Teachers forced to 'hide in closets' to pray

[nikki1]

Other One...

Teachers are allowed to pray. Shiloh is right. This is a complete brreach of school teacher's First Amendment rights

Jay Sekulow, Constitution law expert, who deals with these cases all the time, writes the following on his site where people have written in and asked him questions about their Constitutional rights. It might be a good idea to glance over it because people are having their rights trampled on and don't even know it.

Link

At our annual school staff luncheon, we waited for someone to go up and pray before the meal as usual, but no one ever did. When I approached our instructional supervisor about this, she told me that she was advised we couldn't pray. Are teachers and other adults (e.g. parents, administrators) allowed to pray at school, voluntarily and on their own time?

Jay answers: Yes, you should have no problem if it's an after-school event. As you said, the prayer needs to be voluntary; but if a group of teachers wants to pray before the meal, there should be no problem whatsoever. What you may have is confusion about the voluntary aspect of the prayer. If the school principal prays, the question can be raised as to whether that implies an endorsement of religion by the state. The Supreme Court of the United States has said that a school doesn't endorse everything it fails to censor, and that high school students are mature enough to understand this; therefore, teachers, getting together for a luncheon would certainly be expected to understand.

I think there's an absolute misunderstanding of what the law is with regard to prayer at school events. Interestingly, in 1969 in the Tinker case, the Supreme Court held that "students [nor] teachers shed their constitutional rights . . . at the schoolhouse gate."

I think you're in great shape legally, Roy. We just need to get some of our lawyers here at the American Center for Law & Justice to help you on this. Prayer is not prohibited activity, and this is a group of adults. You can't compel the prayer; you can't require anybody to pray. But you certainly could have prayed before the beginning of that meal.

The citation for the Tinker case, mentioned above, can be found in "Students' Rights in the Public Schools," which you can read online by clicking here. Additional information on this and other topics related to your religious freedom can be found on our "Resources" page, which you can access by clicking here.

Here are some more case laws siting the Tinker case

Blessings,

[nebula]

Nebula mentioned evolution. It is now being taught in our schools as a subject. Where does it stop? Who said "give me a child at 5 and he is mine for life"? (or words to that effect). Was it Stalin or Mao?

Dunno. But Hitler once said, "I begin with the young

[nebula]

OK, I looked up the 14th amendment, and I am not seeing what you are saying, Axx.

http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/amendmentxiv

Its right there...section one of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibits discrimination by securing "the equal protection of the laws" for every person. That would include religious discrimination. In a 1979 consultation on the issue, the United States commission on civil rights defined religious discrimination in relation to the civil rights guaranteed by the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution.

Section 1:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

You still have me lost Axx - what does any of this have to do with a teacher praying while in school?

[nebula]

It's funny -

A Christian teacher saying a prayer outside of class time is considered discrimination.

But an atheist teacher calling Creationism a "myth" during class hours is not considered discrimination.

[OneLight]

It's funny -

A Christian teacher saying a prayer outside of class time is considered discrimination.

But an atheist teacher calling Creationism a "myth" during class hours is not considered discrimination.

Sickening, ain't it! You can read Harry Potter, but not the Bible. The Bible is not appropriate, creating the thought that something must be wrong with Gods word. You can draw a Santa for Christmas, but not Jesus. Christ on the cross means you need to see a shrink.

[wyguy]

Nebula mentioned evolution. It is now being taught in our schools as a subject. Where does it stop? Who said "give me a child at 5 and he is mine for life"? (or words to that effect). Was it Stalin or Mao?

Dunno. But Hitler once said, "I begin with the young

[Guest shiloh357]

It's funny -

A Christian teacher saying a prayer outside of class time is considered discrimination.

But an atheist teacher calling Creationism a "myth" during class hours is not considered discrimination.

Yes, it is glaring doublestandard.

[Guest shiloh357]

OK, I looked up the 14th amendment, and I am not seeing what you are saying, Axx.

http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/amendmentxiv

Its right there...section one of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibits discrimination by securing "the equal protection of the laws" for every person. That would include religious discrimination. In a 1979 consultation on the issue, the United States commission on civil rights defined religious discrimination in relation to the civil rights guaranteed by the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution.

Section 1:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

You still have me lost Axx - what does any of this have to do with a teacher praying while in school?

It doesn't have anything to do with it. It pertains making sure that equal rights are protected under law. It does not in any way support the position that a person praying at school is depriving someone else of equal protection under law.

[Axxman]

There is no law that requires that we have to trot out a religious leader to pray to every known diety at a highschool football game or other public event.

Correct. The law has been effectively established that no one, from any religion, is to be trotted out to pray to any deity. That is the power of the 14th amendment. If the Federal court applies a ruling to ONE person...it effectively applies to ALL people under the "equal protection of laws."

It pertains making sure that equal rights are protected under law. It does not in any way support the position that a person praying at school is depriving someone else of equal protection under law.

I don't believe I have ever claimed otherwise. I only made the point that the 14th amendment includes religious descrimination...among the various other laws that the federal gov;t has established using the 14th amendment. I think that history is on my side in that claim as the 14th amendment is roundly used in these types of cases. The federal gov't has ruled on these types of cases before, they have used the power of the 14th amendment to do so, and once they use the 14th amendment it provides the same legal standard equally to all. I personally don't see why that is so confusing....

School teachers are public employees. The court has repeatedly ruled that public employee's are bound by the 1st Amendment. In Adler v Board of Education, the Court said, "You have a constitutional right to say and think as you will, but you have no constitutional right to work for the government." Because of the 14th Amendment...everyone is entitled to equal protection by this law.

[MorningGlory]

What about the workplace? We have a Muslim woman, and a good friend I might add, who prays at work in her office. She closes the door and does her thing. But then again I pray in my office as well, and often have a bible on my desk, and E sword is on my work computer.

My screen saver at work has a picture of me facing a large forest fire and the words - Mat 7:19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

We open every tribal community meeting with a prayer, and close with one. Three of my staff members attend my home group.

I will worship my God, and no one is going to stop me.

That's how I see it too; I will not be silenced by anyone.