Womanhood

[nebula]

I see her as being a help meet to her husband.

I went through the Hebrew words translated as "helpmeet" in the KJV in

In summary, ezer kenegdo is the complete phrase and it expresses not broodmare, or a companion likened unto a dog, or even the workhorse. But rather, we see a person of strength and power who is equal and opposite to the man who is there for him.(Click on the link to see why.)

Some other sources I read who have studied this phrase, especially the word kenegdo have this to say:

The traditional teaching for the woman as help (meet) is that of assistant or helper subservient to the one being helped. This definition would appear to line up with Strong's definition of the word. However, if you look at the context of every other use of the word ezer in the scripture, you will see that ezer refers to either God or military allies. In all other cases the one giving the help is superior to the one receiving the help. Adding kenegdo (meet) modifies the meaning to that of equal rather than superior status. God says just what He means. (

Source

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The case that begins to build is that we can be sure that `ezer means "strength" or "power" whenever it is used in parallelism with words for majesty or other words for power such as `oz or `uzzo. In fact, the presence of two names for one king, Azariah and Uzziah, both referring to God's strength, makes it abundantly clear that the root `ezer meaning "strength" was known in Hebrew.

Therefore, could we conclude that Genesis 2:18 be translated as "I will make a power [or strength] corresponding to man." Freedman even suggests on the basis of later Hebrew that the second word in the Hebrew expression found in this verse should be rendered equal to him. If so, then God makes for the man a woman fully his equal and fully his match. In this way, the man's loneliness will be assuaged.

The same line of reasoning occurs with the apostle Paul, who urged in 1 Corinthians 11:10, "For this reason, a woman must have power [or authority] on her head [that is to say, invested in her]."

This line of reasoning, which stresses full equality, is continued in Genesis 2:23 where Adam says of Eve, "This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called ‘woman,' for she was taken out of man." The idiomatic sense of this phrase "bone of my bones" is a "very close relative" to "one of us" or in effect "our equal."

The woman was never meant to be an assistant or "helpmate" to the man. The word "mate" slipped into English since it was so close to the Old English word "meet," which means "fit to" or "corresponding to" the man which comes from the phrase that likely means "equal to."

What God had intended, then, was to make a "power" or "strength" for the man who would in every way "correspond to him" or even "be his equal."" (

Source

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Another interesting perspective is found here: http://skipmoen.com/2012/12/10/top-of-the-pyramid/

(It's best to read the whole thing.)

[Guest Butero]

As for women being CEO's and Directors of Companies, I am saying that there is nothing in Proverbs 31 that indicates they would be an example of a virtuous woman. Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

15 She riseth also while it is yet night, and giveth meat to her household, and a portion to her maidens. 16 She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard. 17 She girdeth her loins with strength, and strengtheneth her arms. 18 She perceiveth that her merchandise is good: her candle goeth not out by night. 19 She layeth her hands to the spindle, and her hands hold the distaff. 20 She stretcheth out her hand to the poor; yea, she reacheth forth her hands to the needy. 21 She is not afraid of the snow for her household: for all her household are clothed with scarlet. 22 She maketh herself coverings of tapestry; her clothing is silk and purple. 23 Her husband is known in the gates, when he sitteth among the elders of the land. 24 She maketh fine linen, and selleth it; and delivereth girdles unto the merchant.

Sounds to me like the woman is supposed to be a CEO. Do you not see her as the CEO of the house here?

I see her as being a help meet to her husband.

It seems she is in charge of the household - the manager, the supervisor, the boss.

That is true, but she is still under the authority of her husband. The Bible says that wives are to submit unto their husbands in the same way the church submits to Christ. Christ has given us delegated authority in this world, and we carry it out. For one thing, we are over all the animals. You find that in Genesis, but any authority we have is delegated. The head of the woman is the man. The head of the man is Christ. The head of Christ is God the Father.

BTW, I use the Strongs Dictionary, and just because you can find a link to another source that creates something more to your liking doesn't mean I am going to accept it as accurate, anymore than I will accept other Bible translations as accurate.

To Fez, of course there is nothing in the Bible that says a woman cannot be a CEO. I don't even think there was such a thing as a CEO in Bible days? At the same time, the Bible does make it clear that the man and woman were created to fulfil a specifc role in this world. The man is required to earn a living by the sweat of his brow, and be the provider, and the woman was created to be his helper.

And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make an help meet for him. Gen 2:18

Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. Gen 3:16

To the man, he said the following:

And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life. Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field: In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. Gen 3:17-20

We all have our God given roles to play in this life. What has happened is that mankind isn't satisfied with the role God gave us. Women don't like being in subjection to their husbands and being wives and mothers and keepers of the home. Men don't like having to work so hard earning a living. As a result, false doctrines have been created that nullify all the scriptures that show the husband is the head of the household, and the wife is just a companion in the home, equal in authority. That is funny, considering the fact that we are told that the marriage relationship is equal to Christ and the church, and if that is true, that would make us equal to Christ. On the other hand, perhaps it isn't that strange, since mosf of the church rejects the need to submit to the Lord?

Anyway, the women get jobs so that they can't be controlled. If the husband gets too bossy, they will cry abuse, and leave. They have their own source of income anyway, so it is no big deal. The husband gets by without having to work so hard, as he has a wife who is helping earn a living by the sweat of her brow, taking on part of his curse. She is a person he dwells with for companionship and someone to help with the finances. She is not really a wife in the way God intended, and they are not really one flesh. They are two independent people dwelling together, who happen to have a license from the government saying they are legally married. That is why divorce is so high. Since they are never really one, it is easy to split when times get hard.

So as to the woman being a CEO? While there is nothing that specifically says she can't be a CEO, as there is nothing that says a man can't be a house husband, this is a departure from God's plan.

[gdemoss]

With all the discussion about the 'help meet' thing, I was provoked to go research for myself and understand because I do not ever wish to be having some unrealistic expectation of a woman's position but rather understand that which is true. I came away with a sense of awe for what her position truly is and how deceived our modern women truly are. I encourage every woman to study for herself this word throughout the bible and come to understand what kind of helper you were made to be for you husband. It must be understood in light of all the rest of scripture that explains what it means to be a righteous woman before God. Women have just as demanding a role in life as men do but it is complimentary in nature though their fallen nature guarantees that they will desire to rule. For this cause, I can only seek to support my sisters in their efforts to submit unto the Holy Spirit and overcome the desire of the flesh, eyes and pride of life that plagues them. Peace in Christ.

[nebula]

Anyway, the women get jobs so that they can't be controlled.

This is a false accusation on why women get jobs.

Many women become vets, biologists, teachers, daycare providers, etc. because they like doing such.

Many women work to help pay for their children's college education.

Many women work because both her husband and her want additional income into the family.

And many women work because we are single and have to support ourselves.

If the husband gets too bossy, they will cry abuse, and leave.

This is another false accusation.

They have their own source of income anyway, so it is no big deal.

No, it is a big deal. Divorce takes years to recover from, even for the one who filed for the divorce.

The husband gets by without having to work so hard, as he has a wife who is helping earn a living by the sweat of her brow, taking on part of his curse.

Are you saying that husbands slack at his job or not be driven to improve his income because of a working wife?

What men have you seen doing this?

She is a person he dwells with for companionship and someone to help with the finances. She is not really a wife in the way God intended, and they are not really one flesh. They are two independent people dwelling together, who happen to have a license from the government saying they are legally married. That is why divorce is so high. Since they are never really one, it is easy to split when times get hard.

Can you prove that a woman with a job is not one with her husband?

[GoldenEagle]

Anyway, the women get jobs so that they can't be controlled. If the husband gets too bossy, they will cry abuse, and leave. They have their own source of income anyway, so it is no big deal. The husband gets by without having to work so hard, as he has a wife who is helping earn a living by the sweat of her brow, taking on part of his curse. She is a person he dwells with for companionship and someone to help with the finances. She is not really a wife in the way God intended, and they are not really one flesh. They are two independent people dwelling together, who happen to have a license from the government saying they are legally married. That is why divorce is so high. Since they are never really one, it is easy to split when times get hard.

Honestly Butero these comments above in bold seem very sexist and judgmental. This is not the case 100% regarding your comments in bold. This is your version of what you've experienced perhaps? A personal conviction if you will. Just like women should always wear dresses and not pants. Perhaps you didn't see these comments by women on the thread... Sometimes women work out of necessity.

Butero, what do you think of all the women who work outside of the home because they have to in order to keep their family afloat? I work in the corporate world...

Butero, what do you think of all the women who work outside of the home because they have to in order to keep their family afloat? I work in the corporate world...

I am having to look for work too. One job is not necessarily enough today to keep a growing family afloat... only going part time though. Hubby remains the primary breadwinner.

My grandfather had a serious infection in his leg that kept him from working for two years. My grandmother was the bread winner during that time. Would you call her ungodly or a woman without true Christian Biblical character?

During a time in my career when hours were cut at work and I couldn't find a better job my wife took a job to help support us. This lasted for about 1.5 years and was very difficult.

Perhaps your wife has never had to work due to your job situation. In this economy and in this culture it's not always women working because of independent spirits as you claim. I don't often say this but you're simply plain wrong in this instance.

Honestly, I'm tired of this thread and considering shutting it down. The OP was a cry for help (notice she hasn't returned to the thread... wonder why?) and this has turn into bashing women IMO.

Peace,

GE

[enoob57]

The Lord teaches us sin brings confusion and that is what we are seeing here in the clothes issue...

these matters of dress is one of heart and purpose- this is what God has brought us into in these last

days in His Son 'purpose and intent of heart' ...

The presence of sin has brought focus upon wrong elements~ as in the begin they were naked and were

not ashamed! you cannot take from this leavened lump of existence and make for yourselves a holy

and righteous place! The millennial kingdom proves that even in the perfect reign ot Christ and the world

is brought back to Garden like qualities still iniquity will be present as lucifer is loosed and others follow

him still! Thus knowing all the God has told us will be! We are to be a people who focus the heart to here:

Col 3:1-11

3 If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the

right hand of God. 2 Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For you died, and your

life is hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with

Him in glory.

5 Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion

,

evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 Because of these things the wrath of God is

coming upon the sons of disobedience, 7 in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.

8 But now you yourselves are to put off all these: anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy language out

of your mouth. 9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds, 10 and

have put on the new man who is renewed in knowledge according to the image of Him who created him,

11 where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave nor

free, but Christ is all and in all.

NKJV

Notice here all these elements listed is matters of heart and not outward adornments or of foods etc. !

The evil one would like nothing better than to make New Testament pharasies and saducees focussing

upon that which God is not keeping and letting go of the focus of the heart preparing to look The Lord

in the eye and give an account of our heart to Him and Why! Love, Steven

And that means that if a man wears a dress, he should be welcome to be a Sunday School teacher in your church, right?

Spiritual things are discerned spiritually... your reply indicates the lack thereof! Love, Steven

[ncn]

This thread has made me so sad.

When I think of all the women that work to keep their family together,

to bring food on the table and clothes on their children's back.

We live in harsh times, a recession.

Many families have seen the bread winner loose his job and the lady of the house has stepped in and

kept things going. Her wage has not only paid the mortgage but also the education for their children.

More than often it is done with sacrifice and yet it is and is done out of love; not only for their children but

for their spouse.

To say that a women with a job is not, "one with her husband", is so insulting to all those women that make ends meet daily.

[wingnut-]

I find it sad also ncn, and I had stayed out of this thread because I felt it was really a matter for women to discuss amongst themselves. I find it ironic that a person would see the opposite gender as unequal, and at the same time believe they're an expert on how the opposite gender should be. Perhaps the ladies should take the discussion to their private forum. At any rate, God bless all of you ladies for doing what you do.

[ncn]

God bless all of you ladies for doing what you do.

Amen wing.

[Fez]

This thread has made me so sad.

When I think of all the women that work to keep their family together,

to bring food on the table and clothes on their children's back.

We live in harsh times, a recession.

Many families have seen the bread winner loose his job and the lady of the house has stepped in and

kept things going. Her wage has not only paid the mortgage but also the education for their children.

More than often it is done with sacrifice and yet it is and is done out of love; not only for their children but

for their spouse.

To say that a women with a job is not, "one with her husband", is so insulting to all those women that make ends meet daily.

I find it sad also ncn, and I had stayed out of this thread because I felt it was really a matter for women to discuss amongst themselves. I find it ironic that a person would see the opposite gender as unequal, and at the same time believe they're an expert on how the opposite gender should be. Perhaps the ladies should take the discussion to their private forum. At any rate, God bless all of you ladies for doing what you do.

And this is why living under the law alone is a curse. Parts of this thread have done nothing but demean any woman who does not subject herself to the yoke of OT law. They make a mockery of why Jesus fulfilled the law and bind ones heart in chains just reading them. One wonders if those espousing this strict adherence to the law actually obey every law, or just those that suit them.