Denominations?

[enoob57]

Obviously, everyone warming a church pew on Sunday morning are not saved. Some are saved, and those who are are members of a church not made with human hands - The Church Which is the Body of Christ. This is the TRUE Church headed by Christ, and 100% of the members are saved. We are already ONE in the Body of Christ, even though we may have some doctrinal differences. We are ONE in the SALVATION issues or we wouldn't be members of the BODY OF CHRIST. I give thanks that we will all one day leave all the differences behind. We will also leave behind all of man's tags, labels, and denominations.

Here Here! I will join my heart to that future glory

[churchmouse2]

Denminations: Can anybody help me unbderstand why my post of last night in response to Kasey 777 was removed. As far as I know I violated nothing in the post. Everything which I said was backed up by God's Word. Is the moderation of our posts an arbitrary screener? Are there actually rules available which outline just what you can say and not?

[OneLight]

Denminations: Can anybody help me unbderstand why my post of last night in response to Kasey 777 was removed. As far as I know I violated nothing in the post. Everything which I said was backed up by God's Word. Is the moderation of our posts an arbitrary screener? Are there actually rules available which outline just what you can say and not?

I looked back through this whole thread and could not find a post by Kasey777. Are you sure you are looking in the right thread?

[enoob57]

Denminations: Can anybody help me unbderstand why my post of last night in response to Kasey 777 was removed. As far as I know I violated nothing in the post. Everything which I said was backed up by God's Word. Is the moderation of our posts an arbitrary screener? Are there actually rules available which outline just what you can say and not?

I looked back through this whole thread and could not find a post by Kasey777. Are you sure you are looking in the right thread?

:blink: There's other threads Where?

[mizzdy]

Denminations: Can anybody help me unbderstand why my post of last night in response to Kasey 777 was removed. As far as I know I violated nothing in the post. Everything which I said was backed up by God's Word. Is the moderation of our posts an arbitrary screener? Are there actually rules available which outline just what you can say and not?

There were no posts from this thread deleted as far as I can tell churchmouse2. And you can find the TOS next to the button that says 'view new content'.

shalom,

Mizzdy

[LIONFURY]

Denominations formed because of conflicting views of theology. I, particularly, am a Methodist. But if you ask me I would just say Christian. The Bible explains it better than me

1 Corinthians 12:4-7

4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

[OldEnglishSheepdog]

Denominations formed because of conflicting views of theology. I, particularly, am a Methodist. But if you ask me I would just say Christian. The Bible explains it better than me

1 Corinthians 12:4-7

4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

I spent most of my life as a Methodist before my conversion. Although the Church was Methodist, we didn't necessarily have much interest or understanding of the national denomination. It was really just a small, rural bible based Church that happened to have been started by Methodists. It was a great place to spend my teen and early adult years!

I don't think Paul is advocating denominations in this passage. In fact, he warns against following different leaders and speaks of THE church as being the pillar and foundation of Truth. I think he is speaking of the different functions within the Church.

What the passage actually says is "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal".

It's talking about the manifestation of the Spirit given to every believer - not whatever point you're straying to about pillars and foundations of Truth. It has nothing to do with that, at all.

THE church is the one that does not stray from the Word of God, "Peter and the other apostles replied: "We must obey God rather than men!" (Acts 5:29), and this passage is simply about the spiritual gifts and offices given to each believer who accepts the gift of salvation by grace through faith, not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9), just as we see offices, gifts and administrations among individual believers in Acts 6.

What we learn from the same epistle here in question (1 Corinthians) is that it is a grave error to boast in leaders of a church, as though the Body of Christ were anything more than the spiritual temple of God on the foundation of Christ alone with each Christian as a stone:

"You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?" (See how quarreling actually comes from following human leaders - which causes division, so the unions in the true church is found among those who don't boast in human leaders)

"What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task... So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything... God has been making it grow. So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow" (The apostles are nothing but believers).

"The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor" (Not the labour of others on our behalf, mind you, but more to the topic, we see the same kind of context here early in the book about how the individual is used so the spiritual gifts spoken of later are not the offices of the church but actual spiritual gifts to individual believers).

"For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building" (Notice the apostles are co-workers and the audience of individual believers are God's building, i.e. the temple)

"By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ" (Not Peter. So here we see the foundation and the pillars of the church which is the individual believers, including apostles, built on the foundation of Christ).

"Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in your midst?" (See?)

"If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy that person; for God’s temple is sacred, and you together are that temple" (Told ya.)

"Do not deceive yourselves" (So the Bible says that Jesus is the foundation, there is no other, and that the Apostles are nothing more than co-workers with other believers, all of whom make up God's temple, so don't deceive yourself otherwise... so don't deceive yourself).

"So then, no more boasting about human leaders! All things are yours, whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas" (Cephas is Peter. No more boasting in Peter. We see that the apostles are nothing, including Peter. So no boasting about leaders like Peter - that's what God told us causes "quarreling among you", which in other words is division. So those who boast in human leaders like Peter are causes of division and disunity.)

(Excerpts from 1 Corinthians 3).

[nChrist]

Denominations formed because of conflicting views of theology. I, particularly, am a Methodist. But if you ask me I would just say Christian. The Bible explains it better than me

1 Corinthians 12:4-7

4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

I spent most of my life as a Methodist before my conversion. Although the Church was Methodist, we didn't necessarily have much interest or understanding of the national denomination. It was really just a small, rural bible based Church that happened to have been started by Methodists. It was a great place to spend my teen and early adult years!

I don't think Paul is advocating denominations in this passage. In fact, he warns against following different leaders and speaks of THE church as being the pillar and foundation of Truth. I think he is speaking of the different functions within the Church.

What the passage actually says is "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal".

It's talking about the manifestation of the Spirit given to every believer - not whatever point you're straying to about pillars and foundations of Truth. It has nothing to do with that, at all.

THE church is the one that does not stray from the Word of God, "Peter and the other apostles replied: "We must obey God rather than men!" (Acts 5:29), and this passage is simply about the spiritual gifts and offices given to each believer who accepts the gift of salvation by grace through faith, not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9), just as we see offices, gifts and administrations among individual believers in Acts 6.

What we learn from the same epistle here in question (1 Corinthians) is that it is a grave error to boast in leaders of a church, as though the Body of Christ were anything more than the spiritual temple of God on the foundation of Christ alone with each Christian as a stone:

"You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?" (See how quarreling actually comes from following human leaders - which causes division, so the unions in the true church is found among those who don't boast in human leaders)

"What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task... So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything... God has been making it grow. So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow" (The apostles are nothing but believers).

"The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor" (Not the labour of others on our behalf, mind you, but more to the topic, we see the same kind of context here early in the book about how the individual is used so the spiritual gifts spoken of later are not the offices of the church but actual spiritual gifts to individual believers).

"For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building" (Notice the apostles are co-workers and the audience of individual believers are God's building, i.e. the temple)

"By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ" (Not Peter. So here we see the foundation and the pillars of the church which is the individual believers, including apostles, built on the foundation of Christ).

"Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in your midst?" (See?)

"If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy that person; for God’s temple is sacred, and you together are that temple" (Told ya.)

"Do not deceive yourselves" (So the Bible says that Jesus is the foundation, there is no other, and that the Apostles are nothing more than co-workers with other believers, all of whom make up God's temple, so don't deceive yourself otherwise... so don't deceive yourself).

"So then, no more boasting about human leaders! All things are yours, whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas" (Cephas is Peter. No more boasting in Peter. We see that the apostles are nothing, including Peter. So no boasting about leaders like Peter - that's what God told us causes "quarreling among you", which in other words is division. So those who boast in human leaders like Peter are causes of division and disunity.)

(Excerpts from 1 Corinthians 3).

If we reject those men sent by Jesus are we rejecting Jesus?

Did Jesus start a Church?

It isn't and never has been the RCC. It's all truly Born-Again Believers and the Church is Called the Church Which Is The Body Of Christ. There are no pretenders or pew warmers in the TRUE CHURCH, and JESUS CHRIST IS THE HEAD OF THE TRUE CHURCH - not some man or group of men.

Romans 12:5 KJV So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.

Galatians 6:10 KJV As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.

Ephesians 5:18-21 KJV And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; 19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; 20 Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; 21 Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

Colossians 3:15-17 KJV And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. 16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. 17 And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

[OldEnglishSheepdog]

If we reject those men sent by Jesus are we rejecting Jesus?

OK, you're just going ignore the whole post and ask a simplistic question. That's fine. We can do it this way.

Peter furnishes the answer, "Peter and the other apostles replied: "We must obey God rather than men!"" (Acts 5:29).

Paul reinforces the point "I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you to live in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse! Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God? Or am I trying to please people? If I were still trying to please people, I would not be a servant of Christ" (Galatians 1:10).

So, according to scripture, if those men (the Apostles) go against what God said then no, we'd be rejecting Jesus by following them instead of God's word.

Did Jesus start a Church?

If you'd have bothered to read my post you'd have already seen the answer.

The church that Jesus started is united and therefore cannot boast in human leaders such as Peter, which the Bible tells us is disunity through causing quarreling.

Jesus came to preach the gospel that He would die on the cross in fulfillment of the Hebrews Scriptures for all the faithful who would accept the gift of salvation by grace through faith, not by works.

Those believers are an assembly (ekkelisa) who comprise His body on earth.

What we learn from 1 Corinthians 3 is that those who create disunity and strife through human weakness are those who boast in human leaders as though such leaders as Cephas (Peter) could be the foundation of God's temple, which is actually qualified in that passage as built with Christ as the foundation, the Apostles as co-workers with individual believers all of whom make up the spiritual temple with God in the midst.

The passage says not to deceive ourselves in supposing that Paul or the other apostles are anything but co-workers, not to boast in them (including Peter) and to accept Christ, and only Christ, as the foundation.

So what we learn unquestionably from the passage is that any institution that boasts in leaders such as Peter is causing disunity and is wordly and no one can build a church on any other foundation than Jesus alone, so the church Jesus started is not characterized by the disunity that comes with boasting in human leaders such as Peter, as though there were another foundation other than Jesus.

Do you really have to push the Catholic Dogma again until the thread is closed down, or can you finally just let the Bible speak and keep the opinions of human leaders out?

[churchmouse2]

Denminations: Can anybody help me unbderstand why my post of last night in response to Kasey 777 was removed. As far as I know I violated nothing in the post. Everything which I said was backed up by God's Word. Is the moderation of our posts an arbitrary screener? Are there actually rules available which outline just what you can say and not?

I looked back through this whole thread and could not find a post by Kasey777.  Are you sure you are looking in the right thread?  

Edited October 20, 2011 by churchmouse2