Ten Horns - Ten Kings

[Luther]

On 1/24/2025 at 6:42 PM, Dennis1209 said:

I will not discuss my eschatological end-time views of things and events taking shape, but Trump's banter about Canada and Greenland is interesting. Trump sent an envoy to Greenland in the guise of national security and who knows what else. They were greeted in Greenland by many wearing MAGA hats. It appears to me that in the tribulation, the globe will be divided into ten global economic trading zones that will be handed over to the Antichrist. Could we be seeing the beginning?

 

Just what if the numbers of these kings, horns and heads are symbolic or figurative in nature? "10" ( fullness) ....fullness of the nations? "7"  (complete, perfect)..... complete kingdoms? 

Revelation 17:10

And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

Instead of looking at 7 or 8 different kingdoms, perhaps it is one complete kingdom of Satan, at different times throughout history. 

Revelation 17:12

And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

What if we are looking at more than ten kings or kingdoms, perhaps all of the unsaved nations coming up against God's people ( spiritually as well as physically)?

Revelation 17:16-17

[16]And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

[17]For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

" and give (their kingdom) unto the beast" ( not " their kingdoms").

Thoughts anyone?

 

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, Luther said:

Just what if the numbers of these kings, horns and heads are symbolic or figurative in nature? "10" ( fullness) ....fullness of the nations? "7"  (complete, perfect)..... complete kingdoms? 

Very good. They are super-symbolic, as you say.

Carry on.

[AdHoc]

6 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

I am simply stating the current state of human affairs and how I envision and interpret the near global system unfolding according to God’s word.

Firstly, by statement or implication, where do you think the M.O.B. is VISIBLE? The M.O.B. could be a tattoo, an eye patch emulating the A/C eye loss, a sub-dermal R.F.I.D. chip, or something entirely different. For many scriptural reasons, I heavily lean toward a type of R.F.I.D. chip, the size of or smaller than a grain of rice, which has already been implemented for pets, high-security areas, people prone to be kidnapped for ransom, etc.

It sounds as if we are on the same page with our thoughts. For brevity, I omitted the mark of the Beast. With the Biblical account, I cannot envision any other way of global commerce without the mark. I assume advanced technology and artificial intelligence are the only ways to control the world—the image of the Beast reeks of advanced technology alone.

Many former primitive tribes deep in the jungles of Africa and South America now have smartphones and towers, enabling internet access. Phones and towers are paid for and supplied by their respective governments; why?

Now, with Elon Musk’s constellation of hundreds of global satellites, every square inch of the planet has internet access. 5G technology will soon be antiquated. We now see the push and eventual requirement to be plugged into the system with biometric information, fingerprint, facial recognition, etc.

I have no unique insight, either. I only know the sequence of events and technology unfolding to implement a global, one-world system that one individual can completely control.

Everything from banking to grocery shopping is moving away from in-person to being done remotely. Soon, in the US, I will not need to press two to hear or read it in Spanish.

 

5 hours ago, chirpy said:

I struggle with the technology that appears to be needed by a one world controller, and the depiction of many perils of destruction to take place in the last days. 

Currently in the USA 3 areas are being developed for high concentrations of Data Centers... PA, WY and TX.

Each of those states is being tapped to develop nuclear power to supply the vast amounts of energy to run the AI data centers.

With masses of people dying from earthquakes, fire, hail, plagues, flooding, war...... how will they sustain power to the masses in order to be able to keep control and track everyone? 

All of this is feasible. We sure live in interesting times. I wonder if we 'll remember our opinions when the real thing happens.

The reason I go for the simple format is that the mark is visible and carries the number and name of the Beast. It is not the world's population that must register, but an obvious sign of being connected to the Beast.

What peaks my interest is the lack of scripture showing Christians  caving in and taking the Mark. Could it be that the Beast only wants to kill them because he knows that a Christian has already called on his adversary - the Lord Jesus.

Just thinking.

[BlindSeeker]

On 1/29/2025 at 12:52 PM, Luther said:

Just what if the numbers of these kings, horns and heads are symbolic or figurative in nature? "10" ( fullness) ....fullness of the nations? "7"  (complete, perfect)..... complete kingdoms? 

Revelation 17:10

And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

Instead of looking at 7 or 8 different kingdoms, perhaps it is one complete kingdom of Satan, at different times throughout history. 

SO what happens if it all concludes with an 8th?

Rev 17:11 - And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goes into perdition.

We know at the time, "five are fallen" and in the dust bin of history, and likely the next two follow as well, and unquestionably, the 8th goes into annihilation. So, when it says "the eighth is of the seven," what deos eight represent?

Does is mean "the eighth is of the seven" that is a a conglomeration of all? Perhaps a melting pot of all? Like, a land of immigrants? Or, does it mean it is a direct descendant of the 7th?

 

Edited February 5 by BlindSeeker

[Michael37]

44 minutes ago, BlindSeeker said:

SO what happens if it all concludes with an 8th?

I like the Berean Study Bible for its clarity:

Rev 17:8-11 BSB The beast that you saw—it was, and now is no more, but is about to come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction.

And those who dwell on the earth whose names were not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world

will marvel when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet will be.  

(9)  This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits.  (10)  There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while.

 (11)  The beast that was, and now is not, is an eighth king, who belongs to the other seven and is going into destruction.

I believe the previous seven kings and by inference, kingdoms, originally portrayed metaphorically as heads of the beast, then as mountains, give rise over time by supernatural means to a global type of deified man-centered revived Roman Empire, dating from the Egyptian Oppression of Israel, to the Assyrian, Babylonian, Medo-Persian, Grecian, and Roman Empires, and to the Papacy of Roman Catholicism and the Vatican.

[BlindSeeker]

13 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

The beast that was, and now is not, is an eighth king,

How do you prove it is a king? On what mountain does he sit?

[BlindSeeker]

14 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

to a global type of deified man-centered revived Roman Empire,

How do you substantiate your position here

[Michael37]

9 minutes ago, BlindSeeker said:

On what mountain does he sit?

Metaphorically mountains are empires. Metaphors literally carry their meaning across, with help of context and comparison, but their meaning shouldn't be taken literally, or carried further than intended.

[Revelation Man]

On 1/29/2025 at 11:52 AM, Luther said:

Just what if the numbers of these kings, horns and heads are symbolic or figurative in nature? "10" ( fullness) ....fullness of the nations? "7"  (complete, perfect)..... complete kingdoms? 

Revelation 17:10

And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

Instead of looking at 7 or 8 different kingdoms, perhaps it is one complete kingdom of Satan, at different times throughout history. 

Revelation 17:12

And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

What if we are looking at more than ten kings or kingdoms, perhaps all of the unsaved nations coming up against God's people ( spiritually as well as physically)?

Revelation 17:16-17

[16]And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

[17]For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

" and give (their kingdom) unto the beast" ( not " their kingdoms").

Thoughts anyone?

 

You are on the right track, the area being spoken of is only the Mediterranean Sea Region (MSR) and only about that area whilst Israel is a nation, so basically cut the church age period out of this equation. This is why the Ottoman Empire nor the British Empire were beasts in God's eyes. So, the 7 Heads (Divine Completion) and 10 Horns or kings (Completion) represent this Satanic Entity, and in each chapter, the CROWNS give us the key unto who they are, with Rev. 12 being Satan, who has a crown over the whole earth thus every kingdom in the MSR or all 7 or the complete number thereof. Thus the CROWNS are on the 7 Heads.

In Rev. 13 the CROWNS are on the 10 horns, because that is the Anti-Christ/Little Horn Beast and the 10 kings/horns represent Complete Europe Reunited, but how do we know this? Dan. 7 tells us, the 10 Arise out of the Fourth Beasts Head !! So, it is Rome come alive again as another Beast this time the Beast is one man, because he dies before ever passing his kingdom on and Dan. 7:17 tells us all of these Beasts first arise as SINGLE MEN/Kings, then they became Beast Kingdoms later on, when they passed their kingdoms on. Thus the Last Beast is the Anti-Christ alone, I think that is why his number is 666 (Man).

Dan. 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

Finally in Rev. 17, the Scarlet Colored Beast is not Satan nor the Anti-Christ he is Apollyon the 8th King. He has NO CROWNS anywhere, why? He's under Satan on earth and he's not a human man, BUT......ALAS God loves His riddles, he is the King of the Bottomless Pit. He is placed there by God after having been placed as the Destroyer over Israel by Satan, and thus he was over the MSR Kingdoms including Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome then he was placed in the pit for the duration of the Church Age and will be freed at the First Woe. It is my contention that the Demon Michael fought with for 21 days in Daniel ch. 10 was Apollyon. 

Now, taking into account this thesis of mine, that Rome is the current E.U. (Complete Rome Revived) and then looking at the nations they (E.U.) would conquer in Dan. 11:40-43, if the E.U. conquered Countries to get at Israel (Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria), then he conquers Israel, and then finally all of North Africa, BOOM, you get these two maps, you get Papa Rome and his Son.

Papa Rome

His Son the European Union AFTER they Conquer their current allies in the Mediterranean Sea Region

By the way, look up European Neighborhood Policy, the E.U. currently has 7 Year Agreements (Dan. 9:27) with Israel and every nation in the Mediterranean Sea Region, I joke not, Israel, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Libya, Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia. They are THE MANY he Conquers Israel and THE MANY. Read Dan. 11:40-43 its a play by play, he can conquer every nation but is FOREBIDDEN from Conquering Edom, Moab and Ammon, that is where the Petra/Bozrah area the Jews flee unto is at.

ENP stands for European Neighborhood Policy. 

Edited February 6 by Revelation Man

[Luther]

2 hours ago, BlindSeeker said:

SO what happens if it all concludes with an 8th?

Rev 17:11 - And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goes into perdition.

We know at the time, "five are fallen" and in the dust bin of history, and likely the next two follow as well, and unquestionably, the 8th goes into annihilation. So, when it says "the eighth is of the seven," what deos eight represent?

Does is mean "the eighth is of the seven" that is a a conglomeration of all? Perhaps a melting pot of all? Like, a land of immigrants? Or, does it mean it is a direct descendant of the 7th?

 

I'm thinking more in line of what you call a " conglomeration".

It looks like the term " beast" can refer to a kingdom or a person ( Satan , maybe antichrist?). 

You have this 8th beast ( Satan ) who is of the seven. He is "of " the seven kingdoms because they are his kingdoms at different times in history. 

He goes into " perdition" or destruction ( Strong's #684). In 2 Thessalonians 2:3 Satan is called the " son of perdition", as he is worshiped as God. I cannot overemphasize how Satan's children have worked with him throughout history to prepare this final destination for him in Jerusalem. This is the last spiritual event that will occur right before Jesus comes! ( We are watching it unfold in real time). 

Every prophetic marker in the Old and New Testament leads us to this time of great Tribulation. And who doesn't  "sense" that it is so near to come! 

In 2 Thessalonians 2: 8 for example, Satan will be destroyed by the  "brightness" of Christ's coming.....he will go into perdition.

In Revelation 20 , after Satan is  "loosed" during the great tribulation, he gathers the nations ( of his seventh world kingdom) against the true people of God ( not those " christians" who were in alliance with Satan's children) and will be destroyed by fire ( he will go into perdition, with the unsaved world):

2 Peter 3:7

But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

You see it really does fit together. And I believe at this point that the whore of Babylon ( Satan's 7th world Kingdom) are his children which obviously has control of the world:

Revelation 18:3

"For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies."

The whore will be destroyed by the ten kings/ nations ( complete nations) before the final battle when they come after the Christians. Whether those Christians who allied with the whore turn on her I don't know. I perceive that they don't have the Holy Spirit considering the outright murderous nature of the whore ( please protect me Lord). Just have to say it as  God is leading me. 

Remember remember....Even the very elect could be deceived, if it were possible. Let's thank God for His guidance into all truth. And I am by no means saying that I understand the whole thing. But I can say that exchanging views with others of like mind ( like in this forum) and going through verses over and over....over time is where I know God would want us.