Is it a sin for women to preach?

[ncn]

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[LanceA]

This is something I wrote up for another forum I am on and thought it would go along with this topic.

 

 

 

Ok I know this topic will have a few who disagree, but I thought it should be brought up anyways.

 

Is the feminist movement in some way stirred up by satan?  If we look at the Church's current state with a lot more female pastors and leaders we could possibly agree this is the cause of satan and spiritual warfare.  How many churches have been divided because of a denomination allowing women ministers?  How many friendships have been torn apart over this as well?  The Church is in a confused state and satan is loving every bit of it.

 

1 Corinthians 14:33 NASB

"for God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints"

 

So if this confusion within the church isn't from God then that only leaves us to ascertain that it is coming from satan. Satan wants nothing more than to destroy the Church and divide it.

 

John 10:10 NASB

The thief (satan) comes only to steal and kill and destroy;

 

So with this feminist movement women have a lot more rights than they had before.  So according to the Bible do women have a right to be a pastor/leader of the Church?  The Bible does say men and women have the same equality.

1. Made in God's Image

2. Dominion over the Earth

3. Joint heirs in Christ

 

The equality men have with women has nothing to do with leadership in the Church or the home.  The feminist movement is a form of rebellion and the Bible has something to say about rebellion.

 

1 Samuel 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of divination, and insubordination is as iniquity and idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, He has also rejected you from being king.

 

Granted this verse is referring to Saul and his disobedience to God, we can surely use it in any part or our lives.  If men or women rebel against the Word of God, He will reject us.  Now why would God claim women should submit to their husbands and not have equal roles in the household and the Church?  There are a few verses that can clarify this in the Bible and it starts in Genesis and the fall of man.

 

In Genesis 2:22 we see that God created a women out of Adams rib.  Man was created first for a reason, and this reason is to be the symbol of leadership in the family and spiritual leadership.

In Genesis 3 we see the women being deceived by satan and therefore causing the fall of man.  Granted man also ate the fruit, but since the woman was the one deceived she was punished for it and we see that punishment in Genesis 4:16.

"To the woman He said, I will greatly multiply your pain in childbirth, in pain you will bring forth children; Yet your desire will be for your husband, And he will rule over you."

 

The Word of God is truth and technically we don't have to go any further than the part where God says man will rule over a woman.  This doesn't mean men can be abusive to a woman, but within the household and spiritual concerns the man is the leader.  Even in the New Testament it speaks of this same command from God; so we know it didn't end with the old law.

 

1 Timothy 2:11-15

"A woman must quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness. But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression."

 

1 Corinthians 14:34-35

"The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says.  If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in Church"

 

So this solidifies what the Old Testament says about man and woman.  A lot of people will say Paul was speaking to a certain Church, but I disagree.  Why would he comment on creation and the fall of man if this was for just one Church?

 

Another verse in the Bible claims that women are a weaker vessel.

 

1 Peter 3:7

"You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman"

 

This verse is talking about submitting to our wives but not submitting to them as a leader but out of understanding and being sensitive to their needs.  Now the verse does say the woman is weaker than the man.  I am not fully sure this is speaking of physically weaker or spiritually?  Could it be because of the temptation with satan and Eve that God considers women weaker spiritually than man and that is another motivation behind not allowing a woman to be a leader?  This is just my speculation and most likely it is the physical part that men need to be sensitive towards.

 

The biggest argument I have come across with the women pastors or leaders is the Holy Spirit spoke to me and this is what He said.  The bible speaks of testing the spirits and if a spirit or a person is telling you that this is ok then we are to test the spirits with the Word of God.  If the Word of God doesn't line up with what the spirit is saying then we are not to go along with it.

 

1 John 4:1

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God"

 

Psalms 119:169

"Let my cry come before You, O Lord; Give me understanding according to Your Word"

 

So from what we see from the Word of God we are to test the spirits and get clear understanding according to the Word of God.  If it doesn't line up with the Word of God then it isn't coming from the Holy Spirit.

 

The next verse it talks about Christ being the head of every man and man to woman.

 

1 Corinthians 11:3-9

"But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ"

 

The Word of God speaks for itself and clearly states the roles of man and women.  If we believe the Bible is God Breathed, then we have to accept that every part of the Bible is truth.

 

2 Timothy 3:16-17

"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."

 

The Word is Truth

 

John 17:17

"Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth"

 

Psalm 119:160

"The sum of Your word is truth, And every one of Your righteous ordinances is everlasting"

 

Titus 1:6-7 and 1 Timothy 3:2 both give qualifications for leaders of a church and specifically state it is a man not a woman.

 

I believe I have provided enough evidence that the Word of God states the man is the leader of the household and the Church.  I believe the result of the feminist movement has caused a lot of division in the Church lately and this is caused by satan and spiritual warfare.

 

I have many women in my life and I respect all of them.  I have female family members who have mentored me in the Word of God and I love them dearly.  Even though they have been mentors of mine they all agree that women should not be leaders of the Church and it is the man’s responsibility to be in charge of the household.  I hope this brings some good conversation and doesn't cause any type of bad feelings because someone disagrees. 

 

Lance

Edited September 6, 2014 by LanceA

[gdemoss]

This is a hard topic as are most. If we miss any of the foundation built in Genesis then we miss everything. Paul knew this and called back to the beginning when talking about this topic when he said that women are to be under obedience as also the scriptures say.

God is God.

When Eve was beguiled there were unchangeable consequences for her actions that would affect every single woman who would ever live after her though they had not repeated her error. Same as Adams sin caused all his children to be sentenced to death.

Cains children are in a worse boat. And Hams children through Cainan the same.

God is God. God is without side.

When the angel of the Lord showed up and Joshua asked him if he was for them or against them he replied neither. He was wwithout side.

We have all been duped into missing the point of what has been going on since the world began. The human race. God commanded the man and his wife to go out into the world and subdue it. Have dominion over it. The problem is that due to the darkness they have not known what that means or how to do it.

God has revealed in his word how to run the race to win but nobody believes him as usual because they have an opinion that was a direct result of the garden incident with Eve.

The way to win is to obey God and deal righteously with the burden of sin placed upon them as Jesus did being obedient even unto death.

The scripture reveals that God punishes his people by causing women and children to rule over them. Of course women are competent, Satan the destroyer would not have it any other way. But be careful what you say or do with a woman who would rise up in power as there is no power given except by God.

My confusion comes with that which is spoken of in the OT concerning the time coming where the sins of the father no longer being visited on the son. When this time comes it changes everything.

God bless and live according to your conscience in all things praying for Gods will to be done.

[Sevenseas]

 

 

The scripture reveals that God punishes his people by causing women and children to rule over them. Of course women are competent, Satan the destroyer would not have it any other way. But be careful what you say or do with a woman who would rise up in power as there is no power given except by God.

 

 

Please quote the scripture to which you are referring here.

 

I am competent...I do not credit the devil for that but rather God who created me of sound mind.  I have no status other then the one God allows. 

 

I don't think you know what you are talking about.

 

Perhaps certain women can see through certain men and that scares those men.

 

I have a low opinion of men who would like to blame the ills of the world on women.  Christian women are the redeemed of the Lord and perhaps

it is time Christian men acknowledge that instead of pointing at them and saying 'the woman made me do it'.   That didn't wash with God all those

many years ago and it does not wash with Him now.

 

 

 

We have all been duped into missing the point of what has been going on since the world began. The human race. God commanded the man and his wife to go out into the world and subdue it. Have dominion over it. The problem is that due to the darkness they have not known what that means or how to do it. 

 

 

Kindly speak for yourself.  We are not all duped.  Not at all.  What part of the world do you think we should go dominionize?  

 

FYI, those are not women running around in the middle east destroying what little peace those countries had and not women lobbing missiles at Israel.

 

Actually, in those countries, men totally dominate the women and often treat them no better then farmers treat cattle here.

 

God is not punishing the world by letting women rule over men.   

 

If Jesus is our example, then it is time to forgive your wife, girlfriend, sister, mother, aunt and any other female as did Jesus.  

 

I would like to know how a woman is supposed to prophesy in church and be silent at the same time?  According to the NT, the gift of prophecy is basically concerned with

the FORTHTELLING of the word of God and not the FORETELLING.

 

God has revealed in his word how to run the race to win but nobody believes him as usual because they have an opinion that was a direct result of the garden incident with Eve.

 

 

My opinion is that I am free in the name of Christ Jesus, my Savior as are all men and women who put their trust in Him

 

We are not under condemnation nor are we under the sin in the Garden...all things are become new and I praise God for that.

 

It might do well to also remember the promise at the scene of the crime in Eden....

 

And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her seed; He shall bruise you on the head, And you shall bruise him on the heel."  Genesis 3:15

 

Have you not noticed that God in His unfathomable mercy, grace and love, raised women up forever by creating within the womb of a virgin His only begotten Son?

 

Jesus Christ was born of a woman...I would say God had the last word on that one.  

 

We are all one in Christ and He does not condemn...who is it that would condemn?  I only know of one.

 

Yes, there is order in scripture and it should be followed, but not applied like a whip to suit certain personalities who do not truly comprehend God's salvation for ALL mankind...to

all those who call upon His name...man, woman, child...slave, free does not matter

[Openly Curious]

Well put

[Salty]

Hello everyone :-)

So I've had this question for awhile & always asked but I still don't feel comfortable with what other people have told me for some reason. I am a woman so of course I would prefer if the answer was no but I want to know the truth, i don't want to be deceived.

The bible says:

1 Corinthians 14:34

The women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says.

1 Corinthians 14:35

If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.

1 Timothy 2:12

I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.

Among other passages.

Is Paul & Timothy only talking to specific people in their time, or to specific churches that where going through trouble or is this for everybody today also? I always feel the urge to speak about God & tell the whole world about Him but now i'm not even sure if I should do that, also at church I love to participate during the bible studies, i'm even the kid's Sunday school teacher, & my pastor is a woman (we have other pastors in the church but she's the main pastor).so can somebody help me? Thank you so much. GOD bless you guys!!!

 

All those in Christ Jesus should be able to preach The Gospel of Jesus Christ to those who have yet to hear.

 

But the woman is not to usurp authority over the man, according to Apostle Paul.

 

For that reason, I do not hold it as proper for women to become pastors in Christ's Church. But evangelists out in the world to those who haven't heard The Gospel, yes. Just not as a congregational office capacity.

[Sevenseas]

Just for the record, the scripture that was being referenced about God punishing his people in part by women ruling over them is from Isaiah 3:12.

 

As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them.  O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths. 

 

There is no question that there is a clear Biblical order for things, and it is not being followed.  The question in this thread is about whether or not it is a sin for women to preach.  I don't believe it is.  The only thing I can see women are not qualified to do is be Bishops, Deacons and Elders.  Women are not forbidden to teach.  What it is speaking of is the fact wives are not to usurp the authority of their husbands in the home.  They are to be obedient to their own husbands, and follow the example of Sarah, who called her husband Abraham Lord.  It has nothing to do with women sharing the gospel, or teaching classes in church or anything like that.  It is speaking of women taking the rightful place of their husbands and trying to rule the home.  The Biblical chain of authority is God the Father, Jesus Christ, The Man (Husband), The Woman (Wife), The Children.  If anyone wishes to challenge anything I said, I can easily give scripture to back it up, just as I did for the person who failed to post Isaiah 3:12, but only referenced it. 

 

 

well thanks...women rule over them because the men were not being men...however, Gary took it much further

 

I like men being men...I want men to be men...my husband is a man being a man ... I object to men blaming women....

 

I have no objections to yr post Mr B

[heartprint]

I also believe that if you study the Corinthian church at the time that PAUL wrote this you will find that in Corinth the religion preceeding Christianity had women in positions of power and authority. Many of these "priestesses" also were trying to incorporate their previous religion into Christianity which was resulting in false doctrines and error.  I believe Paul wrote this to the Corinthians so that these women of authority would be brought under control and no longer be able to preach false doctrines. Actually as the female was the "goddess" they were making Mary out to be a deity. anyway, it requires a lot of in depth study but in my opinion God NEVER intended that women should be considered lower or of lesser value or unable to lead His people.  One word from even the Old Testament.  Deborah.

Yours in Christ.

[heartprint]

Hello everyone :-)

So I've had this question for awhile & always asked but I still don't feel comfortable with what other people have told me for some reason. I am a woman so of course I would prefer if the answer was no but I want to know the truth, i don't want to be deceived.

The bible says:

1 Corinthians 14:34

The women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says.

1 Corinthians 14:35

If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.

1 Timothy 2:12

I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.

Among other passages.

Is Paul & Timothy only talking to specific people in their time, or to specific churches that where going through trouble or is this for everybody today also? I always feel the urge to speak about God & tell the whole world about Him but now i'm not even sure if I should do that, also at church I love to participate during the bible studies, i'm even the kid's Sunday school teacher, & my pastor is a woman (we have other pastors in the church but she's the main pastor).so can somebody help me? Thank you so much. GOD bless you guys!!!

This is really interesting and it just caught my attention.  1 Corinthians 14:34 states "...just as the Law also states".  Has Paul then put women under the Law?  I was led to believe that in the spirit there is neither slave nor free, Jew nor Gentile, male nor female.  If a church, being the body of Christ,  and the offices and leadership of that church are not being rendered in the spirit then it must be run by the ? state of birth of the believer being either male or female in the flesh?  I understand perfectly in my home and the running of the that home, and the "law" that Paul speaks of which is not the ten commandments, that my husband takes the ownership and the lead role. And I do love and honour him beyond measure. However, in the church, in things of the spirit, my husband will often ask me for clarification and bless me to minister. I wonder what women in ministry and/or leadership in the church have to say about this? Have you asked your lead pastor who is, as you have stated, a woman?  Or have you spoken with the other pastors of the church who are obviously under her authority? If you are part of an organized religion such as Baptist, Pentecostal etc, then your pastors are under a headship that is under a headship that is probably under another headship that is under Christ who is the head of the church. 

Edited September 10, 2014 by heartprint

[heartprint]

Just for the record, the scripture that was being referenced about God punishing his people in part by women ruling over them is from Isaiah 3:12.

 

As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them.  O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths. 

 

There is no question that there is a clear Biblical order for things, and it is not being followed.  The question in this thread is about whether or not it is a sin for women to preach.  I don't believe it is.  The only thing I can see women are not qualified to do is be Bishops, Deacons and Elders.  Women are not forbidden to teach.  What it is speaking of is the fact wives are not to usurp the authority of their husbands in the home.  They are to be obedient to their own husbands, and follow the example of Sarah, who called her husband Abraham Lord.  It has nothing to do with women sharing the gospel, or teaching classes in church or anything like that.  It is speaking of women taking the rightful place of their husbands and trying to rule the home.  The Biblical chain of authority is God the Father, Jesus Christ, The Man (Husband), The Woman (Wife), The Children.  If anyone wishes to challenge anything I said, I can easily give scripture to back it up, just as I did for the person who failed to post Isaiah 3:12, but only referenced it. 

Okay, I looked for this original post and couldn't find it.  Isaiah 3:12 is pulled right out of context to be used in this argument.  According to the whole chapter these women were in power over the men before God's judgement against them and I haven't met ANY Christian woman acting the way these women are described.  So that whole scripture reference is a moot point