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[walla299]

6 hours ago, maryjayne said:

My take on all this thread is that if we, in full possession of our senses and minds and hearts, deliberately and cold bloodily commit suicide - its a sin.

If we are out of our minds with grief, pain, suffering, and literally mentally unwell enough to lose reality and perspective on life, we are in the grip of severe mental illness. It is death through illness. Death through Mental illness, just as any other death through any other illness. And is not a sin.

This. 

The only thing that sends anyone to hell is dying without Christ. The method used doesn't really matter all that much - if one is a believer, but we have to keep in mind that believers can be deceived too. Christ either redeemed us from all our sins or none. I'll leave it to Him to sort out the details in the case of suicide.

[lightmyway]

2 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

This is just a general reminder .    Since when does speaking scripture to anyone not appeal to this generation .

I mean folks act as though speaking scriptures to the lost is the same as cursing .    Yet how often did JESUS speak  SOUND DOCTRINE to all that had breath .

Every word He spoke , IS SOUND DOCTRINE and we should use His words in all cases .

But instead preachers who don't know HIM at all,   have for years taught us this wrong approach which Aint working .

Their reasoning was of men , for they said these people don't want to hear scripture .  

Truth is most don't .   But since when we do change the pure way of evangelizing with sound doctrine , to suit the ears of men who desire no truth .

To them it will be an offense .   And we cannot pander How we evangelize to their ears in hopes we can win them.  You wont .  at most you get only worse fish

and they teach even worse ways and soon , AS IN RIGHT NOW ,  it gets so bad that we even got churches saying ,   HEY don't say JESUS is the SON of GOD , because that OFFENDS .

Things just keep getting worse . And seeker friendly was a recipe for total destruction from its birth .   Let the SPIRIT lead and it will give you words .   Worry not about what to say

or not say .   SIMPLY follow CHRIST .

Truth

I believe when it comes to unbelievers who are really struggling is to be there for them, listen to them, pray for them support ect. But not bend the truth of the gospel. A lot of Christians seem to be doing that in todays society. This is a fulfilling prophecy. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

[lightmyway]

53 minutes ago, maryjayne said:

I dont see Christians on this forum saying "Yep, commit suicide, its OK, no worries"

A lot of people in the church in todays society (the latter times) are flocking to the mainstream idea that depression is a biological disease of the brain and therefore not a sin to suicide. Being told it’s not them it’s those pesky imbalance’s exuses people from personal responsibility. God calls murder a sin. God calls homosexual activity a sin and so on. I believe people who are depressed need spiritual help as well as talk therapy as they have most likely been oppressed by misfortunes in life abuse or told a loser ect. Old scratch loves playing on these issues too.

53 minutes ago, maryjayne said:

 

I DO see Christians on this forum saying "God reads all hearts and understands and will make that judgement call, but God loves you, this will pass, I am here for you"

No problem with this..

[Blood Bought 1953]

7 hours ago, lightmyway said:

A lot of people in the church in todays society (the latter times) are flocking to the mainstream idea that depression is a biological disease of the brain and therefore not a sin to suicide. Being told it’s not them it’s those pesky imbalance’s exuses people from personal responsibility. God calls murder a sin. God calls homosexual activity a sin and so on. I believe people who are depressed need spiritual help as well as talk therapy as they have most likely been oppressed by misfortunes in life abuse or told a loser ect. Old scratch loves playing on these issues too.

No problem with this..

 

I think suicide by anyone who is in the Body of Christ would be extremely rare.Having said that ,ALL of their sins are covered by the Blood.....including the terrible, heartbreaking sin of self- murder.If , at any time theses poor souls have come to Jesus as broken sinners that believe He died for their sins and rose from the grave after three days , their Salvation-is secure.They May stand ashamed when they appear before their Savior , along with Believers that are homosexuals.I got plenty to be ashamed of too.How about you? I thank God for His Grace “ Where sin abounds, grace abounds that much more”

 

[lightmyway]

33 minutes ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

I think suicide by anyone who is in the Body of Christ would be extremely rare.Having said that ,ALL of their sins are covered by the Blood.....including the terrible, heartbreaking sin of self- murder.If , at any time theses poor souls have come to Jesus as broken sinners that believe He died for their sins and rose from the grave after three days , their Salvation-is secure.They May stand ashamed when they appear before their Savior , along with Believers that are homosexuals.I got plenty to be ashamed of too.How about you? I thank God for His Grace “ Where sin abounds, grace abounds that much more”

 

What are you trying to imply? Yes, of course I have done things I'm ashamed of. 

[Jostler]

The beginning of salvation is not by works.  Being born again is a gift, wholly worked by the  Holy Spirit and only received by the  believer.  I agree with the characterization of suicide as self-murder...it is murder...taking a life that does not belong to you.   We were bought with a price.  But, what cannot be won by works cannot be lost by them either.  If a born again believer in Jesus should fall  into  such  a deep deception as to take his own life I am fully convinced  his salvation is secure.  But man I'd hate to come face to face with Jesus when my last physical act was murder.

I honestly believe it would be impossible for us to righteously judge any suicide.  The levels of deception involved and how someone got  tricked into  accepting the lies are simply not knowable by us and only God will be able to take the whole situation into account when passing judgement on that sin.  I suspect we will all grieve a little when we get home  and see all the  rewards that were set apart for us had we just walked out the appointed path instead  of going  our own way.  That may well be the source  of the tears Father  has to dry in heaven.  I do think suicide will have consequences, but  loss of salvation will not be one of them.  The loss of unearned rewards a full life  of service could have accumulated for eternity will likely be felt quite keenly.

The suicide who never knew Jesus at all has been tricked into sealing his eternal fate - sad indeed.

[Hands On]

I believe one of the main problems is that people are under the misconception that there is no "Hell" or "eternal death" when the Bible clearly states that there is (Mk 9:47-48). Of course, it is easy to take an objective armchair approach, and judge from a distance with intellectual calipers and judge objectively, and say that someone should not have done so and stuck it out.

What if the person who has terminal cancer and cannot deal with the chemo side effects or maybe some other physical defect, blind, cripple, the list just goes on and on. I would consider these to be bonafide reasons from a human perspective. God will be the judge though if one takes a wide view of Rom 14:10-11.

The person who believes that he escapes the realities of a particular sin is clearly barking up the wrong tree is he believes that he or she will sleep forever as if they never existed by committing suicide. Those" wages of sin " (Rom 6:23) still have to be faced pertaining to eternal death as read with Mk 9:47-48.One only has to be reminded  of Saul's suicide (I Sam 31:4-5) and Judas (Mt 27:5)But bear in mind that under common law in most countries "committing suicide" is no crime. However, "advising" someone or encouraging them to do so, would be in most cases considered to be complicity or accessory  to the unlawful intentional act of killing a human being.In which case it would be talking about  "murder" on the part of the "adviser"!

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

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Posted 2 hours ago

   2 hours ago,  Blood Bought 1953 said: 

 

I think suicide by anyone who is in the Body of Christ would be extremely rare.Having said that ,ALL of their sins are covered by the Blood.....including the terrible, heartbreaking sin of self- murder.If , at any time theses poor souls have come to Jesus as broken sinners that believe He died for their sins and rose from the grave after three days , their Salvation-is secure.They May stand ashamed when they appear before their Savior , along with Believers that are homosexuals.I got plenty to be ashamed of too.How about you? I thank God for His Grace “ Where sin abounds, grace abounds that much more”

 

What are you trying to imply? Yes, of course I have done things I'm ashamed of. 

 

I wasn’t referring specifically to you.......sorry for the misunderstanding...

Edited January 20, 2019 by Blood Bought 1953

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

Samson killed himself to avoid a future full of nothing but pain and torture.....Saul killed himself to avoid capture where he would have to endure a life of constant  humiliation and pain. Sampson is in the elite “ Faith Hall of Fame” I am certain he is saved because of his faith, despite a life of constant disobedience.Some say Saul was saved and others claim he was not saved because he lacked faith. I don’t know- God will judge rightly, that we can be sure of .

A non-  believer who commits suicide will be damned because of his or her unbelief—- the only thing that ultimately that sends anybody to Hell.The suicide itself was neither here nor there.They got to their torment a few years earlier perhaps .

I suffered a few years ago from extreme depression.I have studied hundreds of books and articles on this terrible condition and I have to say that almost nobody has a clue about it —- unless you have been there.Depression is not being sad— depression is about being dead.Imagine the top 20 things in your life that give you pleasure . Your spouse, your kids, your job , golfing, fishing, talking to friends, reading books, going for walks, grandchildren—- of course, the list is endless.Now imagine that you derive NO pleasure from any of these things. You’d just as soon sit on the edge of the bed and stare at the floor.Same excitement, same meaning.You are like a zombie.And that’s enough to make anybody sad, don’t you think.Everybody has a limit as to how much of this kind of “ life” one can endure.When utter misery fills the present and only fear and dread comprise the future— that intersection is where suicide becomes an enticing option.Thoughts of God , effects on the family, etc don’t even enter the mind— you just want OUT.When my fears and despairs were at their worst, I had a mouthful of pills and the only thing that kept me from swallowing them was cowardice.Its One heck of a jump to make the leap from contemplation to actually carrying out suicide.Looking back, I thank  God that He granted me the cowardice to not carry out my plans, as crazy as that sounds.In the end , that is what is all about.Craziness.I thank God that He delivered me from it.I am completely back to normal now—- there is a reason to get up about of bed each day.I am at peace, I have an inward joy that can’t be thwarted and I am constantly growing in my faith and getting to know God, which is the point of everything .To those who now find themselves where I was......hang onto your faith with a fingernail if you have to! Keep praying.....keep trusting......go see a Doctor that can prescribe medication that can help more than you ever dreamed was possible.With the help of God,you can rediscover how great this life is. “Blessed men GO THROUGH valleys of weeping”...... “ I am the God that healeth thee”...... “ All good things ( like Doctors and medication) come from God”. Act on these great promises of God and He will get you through this Valley.God bless

 

[UnprofitableServantJames]

Maybe what can help is asking your friend what is her purpose for asking such a question? Is it to understand the truth? Or is it to find a reason to disprove the love of God through this question?

People's spirit leaks out through their mouth (Luke 6:45). It is possible that your friend may be contemplating suicide, but it could also be a way to continually search for an issue with God.

All this is just to say to work out the motive of your friend. The motive will directly effect the best answer to give her.

And like always, ask God for His thoughts.