23 minutes in Hell by Bill Wiese

[nebula]

Forrest, when Daniel and the Apostle John and others in the Scriptures had their visions, do you believe those were hallucinations, or made up stories?

No, but the accounts of their experiences is in the Bible, not some book written by a former realtor for sale on Amazon. Probably half of the schizophrenics out there have experienced hallucinations of demons and torment, do you believe they actually were all seeing demons?

Yes, I believe it quite possible. In fact, I've had my own encounters with demons. But I have also physically felt the presence of the Lord. Do you beleive me to be psychotic?

[ayin jade]

When someone reads a book like this, I hope they are Berean and compare it to scripture. If it says anything that conflicts with scripture then it is false and to be dismissed. I hope people place scripture above the experiences others have. If its from God, then it would never contradict scripture.

[Marnie]

So in other words, G-d's revealed Word isn't enough. That is what you are saying?

Jesus is the Word revealed, but many didn't and still don't believe Him. Why would Satan use a person to proclaim just how real hell is and that we should turn to Christ?

If anything, he would want the truth to be kept hidden. If Satan isn't using this guy then Jesus is, whether we grasp it or not.

Why would G-d add to His own Word? I didn't say Satan is using this guy; I said I am sure he experienced something. Did he experience Hell, I highly doubt it. Especially if he is making money off his experience. Call me a cynic.

[nebula]

How do you know these people did not have a genuine spiritual encounter or experience?

How do you know that disease is not caused by spiritual deficiencies rather than bacteria and viruses?

I personally know a woman who was healed from fibromyalgia after she forgave someone whom she had been holding major unforgiveness towards.

There is a strong link between the spirit, the soul and the body, and often times one can affect the other. I am not saying all sicknesses have a spiritual cause. What I am saying is that sometimes they do.

[sweetycakes]

Forrest, when Daniel and the Apostle John and others in the Scriptures had their visions, do you believe those were hallucinations, or made up stories?

No, but the accounts of their experiences is in the Bible, not some book written by a former realtor for sale on Amazon. Probably half of the schizophrenics out there have experienced hallucinations of demons and torment, do you believe they actually were all seeing demons?

Yes, I believe it quite possible. In fact, I've had my own encounters with demons. But I have also physically felt the presence of the Lord. Do you beleive me to be psychotic?

I have also had encounters with demons.....and with the Lord.

I don't consider myself to be psychotic.

[Marnie]

Forrest, when Daniel and the Apostle John and others in the Scriptures had their visions, do you believe those were hallucinations, or made up stories?

No, but the accounts of their experiences is in the Bible, not some book written by a former realtor for sale on Amazon. Probably half of the schizophrenics out there have experienced hallucinations of demons and torment, do you believe they actually were all seeing demons?

Yes, I believe it quite possible. In fact, I've had my own encounters with demons. But I have also physically felt the presence of the Lord. Do you beleive me to be psychotic?

This is different, Neb. We are told in the Word that we are engaged in spiritual warfare.

[forrestkc]

I don't think you understand. Even if this man were to have experienced hell, I don't need to read about his experience to know that I don't want to go there. Hell, at its very core is place where God is not with us at all. Heaven, at its very core is a place where we are literal presence of God. To be in an existence where God is not with you at all is worse than anything that anyone could possibly comprehend or put to words. Its worse than visions of demons, torment, horrible smells, being ripped apart, or anything that which we associate with the shells that are our bodies that which we see ourselves as.

Right off just reading excerpts from his book I am skeptical. He describes his experience from a perspective of his physical being. We are not a physical body. We simply have a physical body. When we die, our physical bodies and everything we ever had in this physical world stays here. As C.S. Lewis said, we are a soul, we have a body.

[undone]

Luke 16:19-31

The Rich Man and Lazarus

19"There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell,[c] where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'

31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.'

--------------------------------

Why would God all the sudden decide that people will listen to this guy? It seems Jesus has already addressed this issue.

[Marnie]

Why would God all the sudden decide that people will listen to this guy? It seems Jesus has already addressed this issue.

Thank you.

[nebula]

Why would G-d add to His own Word? I didn't say Satan is using this guy; I said I am sure he experienced something. Did he experience Hell, I highly doubt it. Especially if he is making money off his experience. Call me a cynic.

If this is so, then why have teaching books and teaching tapes? If God's Word as is is enough, then why listen to sermons?