The_Patriot21 Posted June 13, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 27 Topic Count: 338 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 15,715 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 8,535 Days Won: 39 Joined: 10/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/27/1985 Share Posted June 13, 2015 It is irrelevant if he was representing his employer, they still have the right to protect their brand. As I stated above, freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences, it just isn't. He is free to say what he wants, he can say it again tomorrow, nobody has taken that from him. When you provide the story of his firing being overturned by a court of law I will be glad to admit I am wrong, till such time I am 100% correct. not necessarily. a public school, is supposed to teach kids not only their ABCs, but about their country and the rights therein. So if they fire someone for using their free speech, they are being hypocrits, and since they are a government run instition, the government has no right to limit free speech. In the end, im going to have to side with shiloh on this. had it been a private instition, it would be a different manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncertain Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 239 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 226 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/20/1959 Share Posted June 14, 2015 The school board is actually doing the children a service by teaching them early that freedom of speech does not automatically grant freedom from consequences. This man has all the same rights he had a week ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.09 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 14, 2015  It is irrelevant if he was representing his employer, they still have the right to protect their brand. As I stated above, freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences, it just isn't. He is free to say what he wants, he can say it again tomorrow, nobody has taken that from him. When you provide the story of his firing being overturned by a court of law I will be glad to admit I am wrong, till such time I am 100% correct. not necessarily. a public school, is supposed to teach kids not only their ABCs, but about their country and the rights therein. So if they fire someone for using their free speech, they are being hypocrits, and since they are a government run instition, the government has no right to limit free speech. In the end, im going to have to side with shiloh on this. had it been a private instition, it would be a different manner.   The difference occurs when you WORK for that state government run institution. An employer CAN require certain things regarding public speech, regardless of who the employer is. I am surprised that the teacher's union didn't fight this though; they are usually pretty tough on protecting their members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 It makes all the difference in the world if he was representing his company.  Protecting their brand???   This is someone who worked for insurance company or something.  He was speaking as a free American citizen. If he had made a racial slur or called for harm to come to someone, or committed slander, then I could see action taken against him.  But him speaking his mind in defense of the cop did not in any way reflect on the school or his employer.  If someone publically tweeted or facebooked their choice for a presidential candidate, they cannot be legally fired for that by their employer because his statement in no way threatens a "brand."  Sorry, but this guys rights were violated.    If you punish free speech, it is not free speech.  The whole idea behind being free is that you dont' suffer negative consequences for exercising it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted June 14, 2015 Yeah, except that his comments were not made in representation of his company.  He was not speaking as a principal, but as a free American citizen.  And even if his boss didn't like his statement, freedom of speech is promised to all Americans and no one, not me, not you, no one has the right to punish someone for speaking their mind on current events.  Sorry, uncertain... but you're wrong on this one.  As far as legalities I would agree, but free speech has to do with the law and not what someone who has hired you to represent them in public.  I spent nearly 40 years with Xerox and it was agreed upon that we were responsible for what we did and said 24/7 and in public we had to present ourselves in positive ways and could be held accountable for whatever we did or said that looked bad on our company......, and at least here where I live it's expected up front from our educators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncertain Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 239 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 226 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/20/1959 Share Posted June 14, 2015 This is why the school board is doing a good service for the children, helping them to not become grown adults that fail to understand what the freedom of speech means. You also undermine your argument when you give examples of when it is acceptable for their to be consequences attached to free speech. What this comes down to is you not agreeing with why they did it, not that it was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Yes, I can see that to some degree, but Zerox didn't own you, and you are not representing the company 24 hours a day.  No company can force that on you. You have a right to represent your political views as a free American on your own time representing your views as only your views.  No company can fire you for that legally.   You have the right to voice your views so long as it falls under protected speech.  If you called for someone's death or slandered a rival company or went out and did something lurid in public, that would probably be different, especially if you were recognized as an employee of that company.   All this principal did was voice his own personal opinion and he was on his own private facebook account and it was on his time. He was not speaking for the school or anyone else. He represented his own views.    The problem is that we have an intolerant liberal left that calls for everyone to get fired who disagrees with them.  The left wants to shut down freedom and scrap the constitution and punish anyone who says something that they don't like.   This principal was fired to appease the left, not because what he said was harmful to the government that he worked for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 No Uncertain,  that is completely nonsense. You clearly don't understand the concept of free speech.  Free speech means that you can speak your mind (within reason) without fear of reprisal.  It really is that simple.  Free speech doesn't mean, "We will let you say it, but we will punish you if you say it."  I did not give example of consequences attached to free speech. I gave examples of what is not considered free speech. Slander is not free speech. Threatening harm is not free speech. Racial slurs are not free speech.  You don't know what you're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncertain Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 239 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 226 Days Won: 2 Joined: 06/02/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/20/1959 Share Posted June 14, 2015 You have a child like view of free speech, there really is no other way to describe it. Feel free to provide the court cases overturning actions such as this. Until such time I am correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OakWood Posted June 14, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 867 Topics Per Day: 0.23 Content Count: 7,331 Content Per Day: 1.99 Reputation: 2,860 Days Won: 31 Joined: 04/09/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1964 Share Posted June 14, 2015 You have a child like view of free speech, there really is no other way to describe it. Feel free to provide the court cases overturning actions such as this. Until such time I am correct. Â I have to agree with Shiloh on this one. I'm sorry to say this but it is you that has a child like view of free speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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