Faith vs. Saving Faith

[farouk]

12 minutes ago, kwikphilly said:

Amen- exactly the point!

And let's not forget Abraham- counted as Righteous becsuse He Believed God

It's such a simple,humble response to God's Call .... isn't it? Much akin to someone bearing a present wrapped with a Gift inside- Accepting thst Gift is not an effort or a work- the Giver Has it,wrapped it,brought it,offered it and puts it in the hands of acceptance

Oh,what to say except " Thank You Lord"

 

 

 

@kwikphilly Reminds me of 2 Corinthians 9.15: "Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift."

[Cyoder]

I've thought of the thief on the cross many times. My belief is that he believed, repented and was saved.  He had no opportunity to do anything else.  It reminds me of Matthew 20 1-16.  "So, the last will be first and the first will be last". 

There are too many verses in the Bible that point to works plus belief equals salvation.  So many people just cherry pick John 3:16 and say, "I'm saved".  I always thought, what if the thief was pardoned at the last minute and was let down from the cross?  If he was allowed to live and went back to his evil ways and never repented, would he still be saved?  My guess is no. Jesus warns so many times of how we have to follow the rules and stay on the path.  Otherwise, his teachings would have been very simple.  Believe he is the Christ, and you are saved.  That is not anything close to what Jesus taught us.  I don't believe we can necessarily earn salvation.  I do believe we are expected to try our best to be as much like Jesus as we can.  You can't just live a life doing whatever you please.  In the end, only God can decide if we are worthy.  

[1to3]

Faith vs. Saving Faith

 

Romans 12:3-8
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

Gods Words says that without faith, it is IMPOSSIBLE to please Him

Heb. 11. [6] But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him.

diligentlly:   shows care and conscientiousness in one's work or duties. it is deeply intertwined with the qualities of faithfulness and perseverance

 

conscientiousness: trait of being responsible, careful, or diligent

 

God has given us all the measure of faith.,What we do with it , brings about different outcomes. See: parable of the sower,Matthew 13:18-23,Luke 8:5-15

Romans 12:3 says, “God hath dealt to every man THE measure of faith” (emphasis mine). God didn't give us different measures of faith; we all received THE measure of faith. If I were serving soup to a lot of people, and if I used the same ladle to dish it out, then that ladle would be THE measure.

Faith without Faithfulness is Faithlessness

satan and his fallen angels and demons and people following them are unfaithful to God and The Lord and Savior Christ Jesus and His Word

 

A good way to know where our faith in God is, is how faithful are we towards Him and His WORD

[1to3]

5 minutes ago, Cyoder said:

I always thought, what if the thief was pardoned at the last minute and was let down from the cross? 

Yes me too @Cyoder

The thief at the cross recognized he was a sinner and by faith/belief asked Christ Jesus to forgive him (see) Luke ch23 v 32-43

Remember me when You come into Your Kingdom.”Christ Jesus recognized and rewarded the faith and belief of the penitent thief, and so assured him that he would be with Him one day in His Kingdom. Forgiveness was implied in Jesus's answer, otherwise the thief would not be able to enter God's kingdom.

14 minutes ago, Cyoder said:

If he was allowed to live and went back to his evil ways and never repented, would he still be saved?  My guess is no. Jesus warns so many times of how we have to follow the rules and stay on the path.  Otherwise, his teachings would have been very simple.  Believe he is the Christ, and you are saved.  That is not anything close to what Jesus taught us. 

 

Yes I agree, Christ Jesus taught us through His Word, : If you love me keep my commandments.

John. 14. [15] Chriswt Jesus said: If ye love me, keep my commandments. [21] He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth Me: and he that loveth Me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest Myself to him.

Follow and to keep are actions =movement that Christ Jesus says if we truly love Him then we will keep and follow. ( we will make sure to plant our seed of faith in good soil and we will nurture that very seed and watch it grow.)

The Holy Spirit of God will do the pruning, to make way for more growth.

Yes in our walk with Christ Jesus, we do stumble and fall, but His Word in 1John ch 1 says that if we confess our sins He is faithful to forgive us, and help us back on our feet and He will keep showing us the True path to take by His ordinances = an authoritative order written to find and take good action from His living Word.

 

 

[1to3]

God Loves Faith.

Faith working through love

Faith is a manifestation of LOVE

 

One of the effects of Faith in God is that you are established, you don't look back, you don't look side to side, but go strait ahead.

Faith is prudent considers his steps.

Faith recognizes the Word  by its Spirit.

Faith is living by the Spirit and not the flesh.

Faith is moved by God and not by flesh

Faith does not get carried away by fear

Faith goes beyond that and Trust in God and His Word.

Faith rests in Christ Jesus.

Faith is a spiritual Law.

Just a few things Mark Hemans mentions in His message concerning faith.

Sermon can be found on you tube with the following title:

GOD loves a FAITH FILLED HEART!...Don't let fear run your life.

 

Faith is the work that God expects through us.

Faith is the work of God that you believe in who He sent.

John 6:29, Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one He has sent.” These folks want to do the works that God requires. Jesus simply tells them it is to believe in the one God has sent. The one God has sent is obviously Jesus, the Messiah, the Christ, the Saviour, the Lord, the beloved Son of God.

[BibleStudent100]

On 11/8/2024 at 4:29 PM, BornAgain490 said:

just remember: the fence belongs to Satan.

I heard an iteration of this when I was a child at church:

If you are a fence sitter, then really you are with Satan because God does not build fences to block us from walking with him, but Satan does.  And since you can only build a fence on your own property, Satan is the one who builds the fence and so the fence is on HIS property.  Thus, fence sitting does not work for placing oneself in a state of stasis or indecision.

Thanks for jogging an old memory BA 490!

[kwikphilly]

On 11/11/2024 at 5:24 PM, Cyoder said:

I've thought of the thief on the cross many times. My belief is that he believed, repented and was saved.  He had no opportunity to do anything else.  It reminds me of Matthew 20 1-16.  "So, the last will be first and the first will be last". 

There are too many verses in the Bible that point to works plus belief equals salvation.  So many people just cherry pick John 3:16 and say, "I'm saved".  I always thought, what if the thief was pardoned at the last minute and was let down from the cross?  If he was allowed to live and went back to his evil ways and never repented, would he still be saved?  My guess is no. Jesus warns so many times of how we have to follow the rules and stay on the path.  Otherwise, his teachings would have been very simple.  Believe he is the Christ, and you are saved.  That is not anything close to what Jesus taught us.  I don't believe we can necessarily earn salvation.  I do believe we are expected to try our best to be as much like Jesus as we can.  You can't just live a life doing whatever you please.  In the end, only God can decide if we are worthy.  

Well now- this fits right in with the Topic @Cyoder - if someone has that "Saving " Faith we are discussing we know they have been Born Again,don't we?

So if your Spirit is Made Alive in Christ and He is Abiding in you,you are Indwelled by Holy Spirit then how can anyone just go back to a life of sin?

This is likely why the Word of God Tells us that:

"We Know them by their Fruit"

Oh yes,there are sins of the flesh and people can struggle between flesh and spirit BUT a Born Again Believer is going to have a very difficult time trying to live as he did when he was dead in sin

This is probably a point that could easily turn into a OSAS discussion etc etc and it should not though your reply provokes much thought

Thanks for sharing

With love in Christ,Kwik

[kwikphilly]

17 hours ago, BibleStudent100 said:

I heard an iteration of this when I was a child at church:

If you are a fence sitter, then really you are with Satan because God does not build fences to block us from walking with him, but Satan does.  And since you can only build a fence on your own property, Satan is the one who builds the fence and so the fence is on HIS property.  Thus, fence sitting does not work for placing oneself in a state of stasis or indecision.

Thanks for jogging an old memory BA 490!

Amen! If you are not for Him then you are against Him..... you serve one or the other- there's no in-between

Lovely post

With love in Christ,Kwik

[farouk]

On 11/11/2024 at 5:24 PM, Cyoder said:

I've thought of the thief on the cross many times. My belief is that he believed, repented and was saved.  He had no opportunity to do anything else.  It reminds me of Matthew 20 1-16.  "So, the last will be first and the first will be last". 

There are too many verses in the Bible that point to works plus belief equals salvation.  So many people just cherry pick John 3:16 and say, "I'm saved".  I always thought, what if the thief was pardoned at the last minute and was let down from the cross?  If he was allowed to live and went back to his evil ways and never repented, would he still be saved?  My guess is no. Jesus warns so many times of how we have to follow the rules and stay on the path.  Otherwise, his teachings would have been very simple.  Believe he is the Christ, and you are saved.  That is not anything close to what Jesus taught us.  I don't believe we can necessarily earn salvation.  I do believe we are expected to try our best to be as much like Jesus as we can.  You can't just live a life doing whatever you please.  In the end, only God can decide if we are worthy.  

Remember, Paul said 'not of works' (Ephesians 2.9).

Romans 8 and John's First Epistle are strong on assurance for the true believer.

[Sower]

On 11/9/2024 at 7:38 AM, Neighbor said:

Hi, Begs the question (From me anyway) if one thinks and declares they have perfect discernment regarding their own faith already, how do they then grow further in their own faith? 

How does that work?

James 1:2-3, which says, "Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance".