolic, apocalyptic language, and not always easy to be certain of what all is being said. Some things in the BIble, are left to be understood in later times. Mysteries are often revealed progressively when the time has come for that.

Many see this as an apostate church, some as the church in Rome, since those whore sits on 7 hills. Whatever the actual case or meaning, those who have bee faithful to God and His Christ, Jesus, need not worry, they will not come under the judgments of God.

Sorry that my answer is not better.

It's interesting the way it is summarized, and the caution of how to be careful not to isolate events and look into their context. 

The merchants are active in every group and every faith and religion, and denominations to a diferent degree, and are also active in Christian groups. 

When we read that the merchants mourned for the lost of business, because no one (but there must be still some"a remant", still interested in them), 

the scripture did not intent to address the state of being in non Christian groups, why does Jesus would be interested to clean the other non Christian faiths!!! to purify them!!!

As in his time here on earth when Jesus went in the Temple,

and we do not need to specify "the Temple of God in Jerusalem, suggesting there was another Temple in some other place, as there was only all the time one Temple, one Holy Place withing the Temple, one Attonment done in that Temple and one High Priest, as one Arc, one lamp stand, one Table, one unleaven bread and also two loafs of bred one unleaven and the other leaven set up side by side before the Lord. 

Jesus cleaned the merchants from God's Temple. 

The same way in this example, Jesus will clean his Temple from the merchants. 

Individually, as we are the Temple of God, and collectively as a group of believer in diferent groups and denominations. 

Does the seven hills has a spiritual meaning, as in the examles of "the mountain if the Lord is above all mountains far above the tops of all other mountains.

And the mount Zion, the Holy mountain of God, which has nothing to do with any geographical location on earth, as it is the same for the reference to "Babylon". 

Are the seven hills a reference to seven orders within the RCC? 

Or a reference to the seven churches or to various Christian groups or denominations.

As we see at the begining of the book of Revelations Jesus attempts to clean the seven churches from many of the merchants that have found favor among those churches. 

This time the Lord God Almighty is telling us that he will succeed. 

Even thought those merchants were prospering at the beginning, eventually will  found not fertile ground in the churches as the hearts of the believers are turned towards the Lord Jesus and grow cold to the wares of these mercants. 

As the Lord said; 

This will be done by the fire of the Holy Spirit and accoblish by the zeal of the Lord Jesus Christ for the love for his people, who are his bride his church.

[Adstar]

On 10/27/2018 at 12:53 PM, ask21771 said:

In revelation 18 the "merchants of the earth" are mentioned several times my question is are they referring to all the merchants of the earth or at least most of them?

From reading the scriptures it sounds like the merchants will be the ones involved in international trade..  Because the disasters that come upon the world during those times will bring international trade to a virtual stop..

[Your closest friendnt]

18 minutes ago, Adstar said:

From reading the scriptures it sounds like the merchants will be the ones involved in international trade..  Because the disasters that come upon the world during those times will bring international trade to a virtual stop..

This scripture can be aplly to an idividual and become quite personal. 

An individual who had learned to live by the envy of this world, following the materialistic spirit of the global community, may along the way reconsider his values, and this is suggested for a believer in Jesus Christ, and in general to a lot other people of all kinds of background to grow in them selfs values and treasuries that do not loose their worth. 

To have tresures in Heaven as the scripture said, more of the things of God and less of the things of self and the envy of this world. 

So the merchants of the envy and the sensuality do not appeal to us as much. 

Less appealing , less liking of their wares, to experience a loss of appeal for them. 

I did not say to live in denial, but not to be in a fast race for them, never feel content..or being thirsty for them all the time. 

[Mike Mclees]

Lets not forget that the whore desires to be envied by the world. Thus they lavish in grandeur with colorful robes and fancy hats , rituals, portraying to be the authority of God upon the earth ( vicars ). The whore is deeply intrenched in the  posterity of the worlds trade markets and the politics of the world. The protestant churches and Im not saying all have become worldly minded. Remember when Rev 17 spoke of the whore she gave birth to many. Rev 17: 5 mystery Babylon the great the Mother of harlots and abominations of the earth. They  are of the ecumenical movement, and also those of interfaith. This is her identity. 

Still we see in Rev 15 the rise of the antichrist and both He and the harlot ware the same crown on their heads. They will walk together and cause all to be identified with their authoriy by causing all to receive their mark from which we waned not to take it. Those who are truly of Christ then must come out of her or be judged with her.

This is the great testing of the bride and many may dye because of being weak in the their faith and will not come out of her. Oh Babylon that great city has fallen has fallen and we know the rest. Religious Babylon, political, Babylon, and commercial Babylon. Their will be no half and half . We are either ready to give our life for Jesus or go the way of Babylon There is no easy way to say it. 

Edited December 11, 2018 by Mike Mclees

[HAZARD]

On ‎10‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 12:53 PM, ask21771 said:

In revelation 18 the "merchants of the earth" are mentioned several times my question is are they referring to all the merchants of the earth or at least most of them?

Rev 18:11 
And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more: 

This indicates a commercial center, note the 30 articles of commerce at this time in (V 11-15).

[JustPassingThru]

Just throwing this out there, ...I'm not saying it's a "thus sayeth the Lord."

I've heard from some people, that I have found to be trustworthy, ...that there are 10 extremely wealthy families that control all of the commerce in the world. 

[Diaste]

On 10/26/2018 at 7:53 PM, ask21771 said:

In revelation 18 the "merchants of the earth" are mentioned several times my question is are they referring to all the merchants of the earth or at least most of them?

I don't think it's all merchants of the earth. The only fully inclusive group are the ones who sail the sea and make their living from the sea.

"All the nations have drunk the wine of the passion of her immorality. The kings of the earth were immoral with her, and the merchants of the earth have grown wealthy from the extravagance of her luxury."

It's definitely ALL the nations and it looks like ALL the kings and merchants as well. But the article 'the' just shows it's kings and merchants on earth, not necessarily ALL have fornicated with Babylon, as is clearer from what comes next.

"Then the kings of the earth who committed sexual immorality and lived in luxury with her" 

The "...kings of the earth WHO..." Now this could mean ALL but from the above verse it's only the kings guilty of spiritual adultery.

"And the merchants of the earth will weep and mourn over her, because there is no one left to buy their cargo"

Again this looks like ALL merchants but it's the same as the above, "THE merchants of THE earth..." Maybe ALL, but it's as likely this just says 'merchants on earth' 

"The merchants who sold these things and grew their wealth from her" 

Here it's just the merchants selling the things listed in verses 11-13 so it's not all the merchants of the earth just the ones whose business deals in the sectors of trade. It may be quite a lot of them as the listed items are not just one offs. As an example, fine linen comes from all over in many grades. No single  merchant would handle every grade or style of fine linen. 

"Every ship master, passenger, and sailor, and all who make their living from the sea"

This is ALL. "Every" and "all" define the entire set of sea trade, "all who make their living from the sea".

"where all who had ships on the sea were enriched by her wealth!"

Again it's ALL. The only group I see as unequivocally ALL are the ones with the ships on the sea who make their living from the sea.

[Diaste]

It's important to note a difference in Revelation and I would think all of prophecy, though I'm not well read on each prophecy in all of Scripture. The prophecy I have studied seems to show an attribute we really do not have to search for and in my mind is consistent across my personal studies.

If the prophecy comes with an interpretation we know the prophecy was symbolic in most cases. If there is no interpretation or explanation then what Is being shown will occur exactly as spoken, manifesting in physical reality. As in Rev 18, this will come to pass as spoken. Are there spiritual aspects? Of course. We aren't going to think the kings of the earth had literal sexual relations with a city, are we? But we all understand what the Lord means when the subject of immorality of this kind is mentioned, it's spiritual adultery. Pretty clear from verse 1 this immorality is of the spiritual kind, which is where real and eternally consequential adultery and immorality occurs.

When it comes to discernment between the spiritual and the physical in prophecy I think we need to keep in mind the prophecy and the manifestation in this dimension accomplish or reveal or fulfill the spiritual concepts and truths of the Most High. Jesus fulfilled a foundational spiritual truth on the cross, 'without the shedding of blood there is no remission for sin", and yet this had to be done in the physical realm.

The spirit and the physical are inseparable, conceived in terrible and awesome power and glory, bound in love and hope, redeemed by grace, and forever destined in coexistence.

And so it is with prophecy.

 

Edited January 5, 2019 by Diaste