Sex scandals in the Church

[missmuffet]

I once heard the late Dr. J. Vernon McGee state that the day Constantine "legalized" Christianity was the day the devil joined the Church. I was unable to record it, looked for it everywhere, but was unable to find it.

I love to listen to Dr.J.Vernon McGee 

[JohnD]

For those scratching their heads about now...

 

The teachings of God were brought out most poignantly when our Lord Jesus walked the earth. The contrasts of scripture culminate in his teachings. There are only two ways in heaven and earth:

 

1. God's way

2. not God's way

 

There is an innumerable amount of varieties of "not God's way..." but all are under the heading of not God's way just the same.

 

A prime example is when Peter blessed the Lord with his revelation "Thou art the Christ the Son of the living God" one minute and the next minute he was called Satan by the Lord (Matthew 16:13-23). The difference being one minute he was going by the Spirit and the next minute by the flesh.

 

And that's really the rub with all matters and teachings of God, isn't it?

 

The flesh is weak even when the spirit is willing. The flesh counts for nothing. My words are spirit and they are life.

 

Getting back to the OP...

 

The Church has been veering off course since Roman dominated / hijacked the Church in the 4th Century CE. It is no wonder the heinous and evil things that have happened in a compromised Church with severe identity crisis and amnesia at times. The wonder of it all is when things go right in the compromised Church. 

[JohnD]

 

I once heard the late Dr. J. Vernon McGee state that the day Constantine "legalized" Christianity was the day the devil joined the Church. I was unable to record it, looked for it everywhere, but was unable to find it.

I love to listen to Dr.J.Vernon McGee 

 

 

He was and is such a blessing.

 

He studied and went to seminary and did the church pastoral gig for many years (the Church of the Open Door in Downtown L.A. was his last Church). But his true outreach (and IMHO his fulfilled calling) was in his retirement years when he sat in his study and with an open Bible recorded what is now the 5 year Through the Bible program.

 

Dr. McGee went home to be with the Lord in 1985. But his teaching and outreach lives on today. I heard him late the other night when I was on break at my second job and it touched my spirit like nothing has in a long time.

[nebula]

 

 

This is only speculation, but I am trying to place myself in the mind of someone who is a conservative evangelical and a believer in eternal security.  Lets say I am a believer in eternal security and I am tempted with an attractive woman.  I go ahead and cheat, figuring we all sin.  Sin is sin.  Little ones are as bad as big ones.  We are saved by grace, not by following the law.  Sometimes we just give in when we are tempted.  God understands.  On the other hand, if I am an evangelical and I am tempted with an attractive woman, I know that my failures could lead me to hell, but I figure that after I cheat, I will likely have time to confess the sin and make things right with God.  I put it out of my mind that I might not get that chance.  Then there is that in-between group of evangelicals that don't believe in eternal security, but they believe that losing salvation takes time, and one sinful act won't cost them salvation.  They figure they will make things right later on, and that one indiscretion won't cost them their salvation.  It all depends on your perspective, but nearly anyone can come up with excuses to make what they know is wrong ok.

If someone's motivation for sin vs. not sin is about saving one's own derriere, this person has a bigger problem than the sin temptation.

 

The question ought not to be, "Will I go to Hell or not?" The question ought to be, "Is this loving towards God to do this?" Likewise, "Is this loving towards my brothers and sisters in Christ to do this?"

 

The person who cares only about their eternal fate is acting very selfishly, and is denying the power of the Cross in their lives to transform them.

 

I know this may come as a shock to you, but not everyone looks at things like you do.

 

Why the snide remark?

 

There are many people that are highly motivated by fear of judgment, and that is a healthy fear to have.  You call such individuals selfish.  Have you ever read in Romans about how we have freedom to do all kinds of things, but if it offends our brothers or sisters, we shouldn't do it.  I could argue all the people that do things they know are offensive to others are selfish.  We are not all in the same place, and we are not all motivated by the same things, and while in your mind, not doing something just because of how it effects others might be the ideal, sometimes concern for self is more powerful.

How sad to not have encountered the love of God such that one is motivated by what pleases Him and what will draw them closer to Him, or what will pull them from Him.

Is the power of the cross so nullified?

 

At the time when a man or woman is filled with lust, they aren't thinking about those things.  They are blocking them out on purpose.  They are lying to themselves.  They are trying to convince themselves that what they are about to do is not really any worse than what the next fellow does, and God understands we are human.  They might even compare themselves to King David and his failures.

That isn't loving God, that is foolishness.

 

[Sevenseas]

 

Because Satan is in our Churches.

 

That is one of the most intelligent and truthful responses I have seen anywhere in a very long time!

 

Thank you for blessing me. I have been really discouraged that the whole world is blind to this simple fact.

 

And this is why I am (true to my mission statement under my avatar) trying to get the Church back to the Hebrew Roots (by way of back to the Bible as the authority).

 

 

Of course the devil is active where believers gather.  I certainly agree with that statement...however, the devil is also in shopping malls, movie theaters, kindergarten and the pet store.

 

He is the god of this world.

 

The devil is not the problem...the problem is Christians who don't know what they believe and go to church once a week and get spoon fed and then try to put the pieces together like a puzzle.

 

Let's not blame the devil....he doesn't 'make' anyone do anything...we are led astray by our own sin and sinful choices

 

People fall into sin when they put their hands over their ears, not because the devil is sticking them in the derriere with a pitchfork and forcing them to do acts in defiance of God

 

I don't know what to say here....really  

 

There is nothing new under the sun

[Sevenseas]

Jospeh knew what to do when he was tempted.

 

Do a Joseph.  

 

So simple by gum, a person could miss it.

 

God does not show up to save you when you have put yourself in a situation where you lust and aggravate it by being alone with the person.

 

God does not tempt anyone.  Joseph was put in prison because he fled.  He was falsely accused and put in prison because he did not want to sin.

 

Anybody ever just walk away?  Or do you play with it in your mind until you act it out?  Because, that is where sin starts.

 

It starts in your mind.  Renew your mind.   

[Willa]

We are told that there are goats among the sheep as well as wolves in sheeps clothing.

[1x1is1]

 

I once heard the late Dr. J. Vernon McGee state that the day Constantine "legalized" Christianity was the day the devil joined the Church. I was unable to record it, looked for it everywhere, but was unable to find it.

I love to listen to Dr.J.Vernon McGee 

 

bopeep1909.....I listened to Dr. J. Vernon McGee for more than "2" years before I discovered that he had died many years ago.  I still listen to him.

[nebula]

"Some people are afraid that God will punish them for their sins, but the true fear of God, yirat ha'shamayim, is rather the fear of losing our closeness to Him... The sages say that where it is written, "What does the LORD ask of you except to fear the LORD" (Deut. 10:12), we should read instead, "fear with the LORD" (לְיִרְאָה אֶת־יְהוָה), that is, we share his concern that we could forfeit the sanctity of a heart-relationship with Him due to carelessness and sin... We fear our sin because it blinds us from awareness of God's care and love. The fear of God can therefore be understood as God's fear that we will miss the blessing of intimately knowing him."

 

Source

[Guest Butero]

"Some people are afraid that God will punish them for their sins, but the true fear of God, yirat ha'shamayim, is rather the fear of losing our closeness to Him... The sages say that where it is written, "What does the LORD ask of you except to fear the LORD" (Deut. 10:12), we should read instead, "fear with the LORD" (לְיִרְאָה אֶת־יְהוָה), that is, we share his concern that we could forfeit the sanctity of a heart-relationship with Him due to carelessness and sin... We fear our sin because it blinds us from awareness of God's care and love. The fear of God can therefore be understood as God's fear that we will miss the blessing of intimately knowing him."

 

Source

Why should I believe this is right?  Why should I accept that we shouldn't fear the Lord will punish us for our sins when we have scriptural examples of God punishing people because of sin?  Why should we change the way we look at how we should fear the Lord?  How do I know the way you preach is correct?