Who is grafted into whom?

[Guest]

And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. Revelation 1:6 (KJV)

 

~

 

Romans 11:22-23 (NASB95)

²² Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

 

²³ And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

Wouldn't that make the Gentiles the natural branches?

 

 

What~!

 

On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, “To your offspring I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates, Genesis 15:17 (ESV)

 

Now I Should Be Jealous?

 

The LORD said to Aaron, "You will have no inheritance in their land, nor will you have any share among them; I am your share and your inheritance among the Israelites. Numbers 18:20 (NIV)

[Marilyn C]

No, I lept ahead  to the conclusion of the points being made.

Hi JohnDB,

 

Can you spell those out for me please?

 

Marilyn.

[Ezra]

The Church grafted into Israel?

Israel grafted into the Church?

Not sure how my response simply disappeared from this thread.  Probably part of the database issues.

 

Anyhow, as mentioned before the Church (Jew & Gentile in one Body) was a mystery hidden from Israel and only revealed after Pentecost.  Believing Israel is the "good olive tree" and believing Gentiles are "the wild olive tree". 

 

The Church began with saved Jews on the day of Pentecost, therefore the Gentiles were grafted into the existing Church beginning with Cornelius and his household.  The primary lesson is that Gentiles should not be highminded, but the secondary lesson is that Jews should not be highminded also.  Everything pertaining to salvation is purely because of God's grace.

[Littlelambseativy]

Jesus is the vine, Israel was the branches but were cut off in their disbelief, we the Christians were grafted in and when we are removed in the rapture, Israel will accept Jesus as Messiah and be grafted back into the vine they were always intended to be.

[Ezra]

Jesus is the vine, Israel was the branches but were cut off in their disbelief, we the Christians were grafted in and when we are removed in the rapture, Israel will accept Jesus as Messiah and be grafted back into the vine they were always intended to be.

There is a big difference between a vine and an olive tree. The branches of the vine are "natural" un-grafted branches (the Body of Christ), whereas believing Gentiles (the wild olive tree) are "grafted into" believing Israel (the good olive tree).

[Littlelambseativy]

I beg to differ. The branches that were cut off the olive tree are unbelieving Israel. When they accept Jesus they are grafted back into the olive tree. .

[Guest]

The Church grafted into Israel?

Israel grafted into the Church?

Not sure how my response simply disappeared from this thread.  Probably part of the database issues.

 

Anyhow, as mentioned before the Church (Jew & Gentile in one Body) was a mystery hidden from Israel and only revealed after Pentecost.  Believing Israel is the "good olive tree" and believing Gentiles are "the wild olive tree".

 

 

To be more exact the olive tree is the kingdom of Christ. Believing Isrealites are the natural branches, and believing Gentiles are the wild branches graffed in.

The kingdom of Christ is not the nation of Israel. But distinct from it as this verse shows.

Ac 1:6  When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

 

Edited November 5, 2015 by Joline

[Willa]

Isaiah 11:10  And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, Who shall stand as a banner to the people;  for the Gentiles shall seek Him, and His resting place shall be glorious.  NKJV  

I see the root as being Jesse/David, or the Judaic linage of Christ, the promised root..  We have been grafted into Christ as adopted children of God.  Jewish peoples are the natural heirs by birth, but by adoption we are--will be-- made one in the Holy  Spirit.    Those natural branches that have been broken off due to unbelief may be grafted in again by faith as we have been grafted in by faith.  Romans 11:16-32   So as individuals we all must be grafted into Christ by faith.  

So I see the question as who is grafted into Whom?  Jews and Gentiles are grafted into Jesus the Messiah by faith.   It is not so much Jews or gentiles into Israel or the church,, but it is about people being grafted into God.  We all become one family.  But the Jews were promised the land  through Abraham.  We only inherit by virtue of the fact that we are in Christ, and He is the heir of all things.  Children of Israel have a special place as they are children by linage as well as all Jews will someday be saved by faith.   V. 26  And so all Israel will be saved,--- v.. 28 concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.

Jesus will reign over Israel.  Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

Sorry if that gets confusing.  I tried.  And I may wrong.  

 

 

[Guest shiloh357]

JohnD

What is grafted into what?

 

The Church grafted into Israel?

 

Israel grafted into the Church?

 

Wouldn't that make the Gentiles the natural branches?

 

My view on this is this has nothing to do the church and Israel but that of Northern Israel and Southern Israel being grafted back into one Israel.

According to Jeremiah 11:16-17, this olive tree represented the House of Israel and the House of Judah. It was God who "planted" this olive tree and pronounced evil against it because this "olive tree" had done evil in provoking God to anger. As a result, according to Paul, some of the branches were broken off and became wild olives and that is is exactly what happened to Northern Israel.  

Romans 11:16-28 is all about the reunion of the House of Israel and the House of Judah

 

 

 

No, Paul is speaking to the Roman Gentile Christians and about their being grafted into Christ.  God doesn't graft people into people.  That is nonsense.  Paul is addressing Gentiles, not northern Israelites, in Romans 11.

[Guest shiloh357]

The Church grafted into Israel?

Israel grafted into the Church?

Not sure how my response simply disappeared from this thread.  Probably part of the database issues.

 

Anyhow, as mentioned before the Church (Jew & Gentile in one Body) was a mystery hidden from Israel and only revealed after Pentecost.  Believing Israel is the "good olive tree" and believing Gentiles are "the wild olive tree". 

 

The Church began with saved Jews on the day of Pentecost, therefore the Gentiles were grafted into the existing Church beginning with Cornelius and his household.  The primary lesson is that Gentiles should not be highminded, but the secondary lesson is that Jews should not be highminded also.  Everything pertaining to salvation is purely because of God's grace.

No the church did not begin on Pentecost

Heb: 2;12

Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.

Heb shows that Jesus was united with his church; that he was one of them; and that he mingled with them as among brethren. 

 

Church DID begin at Pentecost.   Jesus in Matthew said, "upon this rock, I will build my Church.   If the Church was already present, then he would not have spoken of it as something future to Him and the disciples at that time.