SINNERSAVED Posted November 25, 2015 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 6 Topic Count: 150 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,195 Content Per Day: 0.68 Reputation: 2,409 Days Won: 14 Joined: 07/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 25, 2015 HERE IS A QUESTION ? And IT IS ,IN THE TEXTED OF DID WE CHOOSE TO FOLLOW ,AND STUMBLE ON GOD, one day,BY A SITUATION, OR BY CHANCE OR BY SEEKING FOR HIM OUT OF THE BLUE ? OR DID HE CHOOSE US FROM THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH PRIOR TO US COMING TO HIM AS BELIEVERS ? IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT GOD ALREADY KNEW WHO WAS TO FOLLOW HIM AND WE JUST HAPPEN TO GET THERE? IS THE HOLY SPIRIT SEARCHING OUR BEINGS FROM THE INSIDE OUT TO KNOW WHO WILL COME TO GOD AND REPENT? its like what came first the egg or the chicken? have we always been about god through our spirit , and it was just a matter of time to abide and fully surrender to him, ? sorry about the caps, I am not yelling I just love caps, its a habit I am working on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OakWood Posted November 25, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 867 Topics Per Day: 0.24 Content Count: 7,331 Content Per Day: 1.99 Reputation: 2,860 Days Won: 31 Joined: 04/09/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1964 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I don't know that answer to this question. I've thought about it many times. God gave us free will, so we choose him I guess. However many would disagree with me.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Patriot21 Posted November 25, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 27 Topic Count: 338 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 15,714 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 8,535 Days Won: 39 Joined: 10/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/27/1985 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Hmmmm Calvin vs Armenian. Again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted November 25, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,373 Content Per Day: 7.99 Reputation: 21,555 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Yes there are many threads! God chose before creation He began yes. God first consideration was foreknowledge (undefined in Scripture). God throughout the Word requires men to choose. No one has put forth the absolute truth to any of this and all have discrepancies within the reasoning's... I believe because it, (salvation), is the center piece of all creation- thus it is firmly fixed within the very Heart of Our Lord and that is defined as exceeding us in all forms and fashions as we are here now! Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I believe Scripture teaches that the choice is ours to make, although GOD knew in advance how we would choose. HE put HIS salvation plan in the stars and in everyone's heart. Then HE gave us the power to choose for ourselves. Few have chosen the narrow path; most have chosen to go their own way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmbld Posted November 25, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,491 Content Per Day: 0.54 Reputation: 1,457 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/23/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/02/1971 Share Posted November 25, 2015 No one seeks God on his own, Psalm 14:2-3 The Lord looks down from heaven on the children of man, to see if there are any who understand,[a] who seek after God. 3 They have all turned aside; together they have become corrupt; there is none who does good, not even one. But God calls us, John 6:44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day." And I believe He calls everyone regardless of their IQ. Romans 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, nhave been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world,7 in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. And I see a pattern in the bible of God seeking us out, even longing for us to come to Him, starting with the first two people, Genesis 3:9 But the LORD God called to the man, "Where are you?" As if anyone could hide from God! We may reject Him, but we are called. We may try to rely on emotions and lie to ourselves, saying that God did not choose me, yet that is incorrect. God did choose you, and everyone else, our responsibility is to respond, the mystery of free will is that we can respond either way, yet God desires us all to come. If anything could be hard for God, in my limited human knowledge I would think granting free will to people would be a hard decision to make. Because of free will I hear people blaming God, accusing Him even of sending people to hell. This free will, it is a mystery to me, for we can decide to choose God or not, yet even with free will we are dependent on Him drawing us, revealing Himself to us, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted November 26, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,878 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,769 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 26, 2015 7 hours ago, SINNERSAVED said: HERE IS A QUESTION ? And IT IS ,IN THE TEXTED OF DID WE CHOOSE TO FOLLOW ,AND STUMBLE ON GOD, one day,BY A SITUATION, OR BY CHANCE OR BY SEEKING FOR HIM OUT OF THE BLUE ? OR DID HE CHOOSE US FROM THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH PRIOR TO US COMING TO HIM AS BELIEVERS ? IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT GOD ALREADY KNEW WHO WAS TO FOLLOW HIM AND WE JUST HAPPEN TO GET THERE? IS THE HOLY SPIRIT SEARCHING OUR BEINGS FROM THE INSIDE OUT TO KNOW WHO WILL COME TO GOD AND REPENT? its like what came first the egg or the chicken? have we always been about god through our spirit , and it was just a matter of time to abide and fully surrender to him, ? sorry about the caps, I am not yelling I just love caps, its a habit I am working on. There are some people not all, that God is bringing forth and they have a very specific role to play in his plan, Abraham, Issac, Jacob, jojeph, Moses, David, Samuel,and many others even from the Gentiles, that interacted with, and Jonh the Baptist, and Mother Mary, Peter, and so on. But he did not deprived them from their lives, they also leaved their lives, I think but one, Jonh the Baptist. God new that only through his Christ man can be resuracted from the dead and be one with him. There is no any other way, it is not possible. God new from the very begining, this was the only way, and he also new how it is going to happen. (the seed of the woman), He new that every one will hear the Gospel and be given the change to believe, no matter when they were born. That's why Jesus died for all,or there is only one way to the Father. God he also new that no every one will believe. Man decides for his own fate, there deferent forces that play a role in someones decision, but it is a fair and equal opportunity for everyone. The same intervasion of God to cause faith in someone,, can also cause unbelieve in someone else. God puts the good seed to lead to faith, and another one comes at a secret time and he puts another seed that will lead to unbelieve. The one comes and puts a seed of unbelieve, then God comes and he puts a seed to believe. Something happens, and causes people to come closer to God, and the same even causes people to go away from God. All forces work in all posible ways to persuade man, he is spiritual and phycical, and they work in both realms to persuade man. The Holy Spirit because of Jesus is working to help people to choose the way of Christ, and also we. We are the Holy Spirits helpers, when we put the seed in people about Jesus Christ, and at the same time the Holy Spirit is our guide and our helper, The Holy Spirit knows the enemy all the time, we need the help of the Holy Spirit who works with people when we are sleeping, or we are busy with something else. That's how i understand these matter today, tomorrow in the future it remains a mystery. Who can tell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegaman 3.0 Posted November 26, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 57 Topic Count: 1,546 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 10,320 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 12,323 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/15/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/05/1951 Share Posted November 26, 2015 It seems this questions has been wrestled with over the centuries without any one position being able to win over an other, I feel certain it won't be settled here on Worthy. I will however make a statement of the position (in very little detail) that I have come to accepts as being most in line with what srritures says, without reading into is what "seems right". God chose those who would be His, from before the foundation of the world, plenty of passages say that. I am unaware of any passage that state in any clear terms, any basis upon which He made the chose, other than to say for His own good choice and purposes, His sovereign will. People are enemies of God, by nature, and no one seeks God (apart from His intervention). People are spiritually dead, blind, deaf, havvehardened hearts etc. God intervenes and opens eyes, allows some people to hear, gives them a heart of flesh - in other words people are spiritually dead and He grants some life - it is His work, not ours, and acto f grace alone, not works, lest anyone should boast. Do we have free will? Yes and no, dependa on how you look at it, and how you define it. God does know, what will happen, everything He foresees, comes to pass. If that is true, then He foresees that in advance of our existance, and it will happen exactly as He foresees it, it that sense, it is hard to argue for free will ultimatly. Additionally, everthing that exist, acts act wthin the limitations of it's own nature, this is true even of God Himself. In our sinful nature, we are not able to chose God, this is why He gives a new nature - we often refer that being born again. How does this work practically? Suppose we have a lion, and a horse, and we place in front of the lion, a plate of straw, and in front of the horse, I nice plate of raw meat. Could the lion eat the straw and could the horse eat the meat? Of course they could, they can move their heads in the right direction, grasp the food in front of them, chew it and swallow it. However it is not in the nature of the lion to want straw, nor the horse to desire meat. They have free will to do whichever they like, but because of their natures, they will ot choose the food placed in front of them in the above scenario. So it is with people our nature does not seek God, becuase our nature is oriented toward going out own way. If we were to be given a new nature, one that seeks the true God, one that desires to serve Him above all else, then we will make that choice. This is where we have both free will, but, are subject to Gods soveriegn act of freeing us from the bondage of out old nature. We love Him because He forst loved us. That is what I think I see, painted out as our situation in the scripture. Yes we choose, for some at least, He chose us to choose. Why? no idea. The amazing thing is that he chose any of us, none of us deserves it. Thank you Father for choosing me, thank you Spirit, for drawing me. Thank you Jesus for paying my way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted November 26, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,993 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,691 Content Per Day: 11.76 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted November 26, 2015 6 hours ago, Rick_Parker said: I believe Scripture teaches that the choice is ours to make, although GOD knew in advance how we would choose. HE put HIS salvation plan in the stars and in everyone's heart. Then HE gave us the power to choose for ourselves. Few have chosen the narrow path; most have chosen to go their own way. I agree with you on this Rick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted November 26, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.34 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted November 26, 2015 6 hours ago, Rick_Parker said: I believe Scripture teaches that the choice is ours to make, although GOD knew in advance how we would choose. HE put HIS salvation plan in the stars and in everyone's heart. Then HE gave us the power to choose for ourselves. Few have chosen the narrow path; most have chosen to go their own way. This is essentially what Scripture reveals. The Bible also reveals that if all would repent and believe, all would be saved, since the invitation is to "whosoever will" (Rev 22:17): And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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