Why I am Premillennial not Amillennial

[finestofthewheat]

How do you quote someone with their name in the quote? I am manually coping the text and then manually quoting the text.
 

When the tribulation takes place and the pre rature people realize that they would blapheme God because they were not prepare thus were the foolish virgins

justfaith,

 

They will accuse the brethren day and night who were raptured according to readiness OR they will realize they were not ready to be received at the first rapture which is why they were not taken so then they seek to overcometh.

 

The 5 wise virgins are overcomers from the OT and NT and if any are alive at the time of the first rapture would be raptured alive.

 

The 5 unwise virgins though saved do not get to return to reign with Christ for 1000 years on earth over the nations. Any unwise virgins alive at the first rapture would not be taken but left to pass through the time of testing.

Edited October 23, 2014 by finestofthewheat

[OneLight]

How do you use the quote function as I can't get your text to go into the box to quote? I have to do it by copying and pasting manually which is annoying.

 

Those who will reign with Christ are spoken of in Revelation 20:1-6

 

OneLight,

 

That's correct.

 

Not everyone in Rev. 20.4-6 are martyred. Read. Rev. 2.26,27.

 

Those first raptured according to readiness are included.

 

 

The two passages are not speaking of the same group of people.  Again, you point to verses without posting them and showing how in scripture it means what you are saying. 

 

As for the first question about quoting a post, look at the bottom right of each post.  Click on the button that says "Quote"

[finestofthewheat]

The two passages are not speaking of the same group of people. Again, you point to verses without posting them and showing how in scripture it means what you are saying.

As for the first question about quoting a post, look at the bottom right of each post. Click on the button that says "Quote"

OneLight,

 

I clicked on the quote button but it doesn't quote the post, I just get a blank reply box with no quote.

 

Read Rev. 20.4-6 as there are 3 different groups mentioned, only one of which are martyrs.

[Last Daze]

Missed the point of the question I asked, and also did not provide scripture supporting -two raptures - anything that requires us to be anything other than "ready".  Secondly, you are now questioning my salvation - who I am as a Christian - where I am as a Christian.  I did not support holding "any" false teaching - I am making the point that where a person is in their understanding of where / when the rapture/ post-trib/ pre-trib/ amill. / premill. - affects ones salvation.....Seems to me one should be more concerned with "being ready" to go - instead of knowing when we go. Your statement above also would make you the absolute authority on Revelation - because if I disagree with your timeline- how you say it happens - I hold to a false teaching. The only reason I made my initial post and still the question I ask - does knowing when the rapture occurs - affect you being part of the rapture....and supporting scripture?

 

God Bless,

Hip

 

 

I'd like to give a triple Amen! to the section in red that I highlighted.  It's quite concerning that an event that we have no control over (the timing of the rapture) can cause such division and strife while something that we do have control over (being ready) hardly gets emphasized.  The attention that both receive seem inversely proportional to their relevance.

[finestofthewheat]

One should be concerned with being ready otherwise you will not be received at the first rapture. But we should also know the time when Jesus returns as well, for the Bible tells us so. The Bible would not tell us so not to be known or to benefit us.

"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Rev. 3.3).

Here we read if you are not watchful for when Jesus returns, He will come like a thief and you will not know when He returns; you won't be raptured beforehand.

Jesus says He wants you to know when He returns. Why shun His words?

We do have control over who is raptured before the Tribulation, for if we are not ready, we won't be raptured before the Tribulation. Why is it important to have the correct view and timing of rapture? Because to harbor a false view is symptomatic of something wrong with your heart. I find it hard to believe God tells us the timing then we should be blessed if we get it wrong? Where the does the Bible reward heresy or false teaching?

If you falsely teach anything, whether it be the rapture or the gospel, do you think God should bless you or punish you? Wouldn't it make more sense the reason you teach something false is because your heart is not right before God?

 

Let's take a real life example. Let's say you believe the first rapture is not according to readiness, thus violating Matt. 24.40-42, Luke 21.36 and Rev. 3.10 "before the throne" (7.9) before the 1st trumpet (8.7). Therefore, all else being equal you will live more carnally because you believe as an antinomian no matter what you do now it is ok, you will be raptured ahead of time anyhow.

 

It gets even worse. When you are in the Tribulation you won't realize it, because you assumed pridefully if it was the Tribulation you would have been raptured already, so like Satan you accuse the brethren day and night (Rev. 12.10) who were first raptured. Remember what I said about this being a problem symptomatic of your heart not being right before God?

 

Similarly those who believe the rapture is at the end of the Tribulation only exclude themselves from the reward of the first rapture, so they too will accuse those brethren first raptured according to readiness. These posttribbers will also not return to reign with Christ 1000 years. That's a long time to miss out.

 

It gets even worse with amillennialists because they will forever reject the Jesus who returns to reign on earth for 1000 years, so when Jesus returns not only will they not be raptured but He will war against them and they against Him with the full backing of the Roman Empire revived of religious Rome and political Rome centered on the 7 hilled city, because they consider Him to be a false Christ. Whereas the true Jesus will reign in the 3rd Temple on earth in Jerusalem for 1000 years.

 

I know this offends you, but I am here not to cater to your flesh, but tell you the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God.

Edited October 23, 2014 by finestofthewheat

[rollinTHUNDER]

 

Missed the point of the question I asked, and also did not provide scripture supporting -two raptures - anything that requires us to be anything other than "ready".  Secondly, you are now questioning my salvation - who I am as a Christian - where I am as a Christian.  I did not support holding "any" false teaching - I am making the point that where a person is in their understanding of where / when the rapture/ post-trib/ pre-trib/ amill. / premill. - affects ones salvation.....Seems to me one should be more concerned with "being ready" to go - instead of knowing when we go. Your statement above also would make you the absolute authority on Revelation - because if I disagree with your timeline- how you say it happens - I hold to a false teaching. The only reason I made my initial post and still the question I ask - does knowing when the rapture occurs - affect you being part of the rapture....and supporting scripture?

 

God Bless,

Hip

 

I'd like to give a triple Amen! to the section in red that I highlighted.  It's quite concerning that an event that we have no control over (the timing of the rapture) can cause such division and strife while something that we do have control over (being ready) hardly gets emphasized.  The attention that both receive seem inversely proportional to their relevance.

 

Bulls-eye!!! Good observation by both of you!

 

Being ready is the key!  This usually gets completely overlooked by many.  This is why I wrote a book about it.

 

 

Cheers   

[rollinTHUNDER]

One should be concerned with being ready otherwise you will not be received at the first rapture. But we should also know the time when Jesus returns as well, for the Bible tells us so. The Bible would not tell us so not to be known or to benefit us.

"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Rev. 3.3).

Here we read if you are not watchful for when Jesus returns, He will come like a thief and you will not know when He returns; you won't be raptured beforehand.

Jesus says He wants you to know when He returns. Why shun His words?

Hi fotw,

Yes, we need to be watching, sober and alert, but what are we watching for?

 

We do have control over who is raptured before the Tribulation, for if we are not ready, we won't be raptured before the Tribulation.

Where does God's Word promise a rapture before the tribulation? We must not be watching the same thing(s).

Cheers

[Last Daze]

One should be concerned with being ready otherwise you will not be received at the first rapture. But we should also know the time when Jesus returns as well, for the Bible tells us so. The Bible would not tell us so not to be known or to benefit us.

"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Rev. 3.3).

Here we read if you are not watchful for when Jesus returns, He will come like a thief and you will not know when He returns; you won't be raptured beforehand.

Jesus says He wants you to know when He returns. Why shun His words?

We do have control over who is raptured before the Tribulation, for if we are not ready, we won't be raptured before the Tribulation. Why is it important to have the correct view and timing of rapture? Because to harbor a false view is symptomatic of something wrong with your heart. I find it hard to believe God tells us the timing then we should be blessed if we get it wrong? Where the does the Bible reward heresy or false teaching?

If you falsely teach anything, whether it be the rapture or the gospel, do you think God should bless you or punish you? Wouldn't it make more sense the reason you teach something false is because your heart is not right before God?

 

Let's take a real life example. Let's say you believe the first rapture is not according to readiness, thus violating Matt. 24.40-42, Luke 21.36 and Rev. 3.10 "before the throne" (7.9) before the 1st trumpet (8.7). Therefore, all else being equal you will live more carnally because you believe as an antinomian no matter what you do now it is ok, you will be raptured ahead of time anyhow.

 

It gets even worse. When you are in the Tribulation you won't realize it, because you assumed pridefully if it was the Tribulation you would have been raptured already, so like Satan you accuse the brethren day and night (Rev. 12.10) who were first raptured. Remember what I said about this being a problem symptomatic of your heart not being right before God?

 

Similarly those who believe the rapture is at the end of the Tribulation only exclude themselves from the reward of the first rapture, so they too will accuse those brethren first raptured according to readiness. These posttribbers will also not return to reign with Christ 1000 years. That's a long time to miss out.

 

It gets even worse with amillennialists because they will forever reject the Jesus who returns to reign on earth for 1000 years, so when Jesus returns not only will they not be raptured but He will war against them and they against Him with the full backing of the Roman Empire revived of religious Rome and political Rome centered on the 7 hilled city, because they consider Him to be a false Christ. Whereas the true Jesus will reign in the 3rd Temple on earth in Jerusalem for 1000 years.

 

I know this offends you, but I am here not to cater to your flesh, but tell you the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God.

 

You're assuming that there is a rapture before the false prophet wages war against the saints, call it pre-trib, pre-seven year or whatever.  If that's the case then what is it exactly that you are "watching" for?  The signs that Jesus gave us in Matthew 24 to be watching for correspond to the rise of the false prophet, the abomination of desolation, and persecution of the saints.  What signs are pre-tribbers to be watching for?  It can't be these signs because....chronology.

 

I'd also be interested in hearing what qualifies someone to be ready for a pre-trib rapture since according to you (see red bold above) a certain level of readiness is required.  If you could, would you also quantify your answer as much as possible?  That would help.

 

 

I know this offends you, but I am here not to cater to your flesh, but tell you the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God.

 

 

I'm not sure if this was directed at me or not but rest assured that I'm not offended.  Your post is mostly baseless rhetoric and I'm not manipulated by such.  That you assume someone would be speaks more to your level of maturity.  Perhaps some more time in Arabia is warranted?

 

BTW, there is no revived political / religious Roman empire, but that's a different topic.

[OakWood]

One should be concerned with being ready otherwise you will not be received at the first rapture. But we should also know the time when Jesus returns as well, for the Bible tells us so. The Bible would not tell us so not to be known or to benefit us.

"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Rev. 3.3).

Here we read if you are not watchful for when Jesus returns, He will come like a thief and you will not know when He returns; you won't be raptured beforehand.

Jesus says He wants you to know when He returns. Why shun His words?

We do have control over who is raptured before the Tribulation, for if we are not ready, we won't be raptured before the Tribulation. Why is it important to have the correct view and timing of rapture? Because to harbor a false view is symptomatic of something wrong with your heart. I find it hard to believe God tells us the timing then we should be blessed if we get it wrong? Where the does the Bible reward heresy or false teaching?

If you falsely teach anything, whether it be the rapture or the gospel, do you think God should bless you or punish you? Wouldn't it make more sense the reason you teach something false is because your heart is not right before God?

 

Let's take a real life example. Let's say you believe the first rapture is not according to readiness, thus violating Matt. 24.40-42, Luke 21.36 and Rev. 3.10 "before the throne" (7.9) before the 1st trumpet (8.7). Therefore, all else being equal you will live more carnally because you believe as an antinomian no matter what you do now it is ok, you will be raptured ahead of time anyhow.

 

It gets even worse. When you are in the Tribulation you won't realize it, because you assumed pridefully if it was the Tribulation you would have been raptured already, so like Satan you accuse the brethren day and night (Rev. 12.10) who were first raptured. Remember what I said about this being a problem symptomatic of your heart not being right before God?

 

Similarly those who believe the rapture is at the end of the Tribulation only exclude themselves from the reward of the first rapture, so they too will accuse those brethren first raptured according to readiness. These posttribbers will also not return to reign with Christ 1000 years. That's a long time to miss out.

 

It gets even worse with amillennialists because they will forever reject the Jesus who returns to reign on earth for 1000 years, so when Jesus returns not only will they not be raptured but He will war against them and they against Him with the full backing of the Roman Empire revived of religious Rome and political Rome centered on the 7 hilled city, because they consider Him to be a false Christ. Whereas the true Jesus will reign in the 3rd Temple on earth in Jerusalem for 1000 years.

 

I know this offends you, but I am here not to cater to your flesh, but tell you the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God.

 

You're making wild assumptions here.

I'm done with pre-tribbers who accuse post-tribbers of being false Christians and I'm done with post-tribbers who accuse pre-tribbers of being false Christians.

 

You also haven't a clue what is meant by 'false teaching'. A false teacher is somebody who deliberately twists scripture away from its true meaning. A false teacher is not somebody who makes a mistake when interpreting it. Anybody can make a mistake. If you believe that a false teacher is somebody who gets it wrong then you'd better be sure for your own sake that your interpretation is correct!

As for your Rome theory - I not sure that I agree with you. It's just one theory among many.

[finestofthewheat]

Where does God's Word promise a rapture before the tribulation? We must not be watching the same thing(s).

rollinTHUNDER,

 

If "thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world, to try them that dwell upon the earth" (Rev. 3.10).

 

God doesn't promise no death to believers in the Tribulation, for there will be many spiritual Christians who will be and have been martyred.

 

What God does promise is if you are ready, you keep the word of His patience, are prayerful, watchful and keep the conduct of Matt. 5-7, He will rapture you before the Tribulation, the hour of trial, that is to come upon the whole world. It is like a balloon to be released. If you are tied down to the world, you won't be released. You're not ready yet to be received. Thus, you'll have to wait.

 

If this is too distasteful for you, then you have automatically excluded yourself from this blessing and reward, and so you will not be taken, but left to pass through the time of testing. If you are a Christian you will be raptured at the start of the 7th trumpet near the end of the Tribulation instead of before the 1st trumpet (8.7) "before the throne" (7.9) in 3rd heaven. 1000 years is a long time to have to wait after overcomers (5 wise virgins) reign with Christ over the nations 1000 years.

 

Praise the Lord for this discernment!

 

My best advice since you don't want to accept partial rapture and need to be ready to be received is that when you (being a posttribber or pretribber onlyist) are in the Tribulation don't be like that great false accuser (Rom. 12.10) accusing the saints day and night who were first raptured according to readiness. Assuming you are a Christian, appreciate the reason you were not taken but left because you were tied down to the world, not living as a sojourner.

 

As T. Austin Sparks said, there are advanced parties and harbingers in every sphere.

 

Edited October 26, 2014 by finestofthewheat