Jerusalem is Falling #2

[Hobie_]

On 2/9/2022 at 12:52 PM, abcdef said:

I don't understand exactly what you are saying or where in the scriptures you are referring to.

Maybe you could expand on your statement a little bit, thanks.

Who tried to destroy the true followers of God by forbidding any the Bible and persecuting those who had them or taught from it and destroyed those who did not follow it with the inquisition and torture and death. Its not hard to figure out...

 

 

[WilliamL]

On 3/8/2022 at 3:02 PM, abcdef said:

You are saying that people would remember something from 2400 years ago, but forget how to make modern weapons in, say, 7 years, or less?

Kind of a contradiction isn't it?

Not at all. Records are much, much easier to keep than sophisticated technology and equipment. As proved by the Dead Sea Scrolls, for merely one example.

[abcdef]

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

"How are the things of Esau searched out!
how are his hidden things sought up!"
Obadiah 1:6

"And I hated Esau... Whereas Edom says, we are impoverished,
but we will return and build the desolate places;
Thus says the Lord, they may build, but I will throw down..."
Malachi 1:3-4

"For the violence against thy brother Jacob,
shame shall cover thee, and you shall be cut off forever."

"In the day that the strangers carried away captive
his people, and foreigners entered into his gates,
and casts lots upon Jerusalem, even you were as one of them."

"You should not have gloated over your brother
in the day that he became a stranger."

"You should not have entered into the gates
of my people in the day of their calamity."

What is the date for the writing of the book of Obadiah?

What happened to the Edomites after Obadiah was written?

The land mass areas that the Edomites controlled is still there, but the Edomite people are not a distinct tribe/group anymore.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

"Neither should you have stood in the crossroads
to cut off those of his that did escape
neither should you have made captive those of his that did remain"
Obadiah 1:10-14

When the people of Judah/Israel were fleeing from enemies, Edom sided with the enemies of Judah/Israel and not with their brothers, blood relatives, Jacob/Esau.

There have been many crossroads in that area through time. Why do you think that the prophecy is about our time exclusively and not fulfilled in some other time period?

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

[those checkpoints, at crossroads, literally enslave people today,
because of those checkpoints it can be very hard for people
to do basic things like go to the grocery store.

Who are the check points enslaving? The people who want to cause death and injury to citizens? Yes.

The check points are there because of terrorists and murderers.

Wouldn't it be great if everyone loved and cared about each other? But in those areas people are taught that Israel must die. Their one hope of salvation, Israel and  Jesus, but Cain killed Abel, Cain still kills Able, throughout the history of the human souls and even today. Sometimes there must be checkpoints, to keep Cain out.

There could have been peace, many years ago, after 1967, but the powers that hate Israel were supplied by Iran and other Islamic gentile nations.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

And I know you'll say that Obadiah happened already
but let us read on]

"Because the day of the Lord is near....
And deliverers shall come up on mount Zion
to judge the mount of Esau;
and the kingdom shall be the Lords."
Obadiah 1:15,21

Which "Day of the Lord is this? There are many "Days of the Lord" against different nations and at different times.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

Sure sounds like an end time passage to me.

Why? Because it says "the Day of the Lord"?

There are many "Days of the Lord", it isn't necessarily the very last "Day of the Lord", when the resurrection takes place.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

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"Those who were beheaded"

Is not a reference to one person who was beheaded,
but to those who were beheaded, just as it says.

This is true.

Maybe you are thinking that this "beheading" is a future event. But where in the Bible does it say, that someone was beheaded? 

John the Baptist would be an obvious choice. He was beheaded.

He did not bear the Roman/Caesar mark of the beast.

He was resurrected with Jesus and the OT saints and ascended to heaven with Jesus, from paradise to heaven.

We live in the kingdom now and are ruled by the words of John's testimony, "Behold the Lamb of God, ..." John 1:29, 36.

John the Baptist was probably not the only soul who was beheaded in that time period and was raised when Jesus ascended.

We are at the end of the millennium time period right now. The words of the OT and NT have guided the faithful in the kingdom since the Day of Pentecost when the kingdom rule on earth began. 

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On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

"There shall be a resurrection of the dead,
of both the just and the unjust"
Acts 24:15

1st resurrection, Jesus, The thief on the cross, John the Baptist, Moses, Noah, Adam, all the faithful from the OT, both Israel and Gentile.

2nd resurrection, All those who have died. First the dead in Christ, then we who are alive. 

After the good are resurrected/raptured, all the people on planet earth will die first, before the evil are brought to judgment. This will happen in, "... the same hour ...", Rev 11:13.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

1. Ezekiel 37:1-15  Resurrection of the just

1st resurrection, Jesus and the OT saints. John 5:25. 33 AD

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

2. Ezekiel 37:15-28 Reign of the Messiah

The kingdom on planet earth began on the Day of Pentecost and has been here ever since. It will end its presence on planet earth forever at the resur/rapt when Jesus comes for the kingdom. 

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

3.  Ezekiel 38 and 39 Gog and Magog

History

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

 

1.  1 Corinthians 15:23 Resurrection of the just

1st resurrection, Jesus and the OT saints, both Israel and gentiles.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

"afterwards, they that are Christ's at His coming"

This event is imminent.

2nd resurrection. Those faithful since the 1st resurrection.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

2.  1 Corinthians 15:24 -25 Reign/Kingdom given to God.

After death is destroyed.

Parallel to Rev 20:14-15.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

3.  1 Corinthians 15:25-26  no more death

No more being separated from God and His everlasting love. 

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

And Revelation is the book that gets very specific,
shedding light on all the above passages.

1. Revelation 20:4-5 Resurrection of the just

Jesus and the OT saints, 33AD

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

2. Revelation 20:5-7 Reign

Now and since the 1st resurrection/Day of Pentecost.

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

3. Revelation 20:7-10 Gog and Magog

Look, I want to agree with you that the 6th seal is the Magog battle.

But it is not the Ezek 38-39 Magog, that is the battle of Armageddon, it is the Rev 20:8-9 Magog, that is the 6th vial battle of Armageddon.

Both the 6th vial and the Rev 20 battle show armies headed to restored Jerusalem. 

This is happening now.

 

On 3/11/2022 at 8:02 AM, Desopixi Seilynam said:

 

Revelation 20:11-13 Resurrection of the unjust.

Revelation 21:3 Kingdom given to God
Revelation 21:4 "no more death"

When the kingdom is given to God, then after that, the wedding takes place, Rev 21.

The wedding cannot take place before death is destroyed.

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[abcdef]

On 3/12/2022 at 8:00 AM, Hobie_ said:

Who tried to destroy the true followers of God by forbidding any the Bible and persecuting those who had them or taught from it and destroyed those who did not follow it with the inquisition and torture and death. Its not hard to figure out...

Yes, the RCC is the beast, but it is only part of the beast, the "image" of the original Roman Empire beast.

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Please think about this,

The 7 times are the same time period as the Dan. 2 statue. 

The 3 1/2 times, are describing the 2 parts of the time periods of the statue, to make 7 times.

1st 3 1/2, From Babylon until the great scattering of 70 AD, Dan. 12:7.

2nd 3 1/2, From 70 AD until the restoration of Israel to Jerusalem, 1967.

So when Jerusalem was restored in 1967, that ended the time of the statue and the 7 times.

----

The second 3 1/2 times is showing the time that the Roman beast rules over Israel from 70 AD onward.

Not just the image beast exclusively or the time of the little horn exclusively, but the entire lifetime of the beast while ruling over the people of Israel from 70 AD onward.

So in your calculations of the 3 1/2 times, the Roman Empire must be included in the time period.

But putting the 1260 days as years and applying them to the RCC exclusively, cannot satisfy the requirements of the entire 7 times.

That is, if you are saying that the 1260 days are years, and are applying them to the RCC, then there must be another 3 1/2 times (1260 years) before or after the 1260 that you are applying to the RCC time period, to make the 7 times.

Can you find the other 3 1/2 times to make the 7 times complete?

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[abcdef]

On 3/13/2022 at 2:02 PM, WilliamL said:

Not at all. Records are much, much easier to keep than sophisticated technology and equipment.

I think that on the internet there is more information than 1000's of books.

It is kept for us on websites that we can access while we sit behind our computer or phone.

That is easy.

Trying to keep books and papers from deteriorating is hard over the years.

I have some books that are almost 150 years old. Trying to preserve them and use them is almost impossible, as the pages are falling apart and the bindings are broken from use.

When you look at the records that do survive 100's of years, they are usually associated with stones like tablets, or metals like coins. 

Our phones have more information than most libraries, it seems. How convenient.

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On 3/13/2022 at 2:02 PM, WilliamL said:

As proved by the Dead Sea Scrolls, for merely one example.

The dead sea scrolls are a good example of how hard it is for records to survive. 

If they were not put in jars, in caves, in a super dry environment, they would never have sustained their form.

Most paper records were destroyed or fell apart over time.

It may be that somewhere there is a stone monument that will tell about the Ezek 38-39 war of Israel.

I have some books, I will have to look and see if I can find something solid to offer.

I have a map from the early 1900's that shows Magog as occupying roughly the same area as the modern Kurds in northern Iraq.

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Who exactly is Magog, in Ezek 38-39?

Who exactly is Magog in Rev 20?

--

[Desopixi Seilynam]

On 3/19/2022 at 3:12 PM, abcdef said:

When the kingdom is given to God, then after that, the wedding takes place, Rev 21.

Revelation 19
"The marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready...."

Revelation 19 describes the first resurrection, the day of vengeance,
when the righteous literally get to see the vengeance and
wash their feet in the blood of the wicked (Psalm 58:10, Malachi 4:3-5)
as they come down with Christ as part of His army.

The marriage of the Lamb;
"Wheresoever the bodies are, there will the birds be gathered together"
Matthew 24:28, Luke 17:34-37
 

"The marriage of the Lamb has come...
the armies of earth gathered against them....
and all the birds were filled with their flesh."
Revelation chapter 19 describes the marriage of the Lamb.

After that the resurrected saints reign on this earth as it is for 1000 years.
Rev 20:4-7

After that the devil is allowed to deceive the world into attacking
the camp of the saints.
Rev 20:7-10

But a fire comes down from heaven and destroys everything.
Rev 20:10, 2 Peter 3:8-12

After that there is no more sea, this sky and earth are destroyed.
Rev 21:1

After that the kingdom is given up to God,
eternity without any death at all begins.
Rev 21:2-8

 

 

[abcdef]

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

Revelation 19
"The marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready...."

This seems to say that the wedding is taking place at this point in time, just before the Rev 19:11-21 battle.

But there are some major problems with this.

1. The kingdom is not complete. There are many souls still to be added. The kingdom cannot be complete until after the last judgment and death is destroyed.

2. The kingdom is not delivered up to the Father until after death is destroyed, 1 Cor 15:23-28.

3. The Rev 19:7-21, Doesn't show a wedding. It shows a battle between the Word of God scriptures (sword) and the beast nation for the souls of people.

4. Rev 19:21, Ends the timeline for the passage and Rev 20:1 begins a new timeline that begins with the 1st resurrection when Jesus rose in 33 AD ish.

5. The marriage is shown in Rev 21:1-4. The wedding cannot take place twice. The kingdom is not delivered up to the Father until after death is destroyed, 1 Cor 15:23-28.

--

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

 

Revelation 19 describes the first resurrection,

Rev 19 doesn't show a resurrection. Which verse shows a resurrection?

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

the day of vengeance,
when the righteous literally get to see the vengeance

Rev 19:11-21, shows the victory over the beast nation Rome. This took place when Rome became a Christian nation in the 4th century.

The Roman Empire was defeated by the preaching of the gospel Sword converting people to Christ. The kingdom "devoured" the Empire. 

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

and
wash their feet in the blood of the wicked (Psalm 58:10, Malachi 4:3-5)
as they come down with Christ as part of His army.

Rev 19:11, Shows that heaven is opened, but it does not say that Jesus returns to this planet.

The saints with Jesus are OT saints who were resurrected with Jesus at the first resurrection in 33 AD. 

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

The marriage of the Lamb;
"Wheresoever the bodies are, there will the birds be gathered together"
Matthew 24:28, Luke 17:34-37
 

"The marriage of the Lamb has come...
the armies of earth gathered against them....
and all the birds were filled with their flesh."
Revelation chapter 19 describes the marriage of the Lamb.

Does the battle, sound like a marriage to you? Where is the marriage?

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

After that the resurrected saints reign on this earth as it is for 1000 years.
Rev 20:4-7

Please consider this, that the millennium is actually showing the time of the new covenant, from the day of Pentecost (33 AD) until the second resurrection (soon).

The time of the kingdom on planet earth, yes, but the kingdom is within us Lk 17:20 21, and we are here now, on this planet earth. 

The kingdom will never be a land mass with borders on this planet.

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

After that the devil is allowed to deceive the world into attacking
the camp of the saints.
Rev 20:7-10

The dragon Rev 20:2, has already deceived the nations into surrounding restored to Israel Jerusalem. The final surrounding is taking place now, is underway now.

The battle of Armageddon will soon take place between Iran, Syria, Egypt, Russia, and Israel. Then Jerusalem will be surrounded.

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

But a fire comes down from heaven and destroys everything.
Rev 20:10, 2 Peter 3:8-12

What do you think about the "fire" from heaven?

What is it?

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

After that there is no more sea, this sky and earth are destroyed.
Rev 21:1

This material planet earth and universe "fly away" from the throne in Rev 20:11.

 

6 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

After that the kingdom is given up to God,
eternity without any death at all begins.
Rev 21:2-8

1 Cor 15:23-28, Shows the complete kingdom being delivered up to God after death is destroyed.

Rev 21:2, Shows the kingdom coming down from God, after death is destroyed, for the wedding.

--

The event of death being destroyed shows that these are parallel passages.

1st resurrection, Jesus 33 AD.

2nd resurrection, He comes for the kingdom, soon.

*Death is destroyed.

Jesus delivers the kingdom up to the Father.

The kingdom coming down from the Father

The wedding.

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