God and Evil?

[other one]

10 hours ago, branchesofHim said:

Please provide scripture to validate your opinion on this, not a commentary from someone else.

Our problem is with that word "Evil"    If you look at the word in Hebrew it's not what we really think of as Evil in a narrow sense.

Here is the Strong's definition of that Hebrew word:

Quote

OT:7451
adversity, affliction, bad, calamity,  displease (-ure), distress, evil ([-favouredness], man, thing),  exceedingly,  great, grief (-vous), harm, heavy, hurt (-ful), ill (favoured),  mark, mischief (-vous), misery, naught (-ty), noisome,  not please, sad (-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked (-ly, -ness, one), worse (-st), wretchedness, wrong. [Incl. feminine ra`ah; as adjective or noun.].
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)
 

I do believe that the context of that verse isn't speaking of evil being something of the devil, but more of the adversity side of it.

The translation that I use renders the word as "creating calamity".  I don't see God creating true (modern English) evil in any way.  Even the New King James translation uses "create calamity".

 

[other one]

1 hour ago, Justin Adams said:

..is anyone forgetting Gen 6?  

I think the only way to tie genesis six to this thread would be through God giving us (including the angels) free will.  The evil in Genesis 6 came from a couple of hundred rebellious angels and I don't find anywhere it was really the will of God.  Maybe I'm just confused.

[Justin Adams]

6 minutes ago, other one said:

I think the only way to tie genesis six to this thread would be through God giving us (including the angels) free will.  The evil in Genesis 6 came from a couple of hundred rebellious angels and I don't find anywhere it was really the will of God.  Maybe I'm just confused.

Not confused, but other readers need the whole story and not the sanitized accounts. I do not think in any way the the Lord High God has to stoop so low. But He does know the end from the beginning...

He drops enough clues and bread-crumbs for us to be able to figure a lot of it out...

Edited February 26, 2022 by Justin Adams

[other one]

1 minute ago, Justin Adams said:

Not confused, but other readers need the whole story and not the sanitized accounts. I do not think in any way the the Lord High God has to stoop so low. But He does know the end from the beginning...

yes, but once he turned free will loose, he kind of lost full control of what we all decided to make happen.  He knows what I will decide to do next week, but I don't see him stopping me from making those decisions.   It's really kind of scary.  It's kind of like watching your kid walking over to the stove with his finger pointing and knowing he's going to burn his finger but you have to let him experience it because it is still his decision even though you tell him no.   In my case you just can't get to him in time, but in Gods case he's made the decision to let us do our thing.   He, like the concerned parent, talks to me, but it took me a long time to learn to listen and then a little longer to pay attention.

[Heleadethme]

12 hours ago, branchesofHim said:

God is good. God is love. God is light. God is God and there is none other. Everyone agree?

Since all of the above is true according to scripture, why does Isaiah's record of God seem to be at variance? Or is it? What do you think?

Isaiah 45:[5] I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
[6] That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
[7] I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

I believe we need to take into account God's foreknowledge with this.  He did indeed create the angels that fell, knowing beforehand that they would fall.  Same with mankind.  From the beginning He has known everything that is going to happen, everything evil that man and devil, who He created, would do, and taken it all into account already.....He is sovereign over all and is going to prove it in the end.  Even where it says no weapon formed against us will prosper...is because He created the devil to make the weapon in the first place.  God in His wisdom which is above our wisdom, working all things together for our good.....

2Co 4:17

For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory

Isa 54:16-17

Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument (weapon) for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD.

 

It should comfort us greatly knowing that all power in the universe is His....that is why it is the Lord God we worship and to Him we appeal in times of trouble...because He has the power over all power.

Rom 13:1

Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

[Still Alive]

I just see it this way: evil = bad thing happens. When We dropped the nukes on Japan, that was "evil" from the Japanese perspective because it was a bad thing happening to them. And we saved probably ten million of them.

When Israel was told to wipe out entire nations, from the other nation's perspective, that was "evil" from their perspective. But it was israel doing something that they  interpreted as a bad thing happening to them.

And when you have a difficult professor who gives you an F because your work was poor, that is "evil/bad". But it's not the professor's fault.

And when I slaughter one of my chickens, that is "evil/bad" from the chicken's perspective.

[other one]

3 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Do please support those statements with scripture. 

 

1. The ONLY way to tie Genesis 6 to the thread is through God's provision of free will.
    
2. The evil in Genesis 6 is due to rebellious angels.
    
3. God gave humans free will, but evil is not God's will. 
    
4. Those three views above are tied to this thread. 

 

Thanks in advance. 

 

 

reading through the thread, I would have to have a definition of what you think the word evil means.  if it is the same as causes calamity, then God is evil.

[missmuffet]

Did God create evil?

https://www.gotquestions.org

At first it might seem that if God created all things, then evil must have been created by God. However, evil is not a “thing” like a rock or electricity. You cannot have a jar of evil. Evil has no existence of its own; it is really the absence of good. For example, holes are real but they only exist in something else. We call the absence of dirt a hole, but it cannot be separated from the dirt. So when God created, it is true that all He created was good. One of the good things God made was creatures who had the freedom to choose good. In order to have a real choice, God had to allow there to be something besides good to choose. So, God allowed these free angels and humans to choose good or reject good (evil). When a bad relationship exists between two good things we call that evil, but it does not become a “thing” that required God to create it.

 

Perhaps a further illustration will help. If a person is asked, “Does cold exist?” the answer would likely be “yes.” However, this is incorrect. Cold does not exist. Cold is the absence of heat. Similarly, darkness does not exist; it is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good, or better, evil is the absence of God. God did not have to create evil, but rather only allow for the absence of good.God did not create evil, but He does allow evil. If God had not allowed for the possibility of evil, both mankind and angels would be serving God out of obligation, not choice. He did not want “robots” that simply did what He wanted them to do because of their “programming.” God allowed for the possibility of evil so that we could genuinely have a free will and choose whether or not we wanted to serve Him.As finite human beings, we can never fully understand an infinite God (Romans 11:33-34). Sometimes we think we understand why God is doing something, only to find out later that it was for a different purpose than we originally thought. God looks at things from a holy, eternal perspective. We look at things from a sinful, earthly, and temporal perspective. Why did God put man on earth knowing that Adam and Eve would sin and therefore bring evil, death, and suffering on all mankind? Why didn’t He just create us all and leave us in heaven where we would be perfect and without suffering? These questions cannot be adequately answered this side of eternity. What we can know is whatever God does is holy and perfect and ultimately will glorify Him. God allowed for the possibility of evil in order to give us a true choice in regards to whether we worship Him. God did not create evil, but He allowed it. If He had not allowed evil, we would be worshiping Him out of obligation, not by a choice of our own will.

Edited February 26, 2022 by missmuffet

[Warrior of truth]

Evil is here in the form of tyranny...

Unfortunately, many lost people are supporting it

Edited February 26, 2022 by Warrior of truth

[Michael37]

1 hour ago, Warrior of truth said:

Evil is here in the form of tyranny...

Unfortunately, many lost people are supporting it

How astonishing, that the lost would support tyranny.

Isaiah 57:20-21

But the wicked are like the storm-tossed sea, for it cannot be still, and its waves churn up mire and muck. “There is no peace,” says my God, “for the wicked.”

Rev 13:1-2  Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name.  (2)  Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority.