For those striving for "perfection"

[irishbeast]

Of course our Lord and Saviour was perfect but consider this:

In church today one of the guys got up and spoke about how Jesus would have have been perhaps considered a bit of a rebel by today's standards and give some interesting examples. A few from memory . they are mentioned places in the Gospels

Refusing to answer questions in court Matthew 26:62-63 and others

When questioned by the high priest and later by Pilate, Jesus remained mostly silent, refusing to defend himself against the accusations.

Flipping over tables Matthew 21:12-13 and others

Jesus entered the temple and overturned the tables of the money changers, driving them out with a whip called them a Den of thieves

Breaking Sabbath Rules Mark 2-2:23 and others

Jesus healed on the Sabbath and allowed his disciples to pick grain, defying the religious laws of his time. Today, breaking religious laws in favour of compassion and practical needs could be seen as rebellious

Associating with "unsavoury characters" Luke 5-29:32

Jesus dined with tax collectors, prostitutes, and sinners, which offended the religious elite.

 

The point of the message was that in this life we should of course be followers of Christ but nobody is perfect, and God will realise that. The timing couldn't be better as I had a week I was not proud off. 

It put my mind at ease a bit. It doesn't mean a licence to break all the rules but moreso to convey the message that we are only human and have free will, but will never be perfect so don't beat yourself up too much if you break the rules. If you are genuinely sorry (this is important) then repent in prayer. This doesn't a wild card to commit sin every day as you just confess your sins thinking you will be forgiven. God already knows your heart. He's sending messages all the time without people realising. Where does a guilty conscious come from if we are just flesh and bone? Same as feelings of love. Scientists try to understand it but never will as God can do things that transcend our understandings

I'm rambling a bit now - Just wanted to share this as is was timely for me and if it helps anyone else it then that's great :)

 

 

 

[Deborah_]

If i had been listening to this address I think I would have felt a bit uncomfortable. Saying that "Jesus wasn't perfect" seems to be the wrong way of putting it. Judging by the examples you've given, what the speaker actually meant was that Jesus didn't conform to other people's expectations - and maybe not to the speaker's expectations either! But none of the things listed were against God's Law.

The bottom line is: Jesus was sinless (otherwise His death couldn't have saved us).

We, of course, are not. That's why we need to ask for forgiveness regularly! But we are still commanded to imitate Jesus as far as we possibly can. And sometimes that will mean refusing to conform to the expectations of those around us.

[Who me]

21 hours ago, irishbeast said:

The point of the message was that in this life we should of course be followers of Christ but nobody is perfect, and God will realise that

More a question of whose rules are we following, societies or Gods?

Yes we fail, frequently but we also take responsibility  for our failures/our sinning by going back to God to say sorry. 

 

L8ke Jesus we should be breaking societies expectations, Jesus overturned the tables of those seeking to exploit the worshippers of God. Do we support those same exploiters through telly evangelists etc.

[irishbeast]

17 hours ago, Who me said:

More a question of whose rules are we following, societies or Gods?

Yes we fail, frequently but we also take responsibility  for our failures/our sinning by going back to God to say sorry. 

 

L8ke Jesus we should be breaking societies expectations, Jesus overturned the tables of those seeking to exploit the worshippers of God. Do we support those same exploiters through telly evangelists etc.

Yes that's a good way of putting it. The speaker put it a lot more eloquently that I have but I guess the point of this thread was to not to make feel like failures if they can't live up to all biblical expectations, especially for people new to Christianity or struggling with it a little bit. I'm sure that God doesn't want to ostracise people who want to follow Christ or who are perhaps battling with some ot  the rules. 

A key example that I struggle with is in Matthew 10:37 

"Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me."

Now being honest I love them both equally. Mum/Dad and God, I don't have children so can't comment on thay. So I struggle with that ask and did confide in my Pastor about it as its a really tough thing to come to terms with. His response was that we should do the best we can and that some of expectations would be very hard for anyone to truthfully follow. That's not so say we can just pick and choose which rules to abide by! We are supposed to honour they father and mother as per the 10 commandments :)

 

 

[enoob57]

God is very clear about idolatry... No created thing comes before God! The summation of the law:
Matthew 22:37 (KJV)

[37] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

[38] This is the first and great commandment.

[39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

[40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

It is lunacy to see this as competition in loving but rather the clarity in heart of all things coming from and belonging to ... things we love here should only increase our love of God and thankfulness toward!

[other one]

3 hours ago, irishbeast said:

Now being honest I love them both equally.

The context and the meaning of the Greek word isn't saying you should not love your mom and dad, but it's that we should love God over all other things.   You can say you love them equally, but if you are put into a situation where one has to choose, we always have to choose God no matter the situation.

[AnOrangeCat]

On 2/25/2025 at 6:54 AM, irishbeast said:

A key example that I struggle with is in Matthew 10:37 

"Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me."

Now being honest I love them both equally. Mum/Dad and God, I don't have children so can't comment on thay. So I struggle with that ask and did confide in my Pastor about it as its a really tough thing to come to terms with. His response was that we should do the best we can and that some of expectations would be very hard for anyone to truthfully follow.

I agree, God knows we aren't going to be able to live up to perfection. As I see it we're all works in progress as per Philippians 1:6. The good work in us has been started and will be brought to completion eventually. Until then we just do what we can.

Regarding the verse you mentioned I think it's fortunate that a lot of us aren't in a position where we have to choose. In the time of the apostles and the early church becoming a Christian against your family's wishes had the potential to be a very weighty thing compared to how it is today. The idea is still applicable to us today, of course. But at least for now the potential fallout is generally diminished compared to things like your family deciding you needed to be stoned.

[Who me]

On 2/25/2025 at 12:54 PM, irishbeast said:

Now being honest I love them both equally. Mum/Dad and God, I don't have children so can't comment on thay

Practically does your love for your parents stop you serving/worshipping  God?

The middle  eastern custom is that family  is everything  and Jesus is saying it is not.

[kwikphilly]

@irishbeast

Well the Title of this thread is attention getting - and yes,Jesus Was,IS and Always Will be Perfection

But I get it,by society standards he was a non conformist but that is because He IS Perfect and we aren't striving to be perfect like Him we Strive for Perfection IN HIM,the Perfection that Abides IN us that we have access to- the Heart & Mind of Christ Jesus

With love in Christ,Kwik

[Michael37]

On 2/24/2025 at 11:57 PM, Deborah_ said:

Saying that "Jesus wasn't perfect" seems to be the wrong way of putting it.

Yes. The title got reported and has been amended.