Favourtism

[FJK]

I just see it as God having a different plan for each of us to fulfill.

They may not all be equally glamorous but all are equally important.

[Sower]

On 8/3/2023 at 1:49 AM, SpiritSong said:

What do you all think?

"As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means!

So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy.

For the Scripture says to Pharaoh,
“For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you,
and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”

Therefore God has mercy on whom He wants to have mercy, and He hardens whom He wants to harden."           Romans, 9

“But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the Lord.”

How you doing, Sower?
Better than I deserve!

[SpiritSong]

4 hours ago, Sower said:

"As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means!

So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy.

For the Scripture says to Pharaoh,
“For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you,
and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”

Therefore God has mercy on whom He wants to have mercy, and He hardens whom He wants to harden."           Romans, 9

“But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the Lord.”

How you doing, Sower?
Better than I deserve!

Excellent points, and I love how merciful God is. I have no disagreement here, but once again, these are not the things I was concerned about. Thank you for pointing them out though, as in these we do always need to remember God's sovereignty in everything.

My thoughts on the issue, however, are concentrated more on man's free will, which is also God-given, and which also means man has responsibility. 

In Jacob and Esau's case, I think Esau did not value his birthright enough, and was willing to give it away in exchange for a bowl of lentil soup, and it is this which Esau displeased the Lord with. Whereas Jacob literally did not give up the fight, even when his hip was out of joint.

We choose when to give up and when to move on, and I don't think we see responsibility in the same way that God does. What I do know is that the impact our actions have can be generational. We are not God but we can still have an effect on each other and future generations.

Jesus even said that every idle word we say would be taken into account. We have a real responsibility.

Bless you. 🙏

 

[AdHoc]

9 hours ago, Sower said:

"As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means!

So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy.

For the Scripture says to Pharaoh,
“For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you,
and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”

Therefore God has mercy on whom He wants to have mercy, and He hardens whom He wants to harden."           Romans, 9

“But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the Lord.”

How you doing, Sower?
Better than I deserve!

 

4 hours ago, SpiritSong said:

Excellent points, and I love how merciful God is. I have no disagreement here, but once again, these are not the things I was concerned about. Thank you for pointing them out though, as in these we do always need to remember God's sovereignty in everything.

My thoughts on the issue, however, are concentrated more on man's free will, which is also God-given, and which also means man has responsibility. 

In Jacob and Esau's case, I think Esau did not value his birthright enough, and was willing to give it away in exchange for a bowl of lentil soup, and it is this which Esau displeased the Lord with. Whereas Jacob literally did not give up the fight, even when his hip was out of joint.

We choose when to give up and when to move on, and I don't think we see responsibility in the same way that God does. What I do know is that the impact our actions have can be generational. We are not God but we can still have an effect on each other and future generations.

Jesus even said that every idle word we say would be taken into account. We have a real responsibility.

Bless you. 🙏

 

A good example - Esau's choice.

The hatred of God is not easily provoked. Of His disciples in the New Testament He requires then, "to love their enemies" (Matt.5:44, Lk.6:27, 35). So what did Esau's choice entail?

God had given promises to his grandfather Abraham. These were then sealed with a blood Covenant. They form the first step in God's costly and elaborate plan to recover man and the earth. To Adam and Eve had been promised the, "SEED of the woman", and now we see that from Sarah would come KINGS (Gen.17:16). That is, the ultimate recovery of man and the earth would rest on Esau's line. This line would produce "that holy thing" (Lk.1:35). The most prestigious genealogy of all time, and a "holy" thing, was Esau's. We should have read, into the ages to come, of "The God of Abraham, Isaac and ESAU". Instead we read "the God of Abraham, Isaac and JACOB". This grand title did Esau esteem small and unholy.

Esau had God's promise that he would have a double portion and that as seed of Abraham, nations and kings would come out of him. (Gen.17:6). But what of his FAITH? At the time he sold his birthright he had no offspring. But he shouts that if he does not get the soup he will die! He displayed disdain for God's Word. He had NO FAITH.

Esau despised his parents. He knew that they would be distressed if he took wives from the cursed Canaanites. So he did. He displayed no care that the curse would fall on the family who was to be "a blessing to all families of the earth". God's command to honor your parents does not have conditions. Whether good or bad parents, you are commanded to honor them. the reason is that they are your ORIGIN. And at the end of that ORIGIN is God (see Luke 3:38).

Now, Esau was attractive to men and women. He was Plain, strong, a provider and good looking - a man's man. But in the eyes of God a PROFANE man. In the THREE HOLY THINGS ABOVE, Esau showed his contempt. But this is not all. He himself diminished the value of his birthright AND he blew it in one sitting. Now, we have a number of examples of people who put little value on HOLY THINGS. Judas Iscariot, Ananias and Saphira, those of 1st Corinthians who partook of the Lord's table unworthily, and we have Uzzah who thought he could touch the Ark of the Covenant - though he meant well. The fact of the matter is that while God is very longsuffering, merciful and forgiving, He has another appreciation of what is HOLY. And the record shows that it is an exceedingly dangerous thing to tamper with that which God has deemed holy.

 

[SpiritSong]

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

 

A good example - Esau's choice.

The hatred of God is not easily provoked. Of His disciples in the New Testament He requires then, "to love their enemies" (Matt.5:44, Lk.6:27, 35). So what did Esau's choice entail?

God had given promises to his grandfather Abraham. These were then sealed with a blood Covenant. They form the first step in God's costly and elaborate plan to recover man and the earth. To Adam and Eve had been promised the, "SEED of the woman", and now we see that from Sarah would come KINGS (Gen.17:16). That is, the ultimate recovery of man and the earth would rest on Esau's line. This line would produce "that holy thing" (Lk.1:35). The most prestigious genealogy of all time, and a "holy" thing, was Esau's. We should have read, into the ages to come, of "The God of Abraham, Isaac and ESAU". Instead we read "the God of Abraham, Isaac and JACOB". This grand title did Esau esteem small and unholy.

Esau had God's promise that he would have a double portion and that as seed of Abraham, nations and kings would come out of him. (Gen.17:6). But what of his FAITH? At the time he sold his birthright he had no offspring. But he shouts that if he does not get the soup he will die! He displayed disdain for God's Word. He had NO FAITH.

Esau despised his parents. He knew that they would be distressed if he took wives from the cursed Canaanites. So he did. He displayed no care that the curse would fall on the family who was to be "a blessing to all families of the earth". God's command to honor your parents does not have conditions. Whether good or bad parents, you are commanded to honor them. the reason is that they are your ORIGIN. And at the end of that ORIGIN is God (see Luke 3:38).

Now, Esau was attractive to men and women. He was Plain, strong, a provider and good looking - a man's man. But in the eyes of God a PROFANE man. In the THREE HOLY THINGS ABOVE, Esau showed his contempt. But this is not all. He himself diminished the value of his birthright AND he blew it in one sitting. Now, we have a number of examples of people who put little value on HOLY THINGS. Judas Iscariot, Ananias and Saphira, those of 1st Corinthians who partook of the Lord's table unworthily, and we have Uzzah who thought he could touch the Ark of the Covenant - though he meant well. The fact of the matter is that while God is very longsuffering, merciful and forgiving, He has another appreciation of what is HOLY. And the record shows that it is an exceedingly dangerous thing to tamper with that which God has deemed holy.

 

I agree, and strongly, but again that's not what the OP is really about. 

Also, what three holy things above were you referring to? I I'm trying but I can't exactly understand what you were explaining there.

It is definitely dangerous to tamper with what God calls holy, 100%. Best thing is just not to do so 👍

[AdHoc]

6 hours ago, SpiritSong said:

I agree, and strongly, but again that's not what the OP is really about. 

I agree. The OP is not served by a study on Esau. Esau was favored by God and threw it away - the exact opposite of the title of the thread. Let's leave it till another day.

God bless.

[Dennis1209]

This thread is a unique topic seldom discussed. Secular sayings like “life is not fair” come to mind. As other biblical examples posted, the Prodigal Son and his siblings immediately come to mind, as well as the one lost sheep.

We can all affirm; favoritism has always been with us and is a biblical precept. The times, culture, heart, and status seem to influence bias. Favoritism can also be in the eye of the beholder in what we call “entitlement.” As was previously alluded to, the Western mind thinks and perceives differently than many other cultures and ages.

Also mentioned above, we strive to love our children equally, and we love them probably for different reasons and traits (personalities – character). Ideally, we try not to exhibit unfair partiality openly, but in practice, most of us have an inward favorite we strive to conceal, the firstborn in many instances.

From many moons ago, my two sons still harbor resentment and name it favoritism—an entitlement and keeping up with the Jones mentality.

At sixteen years old, I bought both my sons a used car because all their friends had one, blah, blah, blah, you know how that goes. Not a mention of a loan to buy a car, paying it back, how they would afford insurance, gasoline, etc.

I surprised them with non-flashy older model used cars, I would even call them jalopies as my wife did, but I made them safe and dependable, a learning automobile. At the time, finances were tight, and I did not want to go into debt with another loan. I paid the high insurance premiums and gas until they got part-time jobs at McDonald’s.

Father like sons. Except for sports, both my sons were relatively lazy and sloppy. It was like pulling teeth to get them to do chores or clean their rooms. One was a “C” student in school, the other a “D” student barely getting promoted to the subsequent grades.

On the other hand, my daughter was a straight “A” student making the honor roll on every report card, bar none. I learned quickly to control the tone of my voice when correcting her because she was sensitive and would cry because she disappointed me.

At seventeen years old, my daughter earned a free ride through college. So, she would have dependable transportation, but mainly as a reward, I bought her a brand-new car with all the bells and whistles and extended warranties; she more than earned it.

Twenty-some years later, my boys still bring that “unfairness” up from time to time to their mother.

I was backslidden during those decades. My attitude was I “owe” love, safety, food, a roof over their heads, direction, and a moral upbringing. I do not owe them the luxuries of life and status among their peers, even if I could afford it. By now, my sons have children, I would think they would have understood my reasoning and actions.

Yes, this “favoritism” still damaged our family relationship and dynamic. It reminds me of a proverb:

Ecclesiastes 1:9 (KJV) The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

I am a fallible, imperfect being; my choices and actions have consequences and repercussions.

[SpiritSong]

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

This thread is a unique topic seldom discussed. Secular sayings like “life is not fair” come to mind. As other biblical examples posted, the Prodigal Son and his siblings immediately come to mind, as well as the one lost sheep.

We can all affirm; favoritism has always been with us and is a biblical precept. The times, culture, heart, and status seem to influence bias. Favoritism can also be in the eye of the beholder in what we call “entitlement.” As was previously alluded to, the Western mind thinks and perceives differently than many other cultures and ages.

Also mentioned above, we strive to love our children equally, and we love them probably for different reasons and traits (personalities – character). Ideally, we try not to exhibit unfair partiality openly, but in practice, most of us have an inward favorite we strive to conceal, the firstborn in many instances.

From many moons ago, my two sons still harbor resentment and name it favoritism—an entitlement and keeping up with the Jones mentality.

At sixteen years old, I bought both my sons a used car because all their friends had one, blah, blah, blah, you know how that goes. Not a mention of a loan to buy a car, paying it back, how they would afford insurance, gasoline, etc.

I surprised them with non-flashy older model used cars, I would even call them jalopies as my wife did, but I made them safe and dependable, a learning automobile. At the time, finances were tight, and I did not want to go into debt with another loan. I paid the high insurance premiums and gas until they got part-time jobs at McDonald’s.

Father like sons. Except for sports, both my sons were relatively lazy and sloppy. It was like pulling teeth to get them to do chores or clean their rooms. One was a “C” student in school, the other a “D” student barely getting promoted to the subsequent grades.

On the other hand, my daughter was a straight “A” student making the honor roll on every report card, bar none. I learned quickly to control the tone of my voice when correcting her because she was sensitive and would cry because she disappointed me.

At seventeen years old, my daughter earned a free ride through college. So, she would have dependable transportation, but mainly as a reward, I bought her a brand-new car with all the bells and whistles and extended warranties; she more than earned it.

Twenty-some years later, my boys still bring that “unfairness” up from time to time to their mother.

I was backslidden during those decades. My attitude was I “owe” love, safety, food, a roof over their heads, direction, and a moral upbringing. I do not owe them the luxuries of life and status among their peers, even if I could afford it. By now, my sons have children, I would think they would have understood my reasoning and actions.

Yes, this “favoritism” still damaged our family relationship and dynamic. It reminds me of a proverb:

Ecclesiastes 1:9 (KJV) The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

I am a fallible, imperfect being; my choices and actions have consequences and repercussions.

It's hard when it comes to due rewards. With my three I try to be fair, especially as they grow out of toys and things that would so easily entertain them before, and with more mature entertainment being what it has come to be. I have three kids and my oldest is into tech, which is expensive, and my youngest is easiest to shop for, so they are going to feel outdone at some point.

But growing up the way I did, and remembering what I had to grow up in, I am very careful not to show partiality, but I do try to meet each of my kids exactly where each of them are.

Each of us are special to God, each of us reflect His image and we all have a purpose. Did Jacob's sons know they were heads of tribes? Did they know the Messiah would come from them? Not that they needed to be reminded every single day, but once again this thread isn't about God's favour, but man's favourtism. I just wonder if any of Joseph's brothers ever really considered their own worth instead of concentrating on his, when that's what they saw from their father.

I really am not trying to throw Jacob under the bus here, he experienced such a unique walk with God and was chosen for a reason. But the Word of God is there for us to learn. 

While we do have to guard against pride and arrogance, it's not arrogance to know we are special to God, or anyone else, or to know that we all have a purpose.

There's so much discouragement out there, why add to it?