Who is THE RESTRAINER in 2Thessalonians ch 2?

[WilliamL]

On 9/7/2021 at 3:49 PM, Da Puppers said:

The falling away and Revelation of the man of sin are both part of what is being restrained,  but it is God who controls when and who that is to be the time of unrestraint, ala lawlessness.  It all hinges (precedes)  around the revelation of Christ. 

And God uses earthly governments and leaders to restrain gross lawlessness, as shown in the post above. And that restraint does not hinge on the coming of Christ, except as a sign: when lawlessness becomes unrestrained, and the Son of Perdition/Lawlessness come onto the scene, then the time of the coming of Christ will follow before very long.

[Diaste]

WHAT restrains is the revolt and the revealing. WHAT is restrained is the day of Christ.

Once the defection happens and the man of sin emerges on the world stage from out of the midst, then the day of Christ and the gathering can occur.

[Dennis1209]

Our hermeneutics, exegesis, denomination, parents, church, clergy. pastor and upbringing greatly influences our theology. In turn, that determines our pre; mid; post; amillennial; etc. beliefs and positions. 

I cannot say I have the correct view, but looking at it from my perspective as pre-Tribulation, my view of He, and until He is taken away, is dual. I'd say this is the historically generally accepted theology and thought.

When a person accepts Jesus as their own personal Lord and Savior, the Holy Spirit immediately comes and indwells that person and are sealed until the day of redemption. At that instant, they become born again, a brother or sister in Christ, a member of the body which is in Christ; that is the church. 

The church has always been a restraining force against evil, because the Holy Spirit abides in us; Jesus is within us. Today in these end-times, much or most of the church is not restraining evil as it once did. Instead of the church influencing government and restraining evil, government and evil is now influencing churches. The church overall has become politically correct, endorsing and promoting the ways of the world, and subservient to government and their dictates. We are seeing the formation of a church-state system once again; back under the umbrella of the so called "one true church."

I believe He that restrains is the Holy Spirit within each of us, collectively the entire group of born again believers known as the church. 

When the church is removed and caught up into the clouds at the Rapture, by extension, the Holy Spirit does not stay behind, but also ascends up and is removed from earth. Thus, no restraining force is left behind, and evil immediately starts to run rampant. Then the Antichrist will be revealed.

This does not imply the Holy Spirit's work is complete on the earth. No, He will be active and involved in the seven year Tribulation, a multitude will come to know Jesus as their Savior, and most likely they will be martyred for their trust and faith. 

I personally think the Holy Spirit's roll and activity will be much like under the old Covenant, before the age of Grace. If you subscribe to dispensationalism; the church age, the age of Grace ends at the Rapture of the church.  

[TCC]

I think there are reasonable arguments for the restraining as the church. I think there are reasonable arguments for Michael the angel as the restrainer. A much lesser rather fascinating take is Elijah. This view can be found but is very rare. 

Personally, I believe that the timing of events helps provide some possible answers for us. If we look at timing, and if timing be a chief principle in interpretation, then perhaps looking beyond timing as a starting point is a potential mistake. 

When viewing timing, what do we see? When looking at timing do we mean when AC appears as the man of lawlessness or the AC demanding worship? I believe the sense in Thessalonians is the latter (although reasonable arguments can be made for the former). 

In Revelation chapter 11 we see this is where the two witnesses complete their ministry just prior to the 7th trumpet. This would imply their ministry takes place during the first half of the tribulation. The AC is not able to do anything harmful toward them during their ministry until the end. When the angel comes up out of the abyss, this is when the AC has power to kill the two witnesses (not before), Rev 17:8. 

Since both the two witnesses and the AC are on earth at the same time, and since the AC cannot do anything to the two witnesses during their ministry, it could indicate that that the two witnesses presence physically on earth does restrain the AC until their ministry is complete. 

There are studies regarding the two lamp stands that stand before the Lord. We can see them even back in Zach 4:11. I believe, as far as timing goes, that the two witnesses are the restrainers...because we see a time and place where they do actually physically carry out a tangible ministry of this nature of sorts on earth before the whole world (and certainly before the angels of God...as audience). 

Regardless, it would appear to be true that of course any power given to whomever restrains, would be authority given and backed by God and His spirit. Amen. 

Blessings. 

 

Edited October 7, 2021 by TCC

[Last Daze]

On 11/7/2019 at 10:41 PM, Buddy D. Mouse said:

IOW, "what WITHOLDETH" that son of perdition cannot be revealed yet?

 

A different train of thought than what's been presented thus far is the abyss.  We know that the abyss is a prison for evil spirit beings (Rev 20) a place of restraint.  We also know that at some point, the beast is released from the abyss where he was obviously being restrained (Rev 17).  And we know that there is a "key" that unlocks the abyss (Rev 9).

Perhaps the person holding the key is the "who" and the abyss is the "what" that's doing the restraining.  And maybe the beast has already been released from the abyss and the process of "stage setting" is taking place for the revealing of the man of sin.  What's going on in the world today is well beyond the scope of men to orchestrate.

[JoeCanada]

On 11/7/2019 at 8:41 PM, Buddy D. Mouse said:

IOW, "what WITHOLDETH" that son of perdition cannot be revealed yet?

 

Hi Buddy D,

If only Paul had told us. He explained it to the Thessalonians..... but here we are some 2,000 years later, and still wondering.

But he did leave us a few clues.

The Thessalonians thought they had missed the rapture but Paul reassured them that they hadn't. He said there were two signs that had to occur first: 

A great rebellion from the faith and the revealing of the Antichrist...... and:

We would know who the Antichrist is when he sits in the "holy place" (maybe temple) proclaiming himself to be like God.

Jesus tells us in Matt 24 that this would be the sign to look for....."when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of through Daniel the prophet"

We also know that this occurs at the midpoint of the GT. (great trib)

Paul also says the restrainer was at work in his day.....2Thes 2:7

And the restrainer is also restraining the "mystery of lawlessness", which is not civil obedience, but it's God's Laws. He will oppose them and he will be in opposition to God and His righteousness. Psalm 2 tells us:

"Why are the nations in uproar and the peoples devising a vain thing? The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers take council together against the Lord and His Anointed...." Ps 2 1-2

The restrainer is a very powerful supernatural force and is Satan's equal.

So we can rule out possible candidates like the USA....because it wasn't around in Paul's day.

And we can rule out the church because we aren't Satan's equals. And, the restraint ends at the midpoint of the GT.... not years before, like pretrib supposes.  Read Matt 24....Jesus tells us when we will see the Antichrist.  I think we should also rule out God the Father , Jesus and the Holy Spirit. They are way above being equal to Satan.

Michael the Archangel is the only supernatural force that is Satan's equal.

In Rev 12, there is reference to Michael overcoming Satan and throwing him and his angels to the earth, right before the GT begins.

References to Michael appear in 4 chapters of the bible. In Jude he retrieves the body of Moses, and the other 3 are all related to restraining.... Dan 10: 20-21.... Dan 12:1....Rev 12:7-9, 13

Michael seems to be the best contender for being the restrainer. The others just don't add up. 

[DeighAnn]

2 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Michael seems to be the best contender for being the restrainer. The others just don't add up. 

I do agree with you if it is a WHO then yes, Michael.  If it a what then it is time.  If it is a when then it is the events that have to take place.  If it really mattered, we would be told, just kidding, I know it all matters...


2 Thess 2:7  The for mystery already is working  of lawlessness only {there is] the [one] restraining at present until OUT OF [THE]MIDST he might be [gone]

Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Revelation 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

[Uriah]

I can only repeat once again what the scripture declares...

2Thes. 2:6- And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

And now the italics, like the KJV writers did for clarification/to make it more readable/so it won't sound like broken English.

And now ye know what withholdeth, its just so that he might be revealed in his time.

TIME is withholding...it wasn't/isn't TIME yet.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Uriah
added word

[JoeCanada]

27 minutes ago, Uriah said:

I can only repeat once again what the scripture declares...

2Thes. 2:6- And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

And now the italics, like the KJV writers did for clarification/to make it more readable/so it won't sound like broken English.

And now ye know what withholdeth, its just so that he might be revealed in his time.

TIME is withholding...it wasn't/isn't TIME yet.

Hey Uriah,

That is really going out on a strrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrretch.

First question: Where did the "its just so" come from? It's not in the KJV.

If we look at the next verse..... "For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

The "he" isn't time.... it's a person. Right?

[Uriah]

51 minutes ago, JoeCanada said:

Hey Uriah,

That is really going out on a strrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrretch.

First question: Where did the "its just so" come from? It's not in the KJV.

If we look at the next verse..... "For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

The "he" isn't time.... it's a person. Right?

Hi Joe

I said in my post that I was putting in some italics like the KJV writers did for clarity. That is where it comes from, as I said in my post that I would.

Verse 6 plainly says that he has to be revealed in his time...THAT is what it is all  about. Paul is saying not to worry about the Day of Christ being "at hand." Then he says it is for another time.

Then...Paul goes on giving more details. As in, the mystery of iniquity is in progress even now. But the one who is holding this back will do so until he is removed.

The first "he" is God, the second "he" is the wicked one.