The Sabbath

[OneLight]

58 minutes ago, johnthebaptist said:

Having an all day, everyday, conversation with the Lord would be a good habit to get in to, it seems to me.

It wold be.  How would you tell someone who doesn't pray much to do so?  Pretend I know nothing about prayer.  Explain to me how this is done.

[Waggles]

6 hours ago, Waggles said:

Your muddling the waters.

I think that should actually read - You are muddying the waters.

[Tammy Roesch]

5 hours ago, walla299 said:

I've had 3 businesses over the years . . . same thing. You can't always be in church on Sunday - at least not if you're on call and are a diesel mechanic. Don't get me started on the oil field side of things. Ugh. Life doesn't work that way. I do what I can to avoid work on Sunday, but there are times when it cannot be avoided.

On Daniel: I was thinking more about when Daniel and crew asked their keeper to test them on their diet because they didn't want to eat from the king's table and defile themselves. They didn't have that much choice about things. Rather than go the rebel route I believe Daniel used the wisdom and good sense God gave him . . . test us and see if we don't look better in a few weeks . . . and God blessed that. It really was a win-win for the guard chief - his head wouldn't be in danger, and Daniel and crew didn't have to defile themselves. He did what he could to obey the Lord and He honored that. 

Honestly, (and please don't think I'm being critical, it's just my honest belief...) I believe that if God commands us to do something, and especially if He says REMEMBER, we better not forget it.  We better find a way to do it.

 

[Tammy Roesch]

9 hours ago, Waggles said:

No you are interpreting my posts from your point of view. I have not condemned Moses nor the Law -

BUT the NT is not about Moses and the Law in the requirements of the Levitical priesthood and Temple worship.

The moral principles and moral intent of the Law still applies to Spirit-filled Christians but not in in ordinances written on tablets of stone. Thus we are free to worship on Sundays and remember the sacrifice and mercy freely given by God on our behalf.

Here it is not the particular day of the week that is important, but the equivalent moral purpose of putting aside one day to have fellowship with God and with our brothers and sisters. 

Also the indwelling Holy Spirit and praying in tongues is the sabbath - the rest - the refreshing. 

Waggles, the Sabbath isn't an ORDINANCE.  The ORDINANCES were all the things having to do with the  Ceremonial Laws.

The Sabbath was "written in stone" symbolic that it NEVER CHANGES.  Why is it that so many Christians today believe it's OK to break the 4th Commandment but it's wrong to break 1-3 and 5-10 of the 10 Commandments?  They are ALL from God HIMSELF, written with HIS FINGER on STONE...and the one everyone is FORGETTING is the ONLY ONE that said REMEMBER.  That really should make us think.

[Tammy Roesch]

9 hours ago, Waggles said:

Wow that is an extraordinary interpretation of NT scripture.

Sorry do not agree with you on this. 

Sundays are quite OK.

Also what is a Saturday sabbath but a ceremonial holy day !!

That is where you are confused.  There is the MORAL LAW and the CEREMONIAL LAW.  The SABBATH is a part of the MORAL LAW, along with all the other 9 Commandments.  It's not part of the CEREMONIAL LAW.  The CEREMONIAL LAW was nailed to the Cross when Jesus died for us.  Everything in the Ceremonial law pointed to Jesus and when He came, TYPE met ANTI-Type and that was the END of the Ceremonial Law.  The reason we don't offer lambs now is because JESUS IS THE LAMB if we accept Him as our Savior.

Waggles, do you believe you should keep the other 9 Commandments?  or do you believe Christians are free to break them as well?

[Tammy Roesch]

8 hours ago, johnthebaptist said:

There are people who use the teachings of Paul to convince themselves that it's okay to sin. It's not.

And so to this thread: One of the Ten Commandments is that we should rest on the sabbath. I believe it is good advice. As for which day a person chooses as the sabbath, it doesn't matter to me.

But it does matter to God. "Remember the 7th Day to keep it holy..."

[Tammy Roesch]

5 hours ago, Marathoner said:

You're quite right about the endless argumentation, John. I've shared passages of scripture wherein the apostle Paul explains how we died with Christ and because we died and were buried with Him, the law no longer has dominion over us. The dominion of the law ends with death. The ordinances and those letters graven in stone passed away with our Lord's crucifixion.

Ah, but I've also pointed out that at no time was the Sabbath day changed to a different day of the week, speaking only of Sabbath observance. Because we who are in Christ are no longer under the law nor bound to observe the ordinances, this is a matter of liberty. Let no one forbid any from observing the Sabbath day, and let no one condemn those who do not observe the Sabbath day.

As others have shared in this topic, the above sums up the apostle's words from different passages of the NT letters. I've shared these passages many times before on the forum, so there's no need to copy and paste them again.  

Marathoner, do you separate the 4th Commandment from the other 10 then, or do you thin it's OK to break all 10 of the Commandments?  

The 10 Commandments are the MORAL LAW not the CEREMONIAL LAW.  It was the Ceremonial Law that was nailed to the cross when Jesus died.  The MORAL LAW is just as in tact today as it was the day God gave it to us.

I really don't think you believe it's OK to murder, steal, lie and commit adultery.  So why do you believe it's OK to break the Sabbath?  They are all part of the SAME LAW.

[Justin Adams]

The ordinances were never written by the Finger of our Lord on Tablets of Stone.

I do not see any of the Ten Words ever being abolished.

Yes, the old covenant with all its trappings was destroyed with the age of the Jews in 70 AD. The new Covenant was inaugurated just before The Crucifixion. But nowhere do I see the TEN WORDS as having passed away.

[Alive]

11 hours ago, Waggles said:

Wow that is an extraordinary interpretation of NT scripture.

Sorry do not agree with you on this. 

Sundays are quite OK.

Also what is a Saturday sabbath but a ceremonial holy day !!

Yup--

Rom. 14:1 (NAS20S)   Now accept the one who is weak in faith, but not to have quarrels over opinions.   One person has faith that he may eat all things, but the one who is weak eats only vegetables. ³ The one who eats is not to regard with contempt the one who does not eat, and the one who does not eat is not to judge the one who eats, for God has accepted him.   Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

Rom. 14:5 (NAS20S)    One person values one day over another, another values every day the same. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. ⁶ The one who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and the one who eats, does so with regard to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat, it is for the Lord that he does not eat, and he gives thanks to God. ⁷ For not one of us lives for himself, and not one dies for himself; ⁸ for if we live, we live for the Lord, or if we die, we die for the Lord; therefore whether we live or die, we are the Lord’s. ⁹ For to this end Christ died and lived again, that He might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.

[Alive]

8 hours ago, Marathoner said:

You're quite right about the endless argumentation, John. I've shared passages of scripture wherein the apostle Paul explains how we died with Christ and because we died and were buried with Him, the law no longer has dominion over us. The dominion of the law ends with death. The ordinances and those letters graven in stone passed away with our Lord's crucifixion.

Ah, but I've also pointed out that at no time was the Sabbath day changed to a different day of the week, speaking only of Sabbath observance. Because we who are in Christ are no longer under the law nor bound to observe the ordinances, this is a matter of liberty. Let no one forbid any from observing the Sabbath day, and let no one condemn those who do not observe the Sabbath day.

As others have shared in this topic, the above sums up the apostle's words from different passages of the NT letters. I've shared these passages many times before on the forum, so there's no need to copy and paste them again.  

Yup---in a nutshell, the sabbath was a type of and a looking forward to the 'rest'--the True Rest, that Christ provides for us, by way of substitution and fullfillment. In Christ, we cease our own works in terms of what satisfies God's righteous requirement, and walk in those works that He has determined--In Christ.

All of these things--everything that involved the New Economy--are all wrapped up in an understanding of the reality of the Cross, Resurrection and Ascension and our inclusion. This is why Paul said that he had determined to know nothing but Christ and Him Crucified--when speaking to the Corinthians. Paul knows that all NT doctrine proceeds and ends with the Cross. When young believers are taught those things as the foundation--they are to be well established. Everything flows from Calvary.