Unravelling Revelation

[AdHoc]

On 2/19/2025 at 7:15 AM, Revelation Man said:

On 2/18/2025 at 3:48 PM, AdHoc said:

1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.

Yes, COME AND SEE [The Future Events to come]. Via the 7 Trumps Angels sound them to bring them via the 7 Vials Angels pour them out. But here were are only told by one of the Four Covering Bests to COME AND SEE

On 2/18/2025 at 3:48 PM, AdHoc said:

He opened the sixth seal AND there was a pause until the seventh was opened

Yes, because the 7th Seal RELEASES God's Wrath thus we get a silence  mention, like a reverent funeral.

These two examples were to show that the seals were opened one by one - not all together as you maintained. On this simple grammar my case rests. Our Lord opened ONE SEAL - then something happened. "AND" then He opened another - and something happened. A SEQUENCE ...

But one thing is for sure brother: This is not a crucial doctrine. So let's conserve our energy fr when a crucial doctrine is called into question. I'm pretty sure we agree then.

[AdHoc]

5 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

Zechariah Chapter 14 Is The Eternal Kingdom

Zechariah 14:1-12 below shows the Lords return to earth in fire in final judgement.

(Verse 1) shows "The Day Of The Lord" also seen in 2 Peter 3:10-13 "Fire Judgement" below

(Verse 2) Shows that all nations are gathered for the final battle of armageddon.

(Verses 3-5) shows the Lords return, and his eternal feet touch down on the earthly Mt, of Olives, and in the "Twinkling Of An Eye" 1 Cor 15:52 takes place, in the catching up, resurrection, final judgement by fire, and the New Heavens, Earth, and Jerusalem being revealed for eternity, judgement complete, eternity begins.

(Verses 6-7) Eternal light seen, in the eternal kingdom, Rev 22:1-5

(Verse 8) The river of life is seen, Rev 22:1-5

(Verse 10) The New creation is being revealed, the plain is lifted up.

(Verse 12) "The Day Of The Lord" showing the "Last Day" judgement by the Lords fire, as men are consumed as they stand on their feet, 2 Peter 3:10-13

2 Peter 3:10KJV

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Revelation 22:1KJV

And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

"The Eternal Kingdom"!

Zechariah 14:1-12KJV

14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 but it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9 And the Lordshall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin’s gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king’s winepresses.

11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.

12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

No. In the Millennium the survivors of those who went against Jerusalem have to pay homage to Emmanuel. "Survivor" implies that the others did not survive. That is, they are dead.

In the eternal state it is those not written in the book of life who may not go in. But all men are alive - resurrected at the White Throne

[abcdef]

On 2/18/2025 at 9:10 PM, DeighAnn said:

How fun.   My beliefs in a nut-shell so vastly different from the rest but that has verses for all of it without any 'it really means'... 

Take a piece of paper and write on it and roll it up and seal it.  Write upon another piece of paper, wrap it around the first and seal it.  Continue on until there are 7 pages, all sealed, all now ready to be opened, one at a time, that's one way that solves the problem.  The outer page would even show the writing on the outside....

Next,

What do we get from WORDS written on scrolls? INFORMATION, right?   The information can speak to the past the present or the future.  It can be straightforward, symbolic, etc...but whatever way it is presented, IT is the only truth we all have to work with.  

If the 7 seals have not yet been opened, then HOW do we know what is written on them?   How are we discussing them right now, if they hadn't been unsealed when the Lamb was found worthy?  

And how could anyone be 'sealed' before the four winds are loosed, if the book still wasn't UNSEALED for that sealing?  That's just basic common sense, right? 

What are we actually given in the Book? 
19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; 

For those who demand it is written in exact order the events will take place from this point on, just simply give book, chapter and verse where GOD words says it and I will happily stand corrected or let's agree it is nothing more than another conclusion of man, a tradition passed down, something only believed because a doctrine depends upon  it and or an assumption.... but not a TRUTH that can be found in GODS OWN WORDS and skip everything that might be linked to that. 


In Rev 2 and 3 we get the run down on how things have been going and by including 25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come,
it covers the churches till His return...

If anyone can show me how HEREAFTER is only from that point forward only, I'd like to read that myself because I am positive that 60 years after His death, He didn't do it all again, and that is what would have to be 'your belief' for that to be true.  

So, John is taken to heaven, and shown GOD sitting upon HIS THRONE, singular.  No Christ, no Lamb, just GOD ALMIGHTY, upon HIS Throne, amongst 24 thrones elders with crowns sitting upon thrones, beasts all around Him a bit of a description of heaven at that time.

Next, we are given the past event, not future, of the Lamb slain, which brings us to the point of Christ sitting at the right hand of GOD

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

Up until Jesus was crucified, He was the Son of God, the Son of Man but NOT YET the Lamb of God but once He was...  

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Taken from the Greek  

Rev 5:9  And they are singing a song new, saying, Worthy are You to take the scroll and to open the seals of it, because You were slain and You purchased to God by the blood of You, out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation 

and You have made THEM to the God of US, a kingdom and priests; and THEY will reign upon the earth.  
 

Just for reference from biblehub. 
Corresponding Greek / Hebrew Entries: - H1931 (הוּא, hu): Often translated as "he," "she," or "it," similar in function to "αὐτός" in Greek.

- H1992 (הֵמָּה, hemmah): Used for "they" or "them," corresponding to the plural usage of "αὐτός."

Usage: The Greek pronoun "αὐτός" (autos) is a versatile term used extensively in the New Testament. It functions primarily as a pronoun of emphasis or identity, often translated as "he," "she," "it," "they," or "them." It can also be used reflexively as "himself," "herself," "itself," or "themselves," and sometimes denotes "the same." Its usage is crucial for understanding the subject or object of a sentence, providing clarity and emphasis in the narrative.




Corresponding Greek / Hebrew Entries: - H595 אָנֹכִי (anoki) – I, me
- H589 אֲנִי (ani) – I, me

Usage: The Greek pronoun "ἐγώ" (egó) is used to denote the first person singular, "I" or "me," emphasizing the speaker's identity or role in the context. It is often used in the New Testament to highlight personal involvement, responsibility, or authority. In many instances, it is employed by Jesus to assert His identity and mission, as seen in the "I am" statements in the Gospel of John.

 

On 2/18/2025 at 9:10 PM, DeighAnn said:

In 96AD or so THE BOOK IS UNSEALED because John is told to write it down for us to read and study and to have all that information 'sealed' in our tiny little brains.   And what info are we given in 96AD that continues on until today? 

The scroll is unsealed, what does it say? It is not the 7 trumpets.

What the scroll says is the story of the 2 witnesses. Rev 10 & 11.

The 2 witnesses and the seals/trumpets are the same timeline. They are united by the beast that rises from the 5th trumpet abyss kills the 2 witness

Both timelines begin when the majority of Israel rejected the gospel kingdom in 37 AD and they both end at the 7th trumpet. 

The seals/trumpets show unbelieving Israel mostly under Rome. 

The 2 witnesses are faithful Israel in the gospel kingdom/church who fled into the wilderness of gentile nations in the 70 AD ish time.

 

On 2/18/2025 at 9:10 PM, DeighAnn said:

 So, in a nut shell, ALL THE SEALS HAVE ALREADY BEEN OPENED.  Now all we have to do is figure out IF any of the information given us has come to pass. 

 

On 2/18/2025 at 9:10 PM, DeighAnn said:

Have we been sealed? 

We are sealed with the gift of the Holy Spirit, Acts 2:38.

Those 144,000 are OT saints who were resurrected with Jesus in 33 AD. They did not receive the gift of the Holy Spirit as from 33 AD forward.

 

On 2/18/2025 at 9:10 PM, DeighAnn said:

And I looked and behold, a horse white, and the [one] sitting on it having a bow (toxon) and WAS GIVEN to him a crown, and he went forth OVERCOMING and to overcome.  

My vote is for THIS SEAL to not only have been opened but also for it to have been in effect since the Lamb first opened it.  Exact same thing as we are told in Peter
6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time: 7 Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you. 8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour: 9Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.",



As for the second one, who will take peace from the earth and they will slay one another, I am going with Yes on this seal also, not only to have been opened but instrumental in my understanding of what is taking place on earth today, and not something that will ONLY be taking place during Satans actual time here.  

As for the 3rd one, if you are not employing the 'be wiser than the serpent' then it is almost a guarantee you are being taken advantage of, but such is the life of a sheep being led to slaughter...a servant is a servant for a reason....we must remember Judgment Day is coming.   So, another YES on this seal opened and action taking place.

4th one, no need to even speak to this one, is there?  Death and deception famines and all the rest have most certainly been happening upon the earth.  All this really helps me to understand how DIFFERENT the world would have been had Jesus not been rejected.  This book would never have had to have been unsealed at all! 

Since I BELIEVE that there is no 'death' for those who come to faith while they yet live and we just go from this body to the celestial one at the first death (the terrestrial body one), all those who died the first death are ALREADY in their bodies in heaven and are just waiting for 'a time little' until the 'last week' of the 70 to take place...till the time of the gentiles is fulfilled aka all Christians accounted for.

Which brings me to the 6th seal....the tribulation of Satan on earth, when Satan and his angels will be cast out of heaven for a short season, the time that KEEPS us from the return of Christ and our being gathered to him at His return...which I DON'T BELIEVE has taken place because

there has been no 'great' earthquake, the sun has not 'become black as sackcloth' nor the moon whole become like blood.  There has been no beast rise from the sea with 10 kings, no 'head' has suffered 'a deadly wound' that has been healed, nor a false prophet claiming to be God with supernatural signs and wonders with the whole world is worshipping, nor any image set up to be worshipped, so no falling away but most of all there has not been seen 'the cloven tongue' upon anyone given up to death for a 10 day trial, by which the Holy Spirit has spoken, nor have there been two witnesses with supernatural abilities, nor have we seen heaven departed like a scroll, and we still await the day when the 2 witnesses will be killed and our two realms will become one, the time when men will wish to hid from the coming of Christ with the angels by having mountains fall upon them, when all flesh and blood bodies of the spiritually dead will die their first death, leaving only the 'living' to watch the 'dead' rise for them to see them transformed and gathered to Christ for the Lords Day to begin....

THAT is when the seventh angel sounds and THAT is when the bowls of the wrath of God will be DUMPED out and the day of the Lord will begin in which His foot hits the Mount and it cleaves a valley....  
 

Please see that Ezek 5:15-17, parallels the Rev 6, four horsemen of the seals.

The Ezek verses were a warning to the people of Jerusalem. The warning was a declaration of what would happen when Jerusalem turned away from God.

The events described in Ezek also happened to the 1st century city when the majority of Israel rejected the new covenant gospel kingdom that began on Pentecost in 33 AD.

The 6th seal is the desolation of the 70 AD city. The day of the Lord against Jerusalem.

The 7th seal opens the scroll sealed in Dan 12. It is the story of Israel after 70 AD.

The trumpets are unbelieving Israel after 70 AD until the 7th trumpet.

 

[truth7t7]

4 hours ago, AdHoc said:

No. In the Millennium the survivors of those who went against Jerusalem have to pay homage to Emmanuel. "Survivor" implies that the others did not survive. That is, they are dead.

In the eternal state it is those not written in the book of life who may not go in. But all men are alive - resurrected at the White Throne

Zechariah 14:16, Who Will Be Left Of The Nations?

You will closely note, Zechariah 14:16 & Isaiah 4:3-4 are "Parallel" readings of the same event, as Isaiah gives a clear account of those who are left, those who are found in the book of life, the final judgement has passed, eternity has begun "After" The Day Of The Lord

You will closely note in Isaiah 4:4 below, Jerusalem will be purged by the spirit of (Judgement) & (Burning)

Zechariah 14:12KJV

12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Only The Righteous Are Left, The Book Of Life "Was" Opened (Every One That Is Written Among The Living)

Zechariah 14:16KJV

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

Isaiah 4:3-4KJV

3 And it shall come to pass, that he that is left in Zion, and he that remaineth in Jerusalem, shall be called holy, even every one that is written among the living in Jerusalem:

4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

Revelation 21:24-27KJV

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.

26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Edited February 21 by truth7t7

[Revelation Man]

10 hours ago, AdHoc said:

These two examples were to show that the seals were opened one by one - not all together as you maintained. On this simple grammar my case rests. Our Lord opened ONE SEAL - then something happened. "AND" then He opened another - and something happened. A SEQUENCE ...

 

Yes, Metaphorically its like Jesus opening a letter, all the Seals have to be off before the letter can be read or it Sealed up nothing. We ignore the reason the Seals were on the letter/scroll if we think these are the Judgments. 

Jesus who knows all, can this PRE TELL the Church in Heaven Pre Trib. what will happen in the Middle of the 70th week, he does so by taking off the 7 Seals one at a time them teasing with what is coming. In fact the first 5 Seals all cover the42 month rule by the Anti-Christ, then the 6 Seal covers the 42 months of God's Wrath, then the 7th Seal opens it up, or allows the Wrath to begin.

Rev. 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.

This is the 6th Seal Prophetic Uttering by Jesus coming to pass.

God wrote this and used the symbology of the time, everyone reading this 2000 years ago would have known Jesus was opening a Sealed Scroll/Message, and only the 7th Seal released that message.

If I have a closet with 7 locks on it locking up my 50th birthday presents, and at my party I start opening the locks, and TELLING GUESTS what the presents inside were, with each lock I took off, the guests have a general idea of my presents, but after the 6th Lock is taken off, they still have not seen a thing only when the 7th lock is taken off can the door be opened.

11 hours ago, AdHoc said:

But one thing is for sure brother: This is not a crucial doctrine. So let's conserve our energy fr when a crucial doctrine is called into question. I'm pretty sure we agree then.

Amen........But, Prophesy is my calling, so I have to bat it around at all times. 

[The Light]

13 hours ago, AdHoc said:

The point is to consider the argument and show - with scripture - why it cannot be. I'll do one again to show you how simple these arguments are to trace and refute, or trace and confirm. If you don't brings scripture for your counter, my argument stands.

So in FOUR cases the constellation is the same and without a doubt the "MOTHER" in three of them is JERUSALEM ABOVE. AND ... she fulfills all the points I gave in my post on page 3. I am aware that the majority of Christians think that the woman is Israel, but on close examination it can't be.

You are taking things COMPLETELY out of context when you jump over to Galatians 4. Let's put things in context..............WITH SCRIPTURE.

Revelation 12

And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

You are attempting to claim that this woman is Jerusalem above. This is in error. The woman is Israel. The 12 stars are the sons of Jacob. This is Josephs dream.....

Genesis 37

9 And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.

10 And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?

So the woman is in fact Israel. The 12 stars are the 12 tribes of Israel. 

Here is further proof that you are taking things out of context.

Revelation 12

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

The woman is seen fleeing into the wilderness where she has a place prepared of God for 1260 days. Does Jerusalem above flee into the wilderness? No. It is talking about those in Israel that flee when the abomination of desolation is set up.

Futher we see that the dragon goes after the woman but cannot get to her because she is protected by God. The dragon goes after the remnant of her seed, which is the 12 tribes across the earth, that keep the commandments of God and now have the testimony of Jesus Christ as they are regrated into the Olive tree.

Revelation 12

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Conclusion: Your contention that the woman in Revelation 12 is Jerusalem is incorrect as proven by scripture. You are taking things out of context.

[AdHoc]

8 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

Zechariah 14:16, Who Will Be Left Of The Nations?

You will closely note, Zechariah 14:16 & Isaiah 4:3-4 are "Parallel" readings of the same event, as Isaiah gives a clear account of those who are left, those who are found in the book of life, the final judgement has passed, eternity has begun "After" The Day Of The Lord

You will closely note in Isaiah 4:4 below, Jerusalem will be purged by the spirit of (Judgement) & (Burning)

Zechariah 14:12KJV

12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Only The Righteous Are Left, The Book Of Life "Was" Opened (Every One That Is Written Among The Living)

Zechariah 14:16KJV

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

Isaiah 4:3-4KJV

3 And it shall come to pass, that he that is left in Zion, and he that remaineth in Jerusalem, shall be called holy, even every one that is written among the living in Jerusalem:

4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

Revelation 21:24-27KJV

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.

26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

When i differ with a brother or sister I try to see where and why the difference. Instead of countering every statement you made with another long posting, I will show my understanding of things and why I think we differ. I don't expect you to change your opinion, but our differences are caused far away from the texts we discuss.

Dispensation.
For some reason you deny dispensations. The word "dispensation" comes from "dispense". The Greek word "oikonomia" does not mean a time period. It means what type of dispensing God does for His purposes. Its sense in the Greek is a mother in a kitchen preparing a meal which she will "dispense* to her family. Its first mention sets the pace for the usage of this word. In 1st Corinthians 9:17 Paul talks of "dispensing" the gospel. It is what God is using to achieve His goals. So, i Romans 2 we learn that, at the same time, and in parallel, God is dispensing to men in three different ways.
1. To the Church he dispenses the gospel and grace
2. To the Jews He dispenses Law
3. To the Nations/Gentiles he dispenses conscience

Each type of human has a dedicated "dispensation". Note that they all continue to the Judgment Seat.

With this understanding of God's "dispensation", we see that God's dispensation in the next age - the Millennial age, are MODIFIED for the Gentiles and Israel. Israel are still under Law (Jer.31:31-33). What changes is that the Laws are no longer on stones but on the hearts of Israelites. The Nations still have conscience, but God's grace is removed and sinners meet a "rod of iron". For the Church comes the biggest change. From submission to men so that God can give them time to consider their ways, the Christian becomes a KING (Lk.19:17-19).

The Millennium
For our discussion, the Millennial age is the time that God gives Christ to "SUBDUE His enemies" under the old regime of summer and winter. Standing before Pontius Pilate, Jesus refrained from engaging for "this world". Instead He attacked the Principalities, sin and the Devil. But when He returns he will attack the rule of men on earth. His "dispensing" will be unbending justice. Since this is a matter of CONFLICT, two great battles are fought.
1. At Armageddon the present rulers of this word are defeated in one decisive.bloody battle.
2. Jesus replaces the Devil as Prince of this world (Rev.11:15), and Satan is bound in the Abyss. During the Millennium, the Nations, who are still in the flesh, will multiply. These will never have known Satan's rule or tactics. But God must test them, and test His Kingdom. Satan is let loose for a season, and again men can choose. A huge Rebellion is raised to test Christ's Kingdom with its Capital Jerusalem. The inciter s Satan, the rebel leaders are Magog and Gog, and the battle takes place in Harmon-Gog

These two battles are a thousand years apart.  In the first (Armageddon) Christ forcefully takes the Kingdoms of the earth. In the second (Harmon-Gog) the Kingdom s tested to see if it is everlasting. Since the PRIZE is Jerusalem (the city of the Great King). If one does not take care of the details, it is very easy to mix up these events. But there are markers to help, and the main one is the RESURRECTIONS.

The resurrection
In 1st Corinthians 15 the resurrection is dealt with almost comprehensively. In verse 22 to 26 is the ORDER of resurrection;
1n verse 22 it is plainly stated that ALL men will be resurrected
In verse 23 Christ is first
In verse 23 the Church and Israel are resurrected "when He comes"
In verse 24 Christ must reign TILL He puts down God's ENEMIES
In verse 25 it is predicted that NO ENEMIES WILL REMAIN UNSUBDUED
In verse 26 the LAST enemy is DEATH

This leaves only ONE SEQUENCE. Christ is raised followed by 2,000 years. The Church and Israel (those who are His) are raised "when He comes". When the 1,000 years are finished Hades gives up its DEAD (the rest of the dead). God's "DISPENSING" is a fact of the Bible. Different "dispensations" are a fact. the common meaning of "dispensation" is misleading. John 5 and 1st Corinthians 15 show ALL MEN RESURRECTED - each in an ORDER. The Millennium is the tie for SUBDUING God's enemies. The future age is for RULING without rebellion and all god's enemies removed.

This is simple. But what s not so simple is why, when there are no Christians a the White Throne judgment, why is the Book of Life presented?

[Dennis1209]

The OP's study of this thread is timely and excellent, and her website is impressive. The Book of Revelation can overwhelm many; even most churches will not delve into it for fear of exegetical turmoil and congregational division.

By far, the Book of Revelation utilizes more parallel passages, cross-references, allusions, types, and shadows than any other book in the Bible. This is known as the New Testament's use of the Old Testament. Initially, I was awe-struck at all the quotes and references back to the OT.

Most hard-copy Bibles have a minuscule number of annotations on the preceding.

The Old Testament is the New Testament concealed, and the New Testament is the Old Testament revealed. The best way to study the Bible is not from commentaries or the pulpit, but as a Berean, letting the Bible explain itself, the Book of Revelation is no exception.

Acts 17:11 (KJV) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Today, in this technological age, we are blessed with advanced tools to delve into the Bible quicker and more efficiently. Two such valuable resources I frequently use are The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge and The New Testament Use of the Old Testament. They make it easy to follow a person, place, thing, subject, or theology chronologically.

I also think about Biblical knowledge; what Daniel says here would also include Biblical knowledge. Not to mention the timing and discovery of the Qumran Dead Sea Scrolls and artificial intelligence (AI). Daniel’s Book has been opened. Today, knowledge is not doubling every century but in days.

Daniel 12:4 (KJV) But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

As Deborah emphasizes, Biblical use of numbers, particularly in Revelation, cannot be overstated enough with their representations. God is the master mathematician, and I could reference so much on that point. Even Hebrew and Greek names have significant meanings to which to pay attention.

One example: The name meanings of the first ten generations of genealogy are chronologically listed in Genesis. What does it say when putting them into an English sentence? Fascinating! [Credit, the late Dr. Charles Missler].

Not to usurp Deborah’s excellent thread, but for anyone interested, the following numbers are general in representation, as formulated by the late Dr. Noah Hutchings.

ONE: Unity

TWO: Union; Division; and Witnessing

THREE: Resurrection; Divine Completeness; Perfection

FOUR: Creation; World

FIVE: Grace; God’s goodness

SIX: Weakness of man; Number of Man; Evils of Satan; Manifestation of Sin, creation

SEVEN: Completeness; Spiritual; Perfection

EIGHT: New birth; New Creation or new beginning

NINE: Fruit of the Spirit; Divine completeness from the Lord

TEN: Testimony; Law and Responsibility

ELEVEN: Judgment or Disorder

TWELVE: Governmental perfection

THIRTEEN: Depravity and Rebellion

FOURTEEN: Deliverance or Salvation

FIFTEEN: Rest

SIXTEEN: Love

SEVENTEEN: Victory

EIGHTEEN: Bondage

NINETEEN: Faith

TWENTY: Redemption

TWENTY-ONE: Exceeding Sinfulness of Sin

TWENTY-TWO: Light

TWENTY-THREE: Death

TWENTY-FOUR: The Priesthood

TWENTY-FIVE: The forgiveness of sin

TWENTY-SIX: The Gospel of Christ

TWENTY-SEVEN: Preaching of the Gospel

TWENTY-EIGHT: Eternal life

TWENTY-NINE: Departure

THIRTY: The Blood of Christ; dedications; mourning

THIRTY-ONE: Offspring

THIRTY-TWO: Covenant

THIRTY-THREE: Promise

THIRTY-FOUR: Naming of a son

THIRTY-FIVE: Hope

THIRTY-SIX: Enemy

THIRTY-SEVEN: The Word of God

THIRTY-EIGHT: Slavery

THIRTY-NINE: Disease

FORTY: Trials; Probation; Testing's

FORTY-TWO: Israel’s oppression; Lord’s advent

FORTY-FIVE: Preservation

FIFTY: The Holy Spirit

SIXTY: Pride

SIXTY-SIX: Idol worship

SEVENTY: Universality; Israel and her Restoration

ONE HUNDRED: God’s election of Grace; Children of Promise

ONE HUNDRED-NINETEEN: The Resurrection Day; Lord’s Day

ONE HUNDRED-TWENTY: Divine period of probation

ONE HUNDRED-FORTY-FOUR: The Spirit guided life

ONE HUNDRED-FIFTY-THREE: Fruit bearing

TWO HUNDRED: Insufficiency

SIX HUNDRED: Warfare

SIX HUNDRED-SIXTY-SIX: The number of the Beast; Antichrist

EIGHT HUNDRED-EIGHTY-EIGHT: The first Resurrection Saints

THOUSAND: Divine completeness and Glory of God

[Vine Abider]

On 2/15/2025 at 4:32 PM, Deborah_ said:

There’s one other fascinating fact about the book Revelation: it contains more songs of worship than any other book in the New Testament. It’s a very positive book, oozing with joy and praise! The enemies of God may be rampaging over the earth, causing no end of suffering and persecution; but the citizens of heaven have their hearts and minds focused on the King of kings as they worship Him and look forward to celebrating His return to rule the earth. As we read this book, we should find our hearts uplifted and our own worship stimulated. Our God reigns!

That is interesting!  "To the praise of the glory of His grace, with which He graced us in the beloved!"  (Eph 1:6)

In the past decade our little local group has gone through the book of Revelation twice.  We did it slowly, taking close to a year each time.  Doing this I got clear about a couple overarching themes.  One big one is it is a book of love and victory.  It reveals God's love for us (in Christ) and concludes victory over the enemy.  He will eradicate this sin/cancer from mankind, which has sought to ruin the loving relationship between our Father God and His children.

The many judgements recorded in Revelation are toward our enemy, and are about freeing us from the disease of sin/death. So yes, there is an incredible conveying of things that are exceedingly praise-worthy and should cause us to break out in song!  

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, AdHoc said:

The Millennium
2. Jesus replaces the Devil as Prince of this world (Rev.11:15), and Satan is bound in the Abyss. During the Millennium, the Nations, who are still in the flesh, will multiply.

There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV

1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV

29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV

7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV

2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV

6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV

3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV

5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV

15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV

12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV

5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.