Salvation by the blood of the Lamb is a ship stranded on dry sand.

[Neighbor]

21 minutes ago, R. Hartono said:

And God only saved one Lot's family, minus his naughty wife. Isn't that the picture ?

No that is not the picture. By your analogy, would Moses be condemned or saved?

Salvation is not a journey it is a turning about made to happen by God through the Holy Spirit to seeing and accepting Jesus as Lord God and personal savior.

Salvation can happen at a church setting. It can happen while alone in a garage. It can happen while being crucified to one's death on a cross. It can happen  while in a death bed without ability to  sojourn anywhere, nor do any good deed, nor good work whatsoever.

Salvation is totally of God by God through God alone.

[farouk]

Not a Scriptural sentiment in the title....

[other one]

39 minutes ago, R. Hartono said:

The point is that the Ship of Salvation doesnt take people anywhere without good deed. 

I would say the reverse.   Good deeds take a person nowhere.      It is true that by nature a saved person will have some good deeds, but the good deeds are just a simple result of having Jesus as your Lord....    making a big deal out of good deeds focuses on the wrong things.        I have said for years here that if a person has no good deeds at all, I personally would question their salvation in my mind..    but only Jesus knows.

[farouk]

@Rosie1jack2pauline3 Thanks for the 'well said'....

[other one]

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

There were not even 10 good people in Sodom. And God only saved one Lot's family, minus his naughty wife. Isnt that the picture ?

It's not the picture of life around me.     My wife and I traveled all across the USA for about 25 weeks a year from 2009 to 2020 and in the people we met I would say it isn't even the picture of most of the USA.     I guess maybe we should compare what we mean by good people.    Jesus said no one was good but God, and if that's your standard then I guess I might have to agree.   But he wasn't looking for people living up to the level of good as God's example, so I'm not sure what we're talking about.

The people in Sodom were not just not good, they were actually evil.   We did not meet very many evil people in our years of travel.  But I would say I did meet some in the 70s when I was researching the occult.

And we do have some in Washington DC, but we have a lot more than ten good ones just in our church.

I know people who do good things, but they are not followers of "Lord" Jesus.    And I think I can say I don't know anyone who really follows Jesus as Lord that does not do good things for all people and the welfare of the church as a whole.

The Bible speaks of people who were doing miracles and even casting out demons and Jesus told them he never knew them and I supposed sent them to hell because they were not following his second command.

I guess what I'm trying to say is don't look for good works, look for us being subjects to the Lord....   You can tell pretty quickly if a person considers Jesus thier Lord.   No matter if they have works or not.    But looking for works can be deceiving.

[Sower]

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

The point is that the Ship of Salvation doesn't take people anywhere without good deed. 

Cool. I reckon you don't believe the thief on the cross didn't make it, huh, not doing even one good work?

Then he, the thief, said, "Jesus, remember me, when you come into your kingdom."

Jesus  replied to him, "Amen, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise."

[Mr. M]

11 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Luke 13:3 ......unless you repent you shall all perish. 

Nobody is going anywhere unless they repent. Salvation needs Grace and mutual effort by mankind too :

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James 2%3A24&version=NIV 

Christians without repentance  efforts of compassions and forgiving others are the wrecked ships stranded on the sand. The common typical picture we might encounter in the neighbourhood. Not only they curse those who did no wrong to them howbeit they will forgive people.

Acts 26:

19 “Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, 

20 but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea,

and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance.

And while the fruit of the Spirit must manifest in our lives progressively, the Lord has made clear

what the fruit of repentance is, for it can be obtained while it is still called Today.

John 15:

 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire,

and it shall be done for you. 

8 By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples.

All that is required is a childlike, willing heart.

Amen?

[Mama Etna]

The title of this thread denigrates the salvic work that Jesus did on the Cross.  Works are the result of being saved.  They do not save you.  Placing works first is putting the cart before the horse.

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, farouk said:

Not a Scriptural sentiment in the title....

Reported as such. Glad someone else agrees with me. 

[Michael37]

1 minute ago, Mama Etna said:

The title of this thread denigrates the salvic work that Jesus did on the Cross.  Works are the result of being saved.  They do not save you.  Placing works first is putting the cart before the horse.

Thankyou @Mama Etna I want moderation to act accordingly.