Misunderstandings by some about Saving Grace

[Firm Foundation]

1 minute ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

613..... not 635..... did you bother to look it  up?

may I respectfully suggest you get a Bible that is easy to understand and read Romans chapters 1 , 2 , and  3...it will tell you that the Law was given to “ shut our mouths”, every man is guilty of breaking God’s laws and the Law “ takes you by the hand” to lead you to the Savior.....basically, Christianity 101....and you have to be shown where to find it?There are verses dealing with “ the blind leading the blind”     I think they are somewhere in the back.....sorry, can’t resist .

” Faith plus nothing” comes from the entirety of the Book of Galations— it’s only 6 little chapters...please read it......I’ve already “ properly divided” God’s Word, now it is your turn.

There is no truth to any of this.  I have probably read Romans and Galatians 20 times, and they don't say those things.  Show me where it says the 613 or 635 or any other number you create, was only given to show we can't keep them, and where the verse is in  the  Bible  that says faith plus nothing?  

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

Ill get those verses for  you, when I get caught up .....we Have an emergency here at the BB house......we got plenty of dip,  but  we are out of chips....must go to store......

.

[Firm Foundation]

2 minutes ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

Ill get those verses for  you, when I get caught up .....we Have an emergency here at the BB house......we got plenty of dip,  but  we are out of chips....must go to store......

.

Don't get in too much of a hurry on that bike.  

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

No worry....raining here like cats and dogs.....like most weekends lol.....

[Blood Bought 1953]

4 hours ago, Firm Foundation said:

Chapter and verse for what?  You are not backing up anything.  What are the 635 commandments?  Where does the Bible say God gave us the commandments to show we can't keep them as you claimed? Where is the chapter and verse that says faith plus nothing?  

 

There are 592 more, but I think I have made my point ......

All 613 Commandments in the Old Testament Law There are a whole lot more than only 10 Commandments found in the Old Testament, there are 613 Commandments! Below is a list of the 613 mitzvot commandments (mitzvot is plural, mitzvah is singular).  There are both "positive" and "negative" mitzvot (do's and don'ts) which can be divided into 365 Negative Mitzvot (to remind us not to do bad things every day of the year) plus 248 Positive Mitzvot (the number of bones in the human body - for a total of 613. In this way, Hebrews and Jewish people are able to obey the mitzvot with their entire body. It is important to know that while God gave us many commands to follow, including the famous Ten Commandments, He did not abolish the Law of Moses found in the Torah (the first five Books of the Bible). The following commandments are superceded by the new covenant of grace.  The Law is God’s Divine Instructions in Righteousness  without which man would have NO blueprint for moral, holy living. Jesus Christ attempted to abolish the rabbinical, man-made opinions and traditions that kept people in bondage. Neither He nor His apostles ever spoke against the Law nor suggested that after Jesus’ death the Torah was to become null and void. The Apostle Paul said, “Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.” (Romans 3:31) God gave 248 positive Mitzvot / Commandments ("the Do's"), and 365 negative ones ("the Don'ts"). They are as follows: The 248 Positive Mitzvot / Commandments: "The Do's" RELATIONSHIP TO GOD  1 Exodus 20:2 - To believe in God.  I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.  2 Deuteronomy 6:4 - To acknowledge the Unity of God.  Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:  3 Deuteronomy 6:5 - To love God.  And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.  4 Deuteronomy 6:13 - To fear God.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God, and serve him, and shalt swear by his name.  5 Exodus 23:25; Deuteronomy 11:13; 13:4 - To serve God.  And ye shall serve the Lord your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee.  6 Deuteronomy 10:20 - To cleave to God.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God; him shalt thou serve, and to him shalt thou cleave, and swear by his name.  7 Deuteronomy 10:20 - On taking an oath by God's Name.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God; him shalt thou serve, and to him shalt thou cleave, and swear by his name.  8 Deuteronomy 28:9 - On walking in God's ways.  The Lord shall establish thee an holy people unto himself, as he hath sworn unto thee, if thou shalt keep the commandments of the Lord thy God, and walk in his ways.  9 Leviticus 22:32 - On Sanctifying God's Name.  Neither shall ye profane my holy name; but I will be hallowed among the children of Israel: I am the Lord which hallow you,  TORAH  10 Deuteronomy 6:7 - On reciting the Sh'ma each morning and evening.  And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.  11 Deuteronomy 6:7 - On studying and teaching Torah.  And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.  12 Deuteronomy 6:8 - On binding Tefillin on the head.  And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.  13 Deuteronomy 6:8 - On binding Tefillin on the hand.  And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.  14 Numbers 15:38 - On making Tzitzit with thread of blue, garments corners.  Speak unto the children of Israel, and bid them that they make them fringes in the borders of their garments throughout their generations, and that they put upon the fringe of the borders a ribband of blue:  15 Deuteronomy 6:9 - On affixing a Mezuzah to doorposts and gates.  And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.  16 Deuteronomy 31:12 - On Assembling each 7th year to hear the Torah read.  Gather the people together, men, and women, and children, and thy stranger that is within thy gates, that they may hear, and that they may learn, and fear the Lord your God, and observe to do all the words of this law:  17 Deuteronomy 17:18 - On that a king must write a copy of Torah for himself.  And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites:  18 Deuteronomy 31:19 - On that everyone should have a Torah scroll.  Now therefore write ye this song for you, and teach it the children of Israel: put it in their mouths, that this song may be a witness for me against the children of Israel.  19 Deuteronomy 8:10 - On praising God after eating, Grace after meals.  When thou hast eaten and art full, then thou shalt bless the Lord thy God for the good land which he hath given thee.  TEMPLE AND THE PRIESTS  20 Exodus 25:8 - On building a Sanctuary / (Tabernacle / Temple) for God.  And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.  21 Leviticus 19:30 - On respecting the Sanctuary.  Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the Lord.

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

4 hours ago, Firm Foundation said:

Chapter and verse for what?  You are not backing up anything.  What are the 635 commandments?  Where does the Bible say God gave us the commandments to show we can't keep them as you claimed? Where is the chapter and verse that says faith plus nothing?  

 

 

God began His introduction to the Law with the Ten Commandments, but the entire Law encompasses 613 commandments, as detailed in the rest of the books of Moses. Jesus summarized the Law as having two emphases: love for God and love for neighbors (Matthew 22:37–39). These emphases can be easily seen in the Ten Commandments: the first four commands focus on our relation to God, and the remainder focus on interpersonal relations. If we think that is the whole purpose of the Law, though, we miss an important element. Many of the individual commands give detailed instruction on how God was to be worshipped and how the people were to live their lives. As we will see, it is in those fine details that love was either shown or withheld.

For hundreds of years, the Israelites lived under the Levitical Law, sometimes obeying it but more often failing to follow God’s commands. Much of Old Testament history deals with the punishments Israel received for their disobedience. When Jesus Christ came, He said that He did not “come to abolish the Law or the Prophets . . . but to fulfill them” (Matthew 5:17). In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus took the Law to a higher level, applying it to the thoughts and intents of the heart. This perspective significantly diminishes our ability to keep the Law.

The apostle Paul gives us insight into God’s purpose for the Law in his letter to the Galatians. In Galatians 3:10 he says, “All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.’” The fine details show up again—if we don’t keep every command perfectly, we are condemned (see James 2:10). In Galatians 3:19, Paul asks, “What, then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come.” What does that mean? Verse 24 clarifies: “The law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith.” The Law pointed out our sinfulness, proved our inability to keep our end of the covenant, made us prisoners in our guilt, and showed our need of a Savior. The purpose of the Law is also revealed in Romans 3:19–20 as producing a consciousness of sin and holding the world “accountable to God.” Paul even goes so far as to say he would not have known what sin was except by the Law (Romans 7:7).

The Levitical Law did its job well, pointing out the sinfulness of mankind and condemning us for it. But, as powerful as it was in that regard, it was powerless in another way. Hebrews 7:18–19 tells us that the old Law was set aside “because it was weak and useless (for the law made nothing perfect).” The Law had no way of changing our sinful nature. We needed something better to accomplish that. In fact, Hebrews goes on to say that the Law was “only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never . . . make perfect those who draw near to worship” (Hebrews 10:1).

God’s desire has always been to have fellowship with mankind, but our sin prevented that. He gave the Law to set a standard of holiness—and, at the same time, to show that we could never meet that standard on our own. That’s why Jesus Christ had to come—to fulfill all the righteous requirements of the Law on our behalf, and then to take the punishment of violating that Law, also on our behalf. Paul wrote in Galatians 2:16 that we are not justified “by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ.” When we receive God’s forgiveness through our confession of faith in Jesus’ sacrificial death, the Law is fulfilled for us, and “there is no longer any sacrifice for sin” (Hebrews 10:18). The Law’s condemnation does not fall on us, because “the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death” (Romans 8:2).

[Debp]

10 hours ago, PromisesPromises! said:

@Firm Foundation

Would you walk out of God's hand?  Would you--having experienced God's love, knowing the sacrifice Jesus made for you, having received the wholly undeserved gift of grace and forgiveness, knowing Jesus defeated death and still lives to intercede for you, having the Holy Spirit dwelling in you, having been freed from the bondage of sin and death--would you walk out of God's hand?   I don't think so.   What makes you think that anyone having full confidence in these truths, would do so? 

PromisesPromises!  You stated the above so beautifully, thank you!

It seems almost like those that oppose Eternal Security do not feel the same as we do, about God's wonderful saving grace.   That is, unless there is a threat of hell, it seems they would not walk with Jesus.

[Firm Foundation]

4 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

There are 592 more, but I think I have made my point ......

All 613 Commandments in the Old Testament Law There are a whole lot more than only 10 Commandments found in the Old Testament, there are 613 Commandments! Below is a list of the 613 mitzvot commandments (mitzvot is plural, mitzvah is singular).  There are both "positive" and "negative" mitzvot (do's and don'ts) which can be divided into 365 Negative Mitzvot (to remind us not to do bad things every day of the year) plus 248 Positive Mitzvot (the number of bones in the human body - for a total of 613. In this way, Hebrews and Jewish people are able to obey the mitzvot with their entire body. It is important to know that while God gave us many commands to follow, including the famous Ten Commandments, He did not abolish the Law of Moses found in the Torah (the first five Books of the Bible). The following commandments are superceded by the new covenant of grace.  The Law is God’s Divine Instructions in Righteousness  without which man would have NO blueprint for moral, holy living. Jesus Christ attempted to abolish the rabbinical, man-made opinions and traditions that kept people in bondage. Neither He nor His apostles ever spoke against the Law nor suggested that after Jesus’ death the Torah was to become null and void. The Apostle Paul said, “Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.” (Romans 3:31) God gave 248 positive Mitzvot / Commandments ("the Do's"), and 365 negative ones ("the Don'ts"). They are as follows: The 248 Positive Mitzvot / Commandments: "The Do's" RELATIONSHIP TO GOD  1 Exodus 20:2 - To believe in God.  I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.  2 Deuteronomy 6:4 - To acknowledge the Unity of God.  Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:  3 Deuteronomy 6:5 - To love God.  And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.  4 Deuteronomy 6:13 - To fear God.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God, and serve him, and shalt swear by his name.  5 Exodus 23:25; Deuteronomy 11:13; 13:4 - To serve God.  And ye shall serve the Lord your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee.  6 Deuteronomy 10:20 - To cleave to God.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God; him shalt thou serve, and to him shalt thou cleave, and swear by his name.  7 Deuteronomy 10:20 - On taking an oath by God's Name.  Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God; him shalt thou serve, and to him shalt thou cleave, and swear by his name.  8 Deuteronomy 28:9 - On walking in God's ways.  The Lord shall establish thee an holy people unto himself, as he hath sworn unto thee, if thou shalt keep the commandments of the Lord thy God, and walk in his ways.  9 Leviticus 22:32 - On Sanctifying God's Name.  Neither shall ye profane my holy name; but I will be hallowed among the children of Israel: I am the Lord which hallow you,  TORAH  10 Deuteronomy 6:7 - On reciting the Sh'ma each morning and evening.  And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.  11 Deuteronomy 6:7 - On studying and teaching Torah.  And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.  12 Deuteronomy 6:8 - On binding Tefillin on the head.  And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.  13 Deuteronomy 6:8 - On binding Tefillin on the hand.  And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.  14 Numbers 15:38 - On making Tzitzit with thread of blue, garments corners.  Speak unto the children of Israel, and bid them that they make them fringes in the borders of their garments throughout their generations, and that they put upon the fringe of the borders a ribband of blue:  15 Deuteronomy 6:9 - On affixing a Mezuzah to doorposts and gates.  And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.  16 Deuteronomy 31:12 - On Assembling each 7th year to hear the Torah read.  Gather the people together, men, and women, and children, and thy stranger that is within thy gates, that they may hear, and that they may learn, and fear the Lord your God, and observe to do all the words of this law:  17 Deuteronomy 17:18 - On that a king must write a copy of Torah for himself.  And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites:  18 Deuteronomy 31:19 - On that everyone should have a Torah scroll.  Now therefore write ye this song for you, and teach it the children of Israel: put it in their mouths, that this song may be a witness for me against the children of Israel.  19 Deuteronomy 8:10 - On praising God after eating, Grace after meals.  When thou hast eaten and art full, then thou shalt bless the Lord thy God for the good land which he hath given thee.  TEMPLE AND THE PRIESTS  20 Exodus 25:8 - On building a Sanctuary / (Tabernacle / Temple) for God.  And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.  21 Leviticus 19:30 - On respecting the Sanctuary.  Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the Lord.

 

My point is that you make claims you don't back up while saying I have to back everything up.  You still failed to back up 613 commands.   That is the point I was making.

[Firm Foundation]

3 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

 

God began His introduction to the Law with the Ten Commandments, but the entire Law encompasses 613 commandments, as detailed in the rest of the books of Moses. Jesus summarized the Law as having two emphases: love for God and love for neighbors (Matthew 22:37–39). These emphases can be easily seen in the Ten Commandments: the first four commands focus on our relation to God, and the remainder focus on interpersonal relations. If we think that is the whole purpose of the Law, though, we miss an important element. Many of the individual commands give detailed instruction on how God was to be worshipped and how the people were to live their lives. As we will see, it is in those fine details that love was either shown or withheld.

For hundreds of years, the Israelites lived under the Levitical Law, sometimes obeying it but more often failing to follow God’s commands. Much of Old Testament history deals with the punishments Israel received for their disobedience. When Jesus Christ came, He said that He did not “come to abolish the Law or the Prophets . . . but to fulfill them” (Matthew 5:17). In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus took the Law to a higher level, applying it to the thoughts and intents of the heart. This perspective significantly diminishes our ability to keep the Law.

The apostle Paul gives us insight into God’s purpose for the Law in his letter to the Galatians. In Galatians 3:10 he says, “All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.’” The fine details show up again—if we don’t keep every command perfectly, we are condemned (see James 2:10). In Galatians 3:19, Paul asks, “What, then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come.” What does that mean? Verse 24 clarifies: “The law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith.” The Law pointed out our sinfulness, proved our inability to keep our end of the covenant, made us prisoners in our guilt, and showed our need of a Savior. The purpose of the Law is also revealed in Romans 3:19–20 as producing a consciousness of sin and holding the world “accountable to God.” Paul even goes so far as to say he would not have known what sin was except by the Law (Romans 7:7).

The Levitical Law did its job well, pointing out the sinfulness of mankind and condemning us for it. But, as powerful as it was in that regard, it was powerless in another way. Hebrews 7:18–19 tells us that the old Law was set aside “because it was weak and useless (for the law made nothing perfect).” The Law had no way of changing our sinful nature. We needed something better to accomplish that. In fact, Hebrews goes on to say that the Law was “only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never . . . make perfect those who draw near to worship” (Hebrews 10:1).

God’s desire has always been to have fellowship with mankind, but our sin prevented that. He gave the Law to set a standard of holiness—and, at the same time, to show that we could never meet that standard on our own. That’s why Jesus Christ had to come—to fulfill all the righteous requirements of the Law on our behalf, and then to take the punishment of violating that Law, also on our behalf. Paul wrote in Galatians 2:16 that we are not justified “by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ.” When we receive God’s forgiveness through our confession of faith in Jesus’ sacrificial death, the Law is fulfilled for us, and “there is no longer any sacrifice for sin” (Hebrews 10:18). The Law’s condemnation does not fall on us, because “the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death” (Romans 8:2).

By the way, who wrote this?  I think we are required to give credit to the author when we post another person's material.

[Firm Foundation]

2 hours ago, Betha said:

so you still sacrificing and killing animals daily as in the OT ?

Where then is your love to God and neighbour espoused in the NT ?

The scriptures i quoted are just my opinion/imagination ?

Scriptures are scriptures.  What you said about them are your opinions.