Best Teachers On Prophecy

[Revelation Man]

21 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Many people imagine (incorrectly) that chapter 8 is speaking of events future to us today, but when we read the fine print (other verses in chapter 8) we see that it is speaking ONLY of the end of the Greek empire around Israel. Daniel wrote, "at the latter time of THEIR kingdom [the four generals].

No, you imagine wrong, God is speaking about the Greek Kingdoms from beginning to END.........Just like in Daniel 11. In Daniel 11:36 we see the END TIME King. In Daniel 8:9 we see that SAME TRANSITION. 

[luigi]

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Many people imagine (incorrectly) that chapter 8 is speaking of events future to us today, but when we read the fine print (other verses in chapter 8) we see that it is speaking ONLY of the end of the Greek empire around Israel. Daniel wrote, "at the latter time of THEIR kingdom [the four generals].

Do you ever read the bible, or do you just read commentaries that deny the Word? Look at the correlations below. 

The little horn who wears out the saints during the time, times, and dividing of time in Daniel 7:25, is the little horn in Daniel 8:10 & 12 who casts the Lord's illumination, His truth to the ground and stomps all over it. This little horn who casts truth to the ground and magnifies himself, taking away the daily sacrifice, and the place of the sanctuary in Daniel 8:11, is the same entity, the prince in Daniel 9:26-27 who shall destroy the sanctuary, and confirm a covenant with many for one week, thereby causing the sacrifice to cease. This little horn/the prince in Daniel 8:11 and 9:26-27 who destroys the sanctuary and takes away the sacrifice, we see again in Daniel 11:31 polluting the sanctuary of strength and taking away the daily sacrifice. Notice any correlations?

This little horn who magnifies himself in Daniel 8:11 and in Daniel 8:25, thereby destroying the holy people (Daniel 8:24), who are the saints in Daniel 7:25 during a time, times, and dividing of time, is the same entity in Daniel 11:36-37 who magnifies himself, and destroys the holy people in Daniel 11:33-35. Notice any correlations ?

This little horn, who is the ten horned beast's mouth , and who wears out the saints for a time, times, and dividing of time, in Daniel 7:25, we see again in Daniel 12:7, where he scatters the power of the holy people for a time, times, and an half. Notice any correlations?

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Daniel 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

Daniel 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people. 25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Daniel 9:26  And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Daniel 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Daniel 11: 33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days. 34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries. 35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

Daniel 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

[The Light]

3 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

No, you imagine wrong, God is speaking about the Greek Kingdoms from beginning to END.........Just like in Daniel 11. In Daniel 11:36 we see the END TIME King. In Daniel 8:9 we see that SAME TRANSITION. 

Are you saying that the End Time King in Daniel 11 is from the Greek Kingdoms?

[iamlamad]

52 minutes ago, luigi said:

Do you ever read the bible, or do you just read commentaries that deny the Word? Look at the correlations below. 

The little horn who wears out the saints during the time, times, and dividing of time in Daniel 7:25, is the little horn in Daniel 8:10 & 12 who casts the Lord's illumination, His truth to the ground and stomps all over it. This little horn who casts truth to the ground and magnifies himself, taking away the daily sacrifice, and the place of the sanctuary in Daniel 8:11, is the same entity, the prince in Daniel 9:26-27 who shall destroy the sanctuary, and confirm a covenant with many for one week, thereby causing the sacrifice to cease. This little horn/the prince in Daniel 8:11 and 9:26-27 who destroys the sanctuary and takes away the sacrifice, we see again in Daniel 11:31 polluting the sanctuary of strength and taking away the daily sacrifice. Notice any correlations?

This little horn who magnifies himself in Daniel 8:11 and in Daniel 8:25, thereby destroying the holy people (Daniel 8:24), who are the saints in Daniel 7:25 during a time, times, and dividing of time, is the same entity in Daniel 11:36-37 who magnifies himself, and destroys the holy people in Daniel 11:33-35. Notice any correlations ?

This little horn, who is the ten horned beast's mouth , and who wears out the saints for a time, times, and dividing of time, in Daniel 7:25, we see again in Daniel 12:7, where he scatters the power of the holy people for a time, times, and an half. Notice any correlations?

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Daniel 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

Daniel 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people. 25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Daniel 9:26  And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Daniel 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Daniel 11: 33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days. 34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries. 35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

Daniel 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

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The little horn who wears out the saints during the time, times, and dividing of time in Daniel 7:25, is the little horn in Daniel 8:10 ..

.No, this statement is myth. Daniel speaks of two "little horns." one comes up out of 10, but Antiochus comes out of one of four. 

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we see again in Daniel 11:31 polluting the sanctuary of strength and taking away the daily sacrifice. 

 Yes, Daniel 11 also speaks of Antiochus. Have you ever read these chapters in the Amplified text? It might help you.  Where you miss it is simple: you are pulling verses in chapter 8 OUT OF THEIR CONTEXT. Don't take my word for it: go back and study it: the contest is the 4 generals that took over after Alexander the Great died, and more specifice in the later end of THEIR reign. Antouchus came from the Seleucus general. 

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This little horn/the prince in Daniel 8:11 and 9:26-27 

You have to pull verses out of their context to say this - proving it to be error.  If you had said "this little horn from chapter 7 and 9:26" you would be right. Daniel 8 is specifically about Alexander's kingdom and near the very end of it. (176 BC)

 

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Daniel 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, 

Daniel 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, 

Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise,

 

  All these are speaking of Antiochus. Of course, if people are willing to pull verses out of context, they can make the bible say almost anything.  I won't do that. 

In short, Daniel 8 is NOT ABOUT our future; it is (IN CONTEXT) about the four generals who took over after Alexander died, and then in the latter time of THEIR reign. That time is called the Diadochi. Don't take my word for this: go back and really STUDY chapter 8. 

Here is one key: "²³ And in the latter time of their kingdom..."

Ignore this and you will end up in error. 

[luigi]

41 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

.No, this statement is myth. Daniel speaks of two "little horns." one comes up out of 10, but Antiochus comes out of one of four. 

 Yes, Daniel 11 also speaks of Antiochus. Have you ever read these chapters in the Amplified text? It might help you.  Where you miss it is simple: you are pulling verses in chapter 8 OUT OF THEIR CONTEXT. Don't take my word for it: go back and study it: the contest is the 4 generals that took over after Alexander the Great died, and more specifice in the later end of THEIR reign. Antouchus came from the Seleucus general. 

You have to pull verses out of their context to say this - proving it to be error.  If you had said "this little horn from chapter 7 and 9:26" you would be right. Daniel 8 is specifically about Alexander's kingdom and near the very end of it. (176 BC)

 

  All these are speaking of Antiochus. Of course, if people are willing to pull verses out of context, they can make the bible say almost anything.  I won't do that. 

In short, Daniel 8 is NOT ABOUT our future; it is (IN CONTEXT) about the four generals who took over after Alexander died, and then in the latter time of THEIR reign. That time is called the Diadochi. Don't take my word for this: go back and really STUDY chapter 8. 

Here is one key: "²³ And in the latter time of their kingdom..."

Ignore this and you will end up in error. 

Your perspective which ignores the mountain of correlations, not only denies the Word in Daniel 8:17 & 19, and 12:4 & 9 that state these events will occur during the end times, but you also make the Lord to look like an author of confusion, which He is not (1 Corinthians 14:44). Your closed frame of mind keeps you from recognizing other data in scriptures regarding the little horn, who is the ten horned beast's mouth. For example, as the Lord informs us in Daniel 8:11 & 25, and Daniel 11:36-37 the little horn magnifies himself above all, including the Lord, we then see this narcissist who exalts himself, and magnifies himself above all that is called God (Daniel 11:36), again in 2 Thessalonians 2:4. And as the wide consensus on the man of sin in 2 Thessalonians 2 represents the Antichrist, I then recognize the little horn/the ten horned beast's mouth/the prince in Daniel chapters 7 through 12 as the Antichrist. Do you recognize the correlation between the individual in Daniel 11:36 with that in 2 Thessalonians 2:4, or do you recognize these as two different individuals who have the same massive narcissistic character?

 So Daniel 8:17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Daniel 8:19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Daniel 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Daniel 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done. 37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Edited June 12, 2020 by luigi

[iamlamad]

1 hour ago, luigi said:

Your perspective which ignores the mountain of correlations, not only denies the Word in Daniel 8:17 & 19, and 12:4 & 9 that state these events will occur during the end times, but you also make the Lord to look like an author of confusion, which He is not (1 Corinthians 14:44). Your closed frame of mind keeps you from recognizing other data in scriptures regarding the little horn, who is the ten horned beast's mouth. For example, as the Lord informs us in Daniel 8:11 & 25, and Daniel 11:36-37 the little horn magnifies himself above all, including the Lord, we then see this narcissist who exalts himself, and magnifies himself above all that is called God (Daniel 11:36), again in 2 Thessalonians 2:4. And as the wide consensus on the man of sin in 2 Thessalonians 2 represents the Antichrist, I then recognize the little horn/the ten horned beast's mouth/the prince in Daniel chapters 7 through 12 as the Antichrist. Do you recognize the correlation between the individual in Daniel 11:36 with that in 2 Thessalonians 2:4, or do you recognize these as two different individuals who have the same massive narcissistic character?

 So Daniel 8:17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Daniel 8:19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Daniel 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Daniel 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done. 37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

No matter how many times you go over this, you will still be wrong because you ignore the key verse.

for at the time of the end shall be the vision.  What "end" in context?

the last end of the indignation:for at the time appointed the end shall be.  What "end" in context? What "Indignation"

Why do you continue to IGNORE the key verse that tells us WHAT END?

 

 

8:³ Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: ... The ram is Persia

⁴ I saw the ram ... The ram is Persia

⁵ And as I was considering, behold, an he goat ...the goat had a notable horn between his eyes. This is Alexander the Great

⁶ And he came to the ram that had two horns, .Alexander is very angry with Darius of Persia.

⁷ And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, Alexander WHIPPED Darius soundly.

⁸ Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones 

Alexander died and for Generals took over, Seleucus being one of the four that ended up over Israel.

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,  This little horn is Antiochus who came from one of the four Generals, Seleucus

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. Antiochus killed some of the Jews. He treated them terribly. 

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, When Antiochus came against the daily Sacrifices (STARTED by the pre-incarnate Jesus), he was coming against the PRINCE, Jesus. 

¹² And an host was given him Antiochus'  army was behind him doing his bidding. 

¹³ Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision The vision of everthing in the verses above, but especially Antioch and the ceasing of the daily sacrifices: HOW LONG? 

¹⁴ And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. IN CONTEXT the time it will be until the temple is cleansed and the Daily Sacrifices can begin again.

¹⁵ And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.

¹⁶ And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

¹⁷ So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision. Now Gabriel is going to explain the above.

¹⁸ Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright.

¹⁹ And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be. WHAT "indignation?" OF COURSE the one just mentioned: Antiochus stopping all activities of Worshiping the God of Heaven, but in particular the stopping of the daily sacrifices.

²⁰ The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia. Alexander and Darius

²¹ And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king. Alexander

²² Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, Lysimachus, Cassander, Ptolomy 1, Seleucus

²³ And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.  WHOSE Kingdom? The kingdoms of Lysimachus, Cassander, Ptolomy 1, Seleucus

WHO is the king of fierce countenance from these 4 Kings? ANTIOCHUS!!  (NOT ten horns and an 11th coming up. That is a DIFFERENT little horn.)

So far NOT ONE WORD that would even HINT of anything of our future. But some INSIST in pulling verses out of context. 

²⁴ And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people. WHOSE power?  Antiochus. But He was assisted by demonic power. 

²⁵ And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand. When Antiochus forced the stopping of any kind of worship of the God of Heaven, He was coming against the PRINCE of princes: GOD HIMSELF.

²⁶ And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many days.  It is TRUTH: why can't people just believe it as written instead of trying to change it? 

²⁷ And I Daniel fainted, and was sick certain days; afterward I rose up, and did the king's business; and I was astonished at the vision, but none understood it.

Please show us all what verse, what words cause you to think this has ANYTHING to do with our future? Don't waste your time: there is NOTHING in this chapter about our future. IN CONTEXT It is about Persia first, then Greece, then Seleucus. 

[luigi]

1 minute ago, iamlamad said:

No matter how many times you go over this, you will still be wrong because you ignore the key verse.

for at the time of the end shall be the vision.  What "end" in context?

the last end of the indignation:for at the time appointed the end shall be.  What "end" in context? What "Indignation"

Why do you continue to IGNORE the key verse that tells us WHAT END?

 

 

8:³ Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: ... The ram is Persia

⁴ I saw the ram ... The ram is Persia

⁵ And as I was considering, behold, an he goat ...the goat had a notable horn between his eyes. This is Alexander the Great

⁶ And he came to the ram that had two horns, .Alexander is very angry with Darius of Persia.

⁷ And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, Alexander WHIPPED Darius soundly.

⁸ Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones 

Alexander died and for Generals took over, Seleucus being one of the four that ended up over Israel.

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,  This little horn is Antiochus who came from one of the four Generals, Seleucus

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. Antiochus killed some of the Jews. He treated them terribly. 

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, When Antiochus came against the daily Sacrifices (STARTED by the pre-incarnate Jesus), he was coming against the PRINCE, Jesus. 

¹² And an host was given him Antiochus'  army was behind him doing his bidding. 

¹³ Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision The vision of everthing in the verses above, but especially Antioch and the ceasing of the daily sacrifices: HOW LONG? 

¹⁴ And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. IN CONTEXT the time it will be until the temple is cleansed and the Daily Sacrifices can begin again.

¹⁵ And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.

¹⁶ And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

¹⁷ So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision. Now Gabriel is going to explain the above.

¹⁸ Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright.

¹⁹ And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be. WHAT "indignation?" OF COURSE the one just mentioned: Antiochus stopping all activities of Worshiping the God of Heaven, but in particular the stopping of the daily sacrifices.

²⁰ The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia. Alexander and Darius

²¹ And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king. Alexander

²² Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, Lysimachus, Cassander, Ptolomy 1, Seleucus

²³ And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.  WHOSE Kingdom? The kingdoms of Lysimachus, Cassander, Ptolomy 1, Seleucus

WHO is the king of fierce countenance from these 4 Kings? ANTIOCHUS!!  (NOT ten horns and an 11th coming up. That is a DIFFERENT little horn.)

So far NOT ONE WORD that would even HINT of anything of our future. But some INSIST in pulling verses out of context. 

²⁴ And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people. WHOSE power?  Antiochus. But He was assisted by demonic power. 

²⁵ And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand. When Antiochus forced the stopping of any kind of worship of the God of Heaven, He was coming against the PRINCE of princes: GOD HIMSELF.

²⁶ And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many days.  It is TRUTH: why can't people just believe it as written instead of trying to change it? 

²⁷ And I Daniel fainted, and was sick certain days; afterward I rose up, and did the king's business; and I was astonished at the vision, but none understood it.

Please show us all what verse, what words cause you to think this has ANYTHING to do with our future? Don't waste your time: there is NOTHING in this chapter about our future. IN CONTEXT It is about Persia first, then Greece, then Seleucus. 

Unlike yourself who twists the Word to mean a different end times than those of the end times, I prefer to accept the simple truth about the end times to mean the end times.

Let me ask you a simple question; do you think the Lord is a fool and blind, and would not recognize the correlations in His own Word?  Here is another correlation in the Word about the little horn, who is the ten horned beast's mouth who speaks great things in Daniel 7:8 & 20 which also appears in Revelation 13:5. The Lord provides us with these correlations deliberately so that we can cross reference them and attain a more accurate assessment of what is going on. It is people who put on blinders to the Lords Word and prefer the pretty stories the devil puts out there in commentaries that deny the Word, that has kept these data from progressing.

Daniel 7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

Daniel 7:20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

Revelation 13:5  And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

[luigi]

19 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

 

²³ And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.  

In the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, correlates with when the last end of the indignation appears (Daniel 8:19). Do you understand what the last end of the indignation means? Does the final indignation happen in some vague BC event? Or does the last end of the indignation more likely occur when lawlessness is running rampant as when the man of sin in 2 Thessalonians 2 appears?

 Daniel 8:19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

2 Thessalonians 2:7  For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

[iamlamad]

20 minutes ago, luigi said:

In the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, correlates with when the last end of the indignation appears (Daniel 8:19). Do you understand what the last end of the indignation means? Does the final indignation happen in some vague BC event? Or does the last end of the indignation more likely occur when lawlessness is running rampant as when the man of sin in 2 Thessalonians 2 appears?

 Daniel 8:19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

2 Thessalonians 2:7  For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Do you have any concept of what CONTEXT means? The indignation in question is speaking of what Antiochus did: preventing ANY KIND of worship.  You can't tie ANYTHING in chapter 8 to anything else in another chapter, EXCEPT in chapter 11 that also talks about Antiochus. You can't jump to some OTHER "indignation" and suppose what is written here can fit. 

This is a classic case of preconceived glasses blinding a reader to what is really written.

Edited June 12, 2020 by iamlamad

[Revelation Man]

22 hours ago, The Light said:

Are you saying that the End Time King in Daniel 11 is from the Greek Kingdoms?

He has to be from TWO KINGDOMS at once, that is the conundrum, my post with all the maps expressly points this out. He not only has to be from the Fourth Beasts Head {Little Horn} in Dan. 7, but he ALSO HAS TO BE from one of the Four Generals Kingdoms in the latter time,so God has given us a Riddle that could not really be fully understood until these end times. So he has to be born in BOTH KINGDOMS at once, and who would HAVE ever thunk it 2000 years ago, or 200 years ago, Greece is now in a nation called the E.U. !! So he is born in Greece, we know its Greece because none of the other Three Kingdoms are in the E.U. and he must arise out of BOTH KINGDOMS at the same time.

Now, as I have stated before, we can understand why God gave us such a DETAILED RUNDOWN of the Greek Kings Lineage in Daniel 11. It runs from Alexander the Great to Antiochus Epiphanes as THE TYPE then we see in verse 36 THE Anti-Christ. We are even shown the False Prophet TYPE under Antiochus if we dig deep. A man named Jason {real name Yeshua} who bribed Antiochus to become the Jewish High Priest by having his pious brother Onias III killed, then tries to Hellenize the Jews, which brought forth the Maccabean Revolt. The same thing will happen in the end times, there will be a Jewish High Priest named over ALL Religion world wide. He will be the Religious Beast. We see him doing what in Rev. 13 ? Making an IMAGE of the Beast and demanding that ALL MEN worship him or die. 

Again, in Daniel 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, TOWARD the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

This CAN NOT be the Seleucid Empire because he can't be NORTHWEST of Israel, nor can the Potolemy Empire. Only Cansander can ATTACK TOWARDS the South, East and Israel...........or from the Northwest. So, he is born in Greece {Cassander} and comes to power in the E.U. 

 

Edited June 13, 2020 by Revelation Man