who is Melchizedek?

[Sevenseas]

Mr. Massorite

This Post is nothing more than a personal attack and has nothing to do with the discussion. If you can't particapate in the discussion I suggest you look for some place else to speak your imature insults on someone else who cares about your insults. I never said that I was God but I can say that God/Jesus insulted many of his creation with words. He called certain of his people a brood of vipors, told a woman she was equal to a dog, called his own diciple Satan and so on.

I won't be responding to anymore of this kind of garbage from you in the future.

I have been posting on this board since 2007 in the same way and fashion so no I do not need to tone down my rhetoric. Why Because there is nothing wrong with my rhetoric. Now there have been times in the past when a mod has warned me but that was way back when I was actually insulting people.

What the Bible says about Mr M's attitude:

if you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any fellowship with the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, 2then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and purpose. 3Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves. 4Each of you should look not only to your own interests, but also to the interests of others.

5Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus:

6

Who, being in very nature

a

God,

did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,

7

but made himself nothing,

taking the very nature

b

of a servant,

being made in human likeness.

8

And being found in appearance as a man,

he humbled himself

and became obedient to death—

even death on a cross! Phil.2

A man's pride brings him low, but a man of lowly spirit gains honor. Prov. 29:23

Mr. M...your attitude has

become

the discussion. When I snark at people...and I do sometimes....I never blame Jesus.

I know it's just me either becoming vexed at someone's donkey attitude or my own pride

If it is my pride, then I need to step back and apologize to the person if I have been rude or, if it is the person who has

the donkey attitude... stubborn, unwilling to learn, braying like a fool and ready to kick out for no reason other than it is

a donkey, then I either report it to the mods or try to be gentle in my response because animals respond best to kindness

Donkeys generally start braying when you don't agree with their opinions that they believe are scripture. Sometimes, they

just don't understand...other times, well, other times they want to make scripture fit what they already believe so that they

will not have to have the discomfort of modifying their life.

I will leave it to you to decide which flaw you are exhibiting as it certainly is not the nature of Christ.

I think you owe everyone here an apology and I'm not a mod, but that is what I think.

[Massorite]

There was no insult intended but I did speak my mind and I truly believe that I am 100% right.

I have no problem with that. I do have a problem with the way you're going about it.

It seems that people like you miss so much when you make it so complicated to understand scripture and I have also found that people like you never learn how to do anything different.

As you don't even know me...that is quite presumptuous on your part. The only thing that you seem to be saying is that anyone who does not agree with you is some sort of idiot. I am well versed in the school of thought that says Melchizedek was an appearance of Christ in the OT...I have spoken with theologians who believe it...and have enjoyed discussing it with them...because they have been able to intelligently articulate and present their side without the overflow of self righteousness and vitriol that you have spewed in this thread.

1. In EXODUS 33:22 God did appear to Moses as God but God did not allow Moses to see his face. God allowed Moses to see his backside. Which means that if we are made in the image of God then God has a butt like we do.

An interesting interpretation of scripture...Hmmmm

I do not give the "Rabbinical form of argument" any power because they are not always accurate. On this subject and according to you they say that Melchizedek was a typology of Jesus and indeed the bible is full of typology. however there no scriptural proof that Melchizedek as human and infact scripture tells us that Mechizedek will live for ever which means that his body is not corrupted and not limited by death as humans are. However if you stick to what the Rabbi's say then Melchizedek was human and therefore would have to die because Why? Because it is given to every human/man to die once. Isn't that what the word of God says? Hebrew 9:27. So where is the record of the death of Melchizedek?

Another reason I give no power to any Rabbinical argument is because for the most part they have the worng mind set. Is this a Rabbi who belives in Jesus or not. I can't reseach this Rabbi because you don't tell us who the source of these statments are. So quoting Ribbinical aurguments without telling us who the Rabbi was is useless. It gives us nothing.

I can only surmise that you are completely ignorant of what a form of rabbinical argument is. It is a STYLE of presentation common in Jewish theological writings...that's all...a style of writing. Period.

It uses a qal va-chomer, or a fortiori argument utilizing comparison, contrast, typology, and scripture to define and present a point. In the case of Hebrews, the superiority of Christ over all things because he is messiah.

If you're going to blow a gasket...at least know what you are blowing it over.

]"I believe that Vs 3 which says: without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like the Son of God, remains a priest continually Merely refers to the fact that there is no genealogy recorded, and as there is no record of his death...he remains a priest...once again a typology."

Not only that but this so called argument minipulates the verse. It comes up with a lame argument about the Geneology and says nothing about the fact that the same verse say that Melchizedec had no beginning of days and no end of life. So where are the Ribbiniacl arguments for these statments. Only a self blinded Rabbi would not see that if Melchizedek had no beginning of days that there would not be a Father or a Mother recorded in the first place and where does that put you when you are falling in right behind him. It is Garantied that this Rabbi does not believe in Jesus and therefore has the wrong frame of mind when creating arguement.

Funny thing, that...the writer of Hebrews was obviously a Christian...establishing the superiority and primacy of Christ, so stating: It is Garantied that this Rabbi does not believe in Jesus and therefore has the wrong frame of mind when creating arguement. has got to rate among the most absurd statements ever made.

You wrote "I have found the Bible to be its own best commentary, serving to enlighten rather than obscure." Well good then I would suggest that you do just that instead of quoting Rabbinical Arguements that are missleading.

You wrote "None (WORSHIP) of this is seen with Melchizedek. No worship, no revelation as God, nothing. WRONG AGAIN, Giving a tenth of our first fruits is worshipping God and we are instructed by God to do so as a form of worship. The scriptures are too many to quote.

In every case...bar none...when a Theophany occurs in the OT, whether by dream, vision, or physical appearance...God is revealed to the person He is visiting; or the person He is visiting recognizes and confesses He is God. Hagar who said You are the God who sees, Moses to whom God said: I am the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham and Issac, and Jacob, Joshua when the man said: Take the shoes off your feet, for where you stand is holy.

Please point out for me...chapter and verse please, where Melchizidek either declares himself to be God, or where Abraham addresses him as "LORD", or where Abraham is told to take the shoes of his feet...point that out to me and I will change my position in a heartbeat.

You might also want to pick up a history book or two...because in those days it was common practice to give tribute to a friendly king when you passed through his country...so Abraham giving a portion to Melchizedek is nothing out of the ordinary, and does not mean that he was worshipping him. And I would also point out that the LEVITICAL LAW OF THE TITHE WAS NOT EVEN ESTABLISHED!

So you probably ought to heed your own admonition and do some more study yourself instead of telling everyone else how they ought to see things.

[Massorite]

Mr. Massorite

This Post is nothing more than a personal attack and has nothing to do with the discussion. If you can't particapate in the discussion I suggest you look for some place else to speak your imature insults on someone else who cares about your insults. I never said that I was God but I can say that God/Jesus insulted many of his creation with words. He called certain of his people a brood of vipors, told a woman she was equal to a dog, called his own diciple Satan and so on.

I won't be responding to anymore of this kind of garbage from you in the future.

I have been posting on this board since 2007 in the same way and fashion so no I do not need to tone down my rhetoric. Why Because there is nothing wrong with my rhetoric. Now there have been times in the past when a mod has warned me but that was way back when I was actually insulting people.

What the Bible says about Mr M's attitude:

if you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any fellowship with the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, 2then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and purpose. 3Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves. 4Each of you should look not only to your own interests, but also to the interests of others.

5Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus:

6

Who, being in very nature

a

God,

did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,

7

but made himself nothing,

taking the very nature

b

of a servant,

being made in human likeness.

8

And being found in appearance as a man,

he humbled himself

and became obedient to death—

even death on a cross! Phil.2

A man's pride brings him low, but a man of lowly spirit gains honor. Prov. 29:23

Mr. M...your attitude has

become

the discussion. When I snark at people...and I do sometimes....I never blame Jesus.

I know it's just me either becoming vexed at someone's donkey attitude or my own pride

If it is my pride, then I need to step back and apologize to the person if I have been rude or, if it is the person who has

the donkey attitude... stubborn, unwilling to learn, braying like a fool and ready to kick out for no reason other than it is

a donkey, then I either report it to the mods or try to be gentle in my response because animals respond best to kindness

Donkeys generally start braying when you don't agree with their opinions that they believe are scripture. Sometimes, they

just don't understand...other times, well, other times they want to make scripture fit what they already believe so that they

will not have to have the discomfort of modifying their life.

I will leave it to you to decide which flaw you are exhibiting as it certainly is not the nature of Christ.

I think you owe everyone here an apology and I'm not a mod, but that is what I think.

[Massorite]

Mr. Massorite

This Post is nothing more than a personal attack and has nothing to do with the discussion. If you can't particapate in the discussion I suggest you look for some place else to speak your imature insults on someone else who cares about your insults. I never said that I was God but I can say that God/Jesus insulted many of his creation with words. He called certain of his people a brood of vipors, told a woman she was equal to a dog, called his own diciple Satan and so on.

I won't be responding to anymore of this kind of garbage from you in the future.

I have been posting on this board since 2007 in the same way and fashion so no I do not need to tone down my rhetoric. Why Because there is nothing wrong with my rhetoric. Now there have been times in the past when a mod has warned me but that was way back when I was actually insulting people.

What the Bible says about Mr M's attitude:

if you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any fellowship with the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, 2then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and purpose. 3Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves. 4Each of you should look not only to your own interests, but also to the interests of others.

5Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus:

6

Who, being in very nature

a

God,

did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,

7

but made himself nothing,

taking the very nature

b

of a servant,

being made in human likeness.

8

And being found in appearance as a man,

he humbled himself

and became obedient to death—

even death on a cross! Phil.2

A man's pride brings him low, but a man of lowly spirit gains honor. Prov. 29:23

Mr. M...your attitude has

become

the discussion. When I snark at people...and I do sometimes....I never blame Jesus.

I know it's just me either becoming vexed at someone's donkey attitude or my own pride

If it is my pride, then I need to step back and apologize to the person if I have been rude or, if it is the person who has

the donkey attitude... stubborn, unwilling to learn, braying like a fool and ready to kick out for no reason other than it is

a donkey, then I either report it to the mods or try to be gentle in my response because animals respond best to kindness

Donkeys generally start braying when you don't agree with their opinions that they believe are scripture. Sometimes, they

just don't understand...other times, well, other times they want to make scripture fit what they already believe so that they

will not have to have the discomfort of modifying their life.

I will leave it to you to decide which flaw you are exhibiting as it certainly is not the nature of Christ.

I think you owe everyone here an apology and I'm not a mod, but that is what I think.

I don't think that I will be giving an apology just because I take the bible literally and don't have a problem with telling others when they are preaching scripture badly.

However you are correct and that was a word of wisdom, My attitude has become the discussion so it is time for me to leave. I know that I am combative and believe it or not it is my God job to be so.

I am sure you disagree but Jesus doesn't.

[Mcgyver]

I don't think that I will be giving an apology just because I take the bible literally and don't have a problem with telling others when they are preaching scripture badly.

However you are correct and that was a word of wisdom, My attitude has become the discussion so it is time for me to leave. I know that I am combative and believe it or not it is my God job to be so.

I am sure you disagree but Jesus doesn't.

Galatians 5: 16-26:

Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.

[*Zion*]

Guys, I'm not a moderator, I'm still very new here, but OneLight, one of the moderators, made a post in the General Discussion section that I think we should all read, and re-read if necessary. It's entitled A word from this ministry so even though we know OneLight feels very strongly about what he's saying, we also know his view is reflected by the whole ministry of WCF - hence, a word from this ministry.

Personally, I'm surprised we even need it. It's one thing to express one's opinion freely, and totally another to present one's opinion as cold hard fact. Let's face it, people have been interpreting the Word of God differently since it was first written. Take Moses' tablets of stone on which was etched the 10 commandments. For him, God's word was life. It is life. He didn't need food or drink for 40 days and nights while he was receiving them. He did that twice. But for the rest of the people, the law in those commandments exposed their sin, which they didn't repent of, and eventually died in. That whole generation, save Joshua and Caleb. They interpreted God's Word as judgement. And you know what? Both views were entirely correct!

We need revelation to deal with God's Word, and the deeper we get into it, the more wonders it will reveal. The same small portion of God's Word will mean healing to one, faith to another, judgement still to another, mercy and grace to yet another. So let's stop using it as a tool to point the finger at each other in condemnation - that's not just judgement - before we do some serious damage. We don't want to scare off the very people we're welcoming and we don't need to hurt one another's feeling just for the sake of being right. Not a good testimony. We haven't seen each other face to face, but if we really are who we say we are in Christ, then we know that we are all brothers and sisters here. If that's so, we should care about not hurting each other. Just speaking the truth, right? Then speak the truth in love, and show that you're doing it out of love. We hijack threads by turning them into our own personal arguments. Not very fair on poor SilviaWang who started this thread, and who wanted learn something about Melchizedek, is it? I was really enjoying considering what everybody thought, until another blame game erupted again.

By the way, considering someone's point of view even if we don't agree with it is not a weakness. It's a strength. We are not always going to be right. Not 100% of the time, not 99% of the time, not even 80%. How ever clever we think we are, we're not. God's the clever one. The best we can do on our own is 50/50. If we want to be right we need to totally agree with God's Word. All of it.

Do I think I'm right to post this? I don't know, but I do know that I'm tired of this arguing. This isn't anyone's idea of a healthy debate, and nobody should be expected to just take it. But don't worry about proving me wrong. If the moderators don't like my post, they'll delete it or send me a message or ban me or something. If I have done something unfair here, then your best bet is to complain to them, not to me. I'll be the one most likely to stand up for myself, so attacking me directly wouldn't really be hitting me where it hurts, concerning my being here at WCF. And if I wanted to be banned, I wouldn't care so much as to take the time to type out this post.

Read OneLight's post.

That all said, can we please get back to the subject at hand? It was really getting interesting.

God bless you all. I really mean that. Take it anyway you want, but I'm giving it as a real God bless you.

[Mcgyver]

Good post...full of wisdom and grace...thanks!

[JohnD]

I believe he was a Theophany / Christophany.