Rom 8.1 KJV vs modern translations

[Jedi4Yahweh]

KJV:  [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. - Rom 8:1 KJV

Modern Translations:

NIV: Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, - Rom 8:1 NIV

ESB: There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. - Rom 8:1 ESV

You see the difference.  This makes a huge difference and misleading.  KJV makes it conditional based on if your walking according to the flesh vs. the Spirit. 

Paul even further clarifies what are the deeds of the flesh and those who do them will not inherit the Kingdom of God:

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. - Gal 5:19-21 KJV

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. - 1Co 6:9-10 KJV

Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience, in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them. But now you yourselves are to put off all these: anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy language out of your mouth. Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds, - Col 3:5-9 NKJV

Edited September 27, 2020 by Jedi4Yahweh

[Speks]

Does verse 4 help?

[Jedi4Yahweh]

4 minutes ago, Speks said:

Does verse 4 help?

Omitting text from the bible never helps.

[Speks]

KJV and Bible aren't synonymous terms. This is well worn subject where the dust never settles.

Believers of opposing views spiritually prosper by reading God's Word in various translations, although some are better than others, and a few should be avoided.

[Jayne]

 

26 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

Omitting text from the bible never helps.

Can you prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that that phrase has been omitted and not added.

Besides, my NIV that I am looking at right now has that phrase in the footnotes and explains that it is from a later set of manuscripts.

You are claiming in your OP that the phrase is necessary because there is a condition on salvation.  You seem to be saying Christians cannot commit any of those sins else the condemnation comes back and the salvation is reneged.

My belief is that Christians should NOT participate in works of the flesh, but if they do, the Holy Spirit convicts and there is Jesus, our Mediator, who heals and forgives.

Or am I misunderstanding what you are saying about this being conditional.

Edited September 27, 2020 by Jayne

[Jedi4Yahweh]

8 minutes ago, Jayne said:

 

Can you prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that that phrase has been omitted and not added.

Besides, my NIV that I am looking at right now has that phrase in the footnotes and explain.

The Masoretic (Hebrew) and Textus Receptus (Greek) is the most trusted source of text that the KJV was copied from.  Modern Translations use a verity of other text to include the Masoretic and Greek(TR) but choose to leave out text when in dispute with other text or on the opinion of the translators.  Most modern day translation do not have true lexicon that you can trace back to the original source like the KJV.

Edited September 27, 2020 by Jedi4Yahweh

[Justin Adams]

It is unfortunate that the rewritten Masoretic text does leave out things that the original LXX included. That is WHY they had a rewrite made.

Qumran originals and scraps of Israeli texts inform us of these differences. Since the LXX was banned for most Jewish uses, it is unfortunate. If scholars reconstruct the ancient Hebrew text from the LXX, they can see these differences from the 'modern' Masoretic version. These agree more readily with ancient Hebrew and paleo-Hebrew.

Originally, Hebrew texts that we no longer have were used to create the Targums. The the earlier Hebrew texts were used as a basis for the LXX. (the Greek Tanakh).

Edited September 27, 2020 by Justin Adams

[Deborah_]

1 hour ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

KJV:  [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. - Rom 8:1 KJV

Modern Translations:

NIV: Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, - Rom 8:1 NIV

ESB: There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. - Rom 8:1 ESV

You see the difference.  This makes a huge difference and misleading.  KJV makes it conditional based on if your walking according to the flesh vs. the Spirit.

But if you read down to verse 4 in the NIV, you will find the words, "who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit."

The difference between the KJV and the modern translations is not that the KJV has these words and the others don't, but that the KJV duplicates them and the others have them just once.

[JTC]

43 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

There are 2 things important about this part of the verse. First, is as you said that the person can't be sinning all the time. But in addition to living with as little sins as possible the person has to be living as righteously as possible.

44 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Unfortunately, people like me just don't understand old English. I've read the NIV, NKJV & ESV Bibles more times than I can count but when I read a verse in the KJV I almost always have to look at it in the NIV to be sure what it means. But luckily the Bible says the same thing in many other places. Considering that the Bible does say this, why is it being taught that how a person lives won't effect his eternal destiny? Paul seems to be saying that if you live in a way where adultery (or those other sins) are a part of your everyday life that you won't go to heaven. That's how I understand this teaching. But what if the adulterer also accepted Christ, then will he get into heaven? This is what many people think. I don't agree. I'm not talking about someone who messed up and had 1 or 2 adulterous affairs, I mean a person who is committing adultery as part of his everyday life over his whole life (or 1 of the other sins mentioned). I believe Paul knew what he was talking about. This is why I strive to live as sin free as I possibly can. But every time I talk about this I get flamed by several people and very few come to my aid. I think this is a very serious problem in the Christian community. We need to understand this. Some think that because they accepted Jesus they can commit any sin they want, as often as they want, and they will be forgiven. They see no reason to try and live in any way that doesn't tickle their fancy. I'm not saying that any of us will succeed in living 100% without sins but we have to be striving to do so if we expect to get into heaven. And we all expect to get into heaven.

I'm glad you brought this up, Jedi4Yahweh. 

[David1701]

1 hour ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

KJV:  [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. - Rom 8:1 KJV

Modern Translations:

NIV: Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, - Rom 8:1 NIV

ESB: There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. - Rom 8:1 ESV

You see the difference.  This makes a huge difference and misleading.  KJV makes it conditional based on if your walking according to the flesh vs. the Spirit. 

The latter part of Rom. 8:1, in the TR and Majority Text based translations, is descriptive, not conditional.  Those who are in Christ Jesus are described as those who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.  The same thing is taught in 1 John 3.

1 John 3:8-10

8 He who practises sin is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was manifested: that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whoever has been born of God does not practise sin, because his seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. 
10 In this the children of God are manifest and the children of the devil: whoever is not doing righteousness is not of God, neither is he who is not loving his brother.