OSAS is the result of the finished work of the cross

[wingnut-]

Just now, Butero said:

Is it possible to have this debate without the accusations from either side and let the doctrinal chips fall where they may?

 

I believe it is, if people can set emotion aside and simply discuss the relevant scripture.  In my opinion, the best place to start is the matter of whether one can walk away from God or not.  I think we all can agree that God will not walk away from us, and as support for this we simply look to what Jesus said on the subject, I will never leave you nor forsake you.  So that begs the question, can a person walk away from Him?  This is really the heart of the debate that needs to be addressed, scripturally.

God bless

[Montana Marv]

Who is Greater? Jesus Christ or man. IRMC. I rest my case.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[wingnut-]

3 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Who is Greater? Jesus Christ or man. IRMC. I rest my case.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Do you believe in free will?  If so, is there any indication in scripture that it is taken away?

[Heb 13:8]

13 hours ago, Michael37 said:

Heb 4:1  Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
 

 

Heb 6:16-20 People swear by someone greater than themselves, and the oath confirms what is said and puts an end to all argument. 17Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised, he confirmed it with an oath. 18God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us may be greatly encouraged. 19We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, firm and secure. It enters the inner sanctuary behind the curtain, 20where our forerunner, Jesus, has entered on our behalf. He has become a high priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.

[Heb 13:8]

7 hours ago, Cletus said:

none of that changes what i said which is you choose to abandon the faith, or walk away.  we are still free will beings. 

I have given boat loads of scripture, explanation on this scripture as well as explanation on scripture you provided that shows how it dont say osas.  you want to cling to a few scriptures but ignore others.  I do not really want to invest anymore time in this conversation because of this.  if you really get serious about what it is that Jesus says, and not ignore it then i will converse with you further on this topic.   at this point its just wheels a spinning in the mud.  i would encourage you to really examine Jesus words, because His words give life, and he dont bump His gums.  He aint playing games, and this is a very serious topic that involves eternity.  dont just rely on so and so preacher to tell it to you, but Go to God and ask Him the truth.  if you do you will see osas is not all its cracked up to be. 

and those who abandon the faith were never born again to begin with. no believer in Christ will deny Jesus is God Cletus. it's not biblical and is a lie from the devil. Remember my post earlier how Matthew and Mark stated that they leave because of trouble and persecution because they did not have the root of salvation. Paul states that those who have the root do not leave the faith because of trouble and persecution, Rom 8:35. Do you believe Paul?

[Guest Butero]

14 minutes ago, Heb 13:8 said:

and those who abandon the faith were never born again to begin with. no believer in Christ will deny Jesus is God Cletus. it's not biblical and is a lie from the devil. Remember my post earlier how Matthew and Mark stated that they leave because of trouble and persecution because they did not have the root of salvation. Paul states that those who have the root do not leave the faith because of trouble and persecution, Rom 8:35. Do you believe Paul?

The things mentioned in that passage can't separate you from God, but you can choose to do things whereby you separate yourself from him.  This is strange in a way, because you have said the grave separates us from God by promoting soul sleep.  

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, wingnut- said:

 

Do you believe in free will?  If so, is there any indication in scripture that it is taken away?

God knew that answer before creation. He already knew what decisions we would make, thus making us Justifed or Unjustified. Clean or unclean. A vessel of honor or a vessel of dishonor. What we think now God knew in eternity past. It is already done , we just don't know the Answer yet.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Heb 13:8]

1 hour ago, Butero said:

The things mentioned in that passage can't separate you from God, but you can choose to do things whereby you separate yourself from him.

Nah, not even ourselves..... add it to your list Butero

[Guest Butero]

7 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

God knew that answer before creation. He already knew what decisions we would make, thus making us Justifed or Unjustified. Clean or unclean. A vessel of honor or a vessel of dishonor. What we think now God knew in eternity past. It is already done , we just don't know the Answer yet.

In Christ

Montana Marv

When you put it that way, I don't disagree with you.  Only God knows who the elect are.

[Guest Butero]

1 minute ago, Heb 13:8 said:

Nah, not even ourselves..... add it to your list Butero

Soul sleep has the grave separating us from God.  The Bible doesn't say we can't separate ourselves.