Four questions for YECs - (and a little history of creationism vs evolution)

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, ChristB4us said:

The same scholars that believe the behemoth in Job 40th chapter was an elephant, hippo, or an alligator?  Don't let them do your homework for you when the evolution theory has tainted the education of scholars for how they read the Bible now.

The "same scholars"?  Really?  How do you know?  You don't have to worry about being tainted with the demonic evolution theory.  

1 hour ago, ChristB4us said:

The English word "son" was derived from the Hebrew word "ben" which is defined as ;  from 'banah' (1129); a son (as a builder of the family name), in the widest sense (of literal and figurative relationship, including grandson, subject, nation, quality or condition, etc., (like ''ab' (1), ''ach' (251), etc.)):--+ afflicted, age, (Ahoh-) (Ammon-) (Hachmon-) (Lev-)ite, (anoint-)ed one, appointed to, (+) arrow, (Assyr-) (Babylon-) (Egypt-) (Grec-)ian, one born, bough, branch, breed, + (young) bullock, + (young) calf, X came up in, child, colt, X common, X corn, daughter, X of first, + firstborn, foal, + very fruitful, + postage, X in, + kid, + lamb, (+) man, meet, + mighty, + nephew, old, (+) people, + rebel, + robber, X servant born, X soldier, son, + spark, + steward, + stranger, X surely, them of, + tumultuous one, + valiant(-est), whelp, worthy, young (one), youth.

King James Bible Strong's Hebrew Dictionary

Jesus said this;

Matthew 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

The marriage covenant is what God performs and this is why He would not be joining any fallen angel to a woman to be called a wife to that fallen angel in His words.  The sons of God are the godly lineage of Seth that the nation of Israel came from as all other children of Adam that were not of Seth, were not of that godly lineage as these were the lineages that the sons of God married into.

This can also be taken as a Biblical example for why the nation of Israel was not to marry outside the nation of Israel, but they did it anyway.

Therefore the sons of God was always a reference to Israel's family tree, but now the sons of God is a reference to Christians as the new sons of God under the New Covenant by being believers in Jesus Christ. 

You are free to your own opinions, but you can't explain WHY or HOW all 3 ancient myths (Greek, Roman and Nordic) are parallel accounts, with mainly name changes.

How do you explain the Nordic myths, which were formed FAR AWAY from both Roman and Greek culture, came up with the SAME STORIES?  Just luck?

[ChristB4us]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

EXCEPT FOR 

These SONS OF GOD were WATCHING and celebrating the EARTH BEING CREATED

1Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,

2Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?

3Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.

4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

6Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;

7When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

You are reading that and applying that as most do but at the expense of scripture of Jesus plainly stating that God does not marry angels, let alone fallen angels.

Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

What was the result of this union?  Giants and mighty men of renown but still men.

Can scripture go against scripture for how God answered Job?  No.

And yet these same sons of God were the ones that were presenting themselves to the Lord at the time Satan was among them for WHEN God pointed out Job among the sons of God BOTH times to Satan.

So how do we read and apply that verse 7 of yours?

Were the sons of God glorifying God in His creations as we do in worship? 

So Job was among the sons of God singing to that fact that morning of worship.

Even though God pointed out that he was not there when He had laid the foundations of the earth earlier, he was among the sons of God singing that truth when they were presenting themselves to the Lord on that day of worship.

You have to really wonder why BOTH TIMES the Lord pointed out Job to Satan while the sons of God were presenting themselves to the Lord because Job was among the very sons of God.

[NConly]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I believe our earth body became corrupted and so the process of death began, but his spiritual body 'died' which is why we need to be born from above, because it would no longer be 'passed on' though birth of the flesh 

My thoughts are different about this. Imo the spirit never dies the body and the soul can die. Spirit goes back to God. So the spirit did not die that day it returned to God.

So you are right it is not passed on we have to be born again, baptized, and believe in Jesus.

Ezekiel 18:4

Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Heb 4:12

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

  Gen 2:7

And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Ecc 12:7

“Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”

[ChristB4us]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

The "same scholars"?  Really?  How do you know?  You don't have to worry about being tainted with the demonic evolution theory.  

You are free to your own opinions, but you can't explain WHY or HOW all 3 ancient myths (Greek, Roman and Nordic) are parallel accounts, with mainly name changes.

How do you explain the Nordic myths, which were formed FAR AWAY from both Roman and Greek culture, came up with the SAME STORIES?  Just luck?

We are warned about fables.  And since poetic licensing was being done at Alexandria, it does not take a whole lot of discernment to see what happened with the Book of Enoch.  All they have to do is quote a couple of legitimate scripture to make it seem legit and yet the style of writing does not align with the quoted scripture in that Book of Enoch while going against the accepted scripture.  Hence it is a fraud.

1 Timothy 1:4Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

1 Timothy 4:7But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. 5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

Titus 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth. 15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

And you are still ignoring the very words of Jesus.

Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Jesus's own words rejects the Book of Enoch as a fraud.

[FreeGrace]

On 4/30/2023 at 8:02 PM, ChristB4us said:

We are warned about fables.  And since poetic licensing was being done at Alexandria, it does not take a whole lot of discernment to see what happened with the Book of Enoch.  All they have to do is quote a couple of legitimate scripture to make it seem legit and yet the style of writing does not align with the quoted scripture in that Book of Enoch while going against the accepted scripture.  Hence it is a fraud.

Are you really unaware that the Bible was inspired by the Holy Spirit?  So you are basically claiming that the Holy Spirit included fraudulent stuff when He was inspiring Jude.  Amazing.  It doesn't matter what "was being done at Alexandria".  Why do you think it does matter?  When the Holy Spirit is involved, you can be sure that it is what God wants US to know.

On 4/30/2023 at 8:02 PM, ChristB4us said:

And you are still ignoring the very words of Jesus.

You are free to think whatever you want.  I KNOW what Jesus said.  And He didn't say that angels couldn't have sex.  He SAID they didn't marry or were given in marriage.

Why are you going beyond what is written?

On 4/30/2023 at 8:02 PM, ChristB4us said:

Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Jesus's own words rejects the Book of Enoch as a fraud.

Not in the slightest.  If the book of Enoch was fraudulent, then the Holy Spirit wouldn't have unspired Jude to quote from it.  I'm amazed that you don't see that.

And again, Jesus didn't say angels are asexual.  They don't marry.  That is what He SAID.  And I believe Him.

[teddyv]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

 If the book of Enoch was fraudulent, then the Holy Spirit wouldn't have unspired Jude to quote from it.  I'm amazed that you don't see that.

Paul quotes some Greek philosophers. Are they inspired?

[ChristB4us]

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Are you really unaware that the Bible was inspired by the Holy Spirit?  So you are basically claiming that the Holy Spirit included fraudulent stuff when He was inspiring Jude.  Amazing.  It doesn't matter what "was being done at Alexandria".  Why do you think it does matter?  When the Holy Spirit is involved, you can be sure that it is what God wants US to know.

Think of the Book of Enoch in this way;  if you wanted to make a fake Book of Enoch, you would quote some accepted scripture from Jude to make it look authentic.

Hence the Book of Enoch came after Jude.

Now when the author of the Book of Enoch is claiming to be Enoch himself, how did this happen?  Moses never referred to Enoch's writing as if Noah had brought it with him after the flood. 

Enoch Chapter 1

Enoch 1: 4 Who will hereafter tread upon Mount Sinai; appear with his hosts; and be manifested in the strength of his power from heaven.

Wow.  Mt. Sinai before that mountain became Mt. Sinai because that was why it was called such from which the Ten Commandments came from.

First clue of plagiarism right there.

Then you have to discern the offsprings in that book of Enoch.  How can spirits mingle with flesh for flesh to give birth to flesh?

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Is it any wonder why the result of this union are giants & mighty men but still men?

Genesis 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. 3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. 4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

Not the angels as in the sons of heaven, as the Book of Enoch claims.

Enoch Chapter 7

Enoch 7:1. It happened after the sons of men had multiplied in those days, that daughters were born to them, elegant and beautiful. 2. And when the angels, the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and let us beget children.

So angels that were not made to procreate, suddenly decide they can?  Not!!  We do not see them as written as fallen angels.  Funny that.

And if you read Enoch chapter 18, it testifies that there were celestial objects in the heavens that did not come forth when God called them forth and were in a "hell" in the third heavens which is God's throne.

Book of Enoch Chapter 18

Enoch 18:16. The stars which roll over fire are those which transgressed the commandment of God before their time arrived; for they came not in their proper season. Therefore was He offended with them, and bound them, until the period of the consummation of their crimes in the secret year.

Yeah, right. ( <---- note of sarcasm) NOT!!!!

Isaiah 55:10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:

11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

12 For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.

Cults can tell nine truths and slip in one lie.

The lost books were not accepted because they were going against accepted scripture as in scripture cannot go against scripture.

Sine no lie can be of the truth, the Book of Enoch is a fake.

[other one]

11 minutes ago, ChristB4us said:

Think of the Book of Enoch in this way;  if you wanted to make a fake Book of Enoch, you would quote some accepted scripture from Jude to make it look authentic.

Hence the Book of Enoch came after Jude.

the first book of Enoch was before Jesus was born, not after.   Parts of it were within the Dead Sea Scrolls.  The knowledge in the first book of Enoch was part of the general cosmology in the second century BC.   It came long before the book of Jude.

I would say the the second book of Enoch is a bad translation of the first and the third book of Enoch was written around 300AD and is basically Jewish mysticism much like the Zohar.

[ChristB4us]

1 hour ago, other one said:

the first book of Enoch was before Jesus was born, not after.   Parts of it were within the Dead Sea Scrolls.  The knowledge in the first book of Enoch was part of the general cosmology in the second century BC.   It came long before the book of Jude.

I would say the the second book of Enoch is a bad translation of the first and the third book of Enoch was written around 300AD and is basically Jewish mysticism much like the Zohar.

Mayhap one of the Jewish fables we were warned about?

Titus 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

As there were only parts of it as found among the Dead Sea scrolls, there was another fragmented fable found of Satan having a union with Eve by whom Cain came from.  This developed into the false teachings of the Kenites as inferring the Jews were of that lineage and not real jews.

As it is, supposedly a whole Book of Enoch was found for why it should be considered also not only a fable but a plagiarized one.

Thanks for sharing.

[other one]

2 hours ago, ChristB4us said:

Mayhap one of the Jewish fables we were warned about?

Titus 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

As there were only parts of it as found among the Dead Sea scrolls, there was another fragmented fable found of Satan having a union with Eve by whom Cain came from.  This developed into the false teachings of the Kenites as inferring the Jews were of that lineage and not real jews.

As it is, supposedly a whole Book of Enoch was found for why it should be considered also not only a fable but a plagiarized one.

Thanks for sharing.

Pffft