FINDING COMMON GROUND IN DANIEL

[Serving]

On Sunday, 10 January 2016 at 10:33 PM, Last Daze said:

Do you see the U.N. as the feet of iron and clay, the kingdom out of which the ten horns rise?

• As for the ten horns, out of this kingdom ten kings will arise; and another will arise after them, and he will be different from the previous ones and will subdue three kings.  Daniel 7:24

Or do they rise from within the constraints of the geography of a former kingdom, or something else?

I see the divided kingdom, which Daniel identified as the feet and toes, representing a period of time where those kings (nations) who were once part of the Roman Empire are operating just like any other nation in the world at the moment.

I see the U.N as just another vehicle like NATO for example for furthering particular ends that certain 'powers that be' have sneakily brought about to further their diabolical cause .. meaning that the UN itself is just a 'whipping boy' used to bring everybody into line under a false banner of oneness but is nothing more than a front to keep the 'serfs' in the dark to the real movers & shakers who are behind the scenes .. that is, I see the UN as a mere tool of convenience, one with a false 'democratic face', as it were to keep up the illusion of 'freedom',  but firmly under control of the true puppet masters and not the other way round.

I don't think geography any longer plays a dominant role (but is still present to a degree as in some founders from the Iron kingdom must needs be present) but instead see the 'seed' as the focus .. and the 'seed' is the SYSTEM which binds them all .. the same Greco Roman SYSTEM which dominates the western world today (whose western heritage is still today considered 'of the Roman').

Example ..  'western LAW' .. go to court and you'd soon realize that all the language and concepts are FRAMED in the Latin (Roman) come documentation time .. science still categorizes under the Latin too, so does the medical establishment and on it goes etc etc .. that same 'seed' or SYSTEM is the key .. the Iron beast system (Roman) that has Brass claws (Greco heritage too) .. that system or heritage, Greco-Roman sourced.

Look at the 10 kings as representing the 'senate' and the false prophet as Caesar presiding over the senate.

And that system will dominate the 10 .. so even some Muslim nations could be part of the makeup as long as they operate within and abide by the SAME system ..    

Sorry Daze but I got company just roll up .. be back later.

[Marilyn C]

5 hours ago, WilliamL said:

Ezek. 38:15 “Then you will come from your place out of the far north, you and many peoples with you, all of them riding on horses, a great company and a mighty army." 

So you say that at the beginning of the Tribulation, Russia will equip its whole army with horses? Seriously? Can you provide a whit of evidence for this?

Hi WilliamL.

God`s word says that it is the `company` with Russia that will have the `horses.`  `many peoples with you, all of them riding horses,...` (Ez. 38: 15) There are many member states in the CIS (Commonwealth of Independent States) that use horses & are breeding them up. 

Marilyn.

[Marilyn C]

2 hours ago, Serving said:

Hi M,

The thing is this, that 3rd beast's kingdom got divided between 4 generals and soon thereafter was no longer one kingdom anymore but 4 SEPERATE kingdoms warring amongst each other for supremacy before the Greco Roman Empire eventually started taking shape which lead to the eventual emergence of the Roman Empire itself.

Those 4 shared the same body (Leopard) because it is from the same body from whence they emerged, the Leopard itself (Greco Empire) being their shared lineage .. yes they were of the same body, but importantly, they all turned against each other effectively ending that once mighty Greco Empire, that is, their division in effect slayed that mighty Leopard so it was a Leopard no more but 4 separate & opposing beasts.

As for the seven heads, John did say that one 'is' .. meaning to me, that 'one' horn was already active in John's day.

Even though I disagree, it is still an interesting thing you have said nevertheless.

Hi Serving,

The 3rd beast of Daniel ch. 7 is a contemporary super power. It is trodden down by the 4th beast but will have its life extended into the Millennium.

`But as for the rest of the beasts ( 1, Lion/Eagle  2, Bear 3, Leopard) they had their dominion taken away, yet their lives were prolonged for a season & a time.` (Dan. 7: 12)

The 3rd super power, the Leopard, is contemporary, & started with 4 `heads,` 4 leaders that shared power.

My advice to you dear bro, is to not lock God`s word into the distant past or the future yet to come. God is very vocal about what is happening now, I believe.

 

Marilyn. 

Edited January 14, 2016 by Marilyn C

[Marilyn C]

Hi Serving,

I will also add that it is the Holy Spirit who is writing the book of Revelation(as well as the whole Bible). So the one `is` has nothing to do with John`s time. It is the time that the Holy Spirit is telling about in there.

`They are 7 kings (leaders). 5 have fallen (gone), one is, & the other has not yet come.....And the 10 horns  ...have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour (short time) as kings with the beast.` (Rev. 17: 10 - 12)

5 leaders of the Global Government will have come & gone (consecutively) & one is (ruling) before the 10 kings of the last super power receive authority with the A/C. The A/C is the 7th consecutive ruler over the Global Government. We need to realise that `all of a sudden one day a global government is not just going to pop up with the A/C ruling it.` The Global Government is already here with a ruler taking it in turns every year.

Thus, obviously we are counting....1,...2...3....4...5...>

Marilyn.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Marilyn C

[n2thelight]

Daniel 7:16 "I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things."

Here now is the interpretation God revealed to Daniel.

Daniel 7:17 "These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth."

These four kings that arise do not come out of heaven or hell, but everyday life and living upon the earth. What is going to happen is going on right before our eyes, and we see it on television, read it in the papers, and know it as it happens. God is telling Daniel it will be much later, for we know it occurs in our day.

Daniel 7:18 "But the saints [set aside ones] of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever."

The saints are God's servants who placed the armor of God of Ephesians 6:10-21 on themselves, and they are prepared for Satan's arrival. They know what to expect, and how to combat Satan, when he as the Antichrist comes against them. The saints shall fight against the little horn; and, my friend in Christ, that will be a spiritual battle, a war of words, ideas, deceptions. It will be a war of the mind through false doctrine.

That is why we must have the seal the truth of God in our minds. For either the seal, or knowledge of God's Word will be there, or "the mark of the beast" will be there. That mark is the mark of confusion that God will allow you to have, to follow Satan and do his work, while all the time you think he is Jesus Christ. It will be the Antichrist seeking to have you fly with him, and you will for you will do it in ignorance, for your looking for a rapture that will not come.

Daniel 7:19 "Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;"

This beast will be diverse, and that is why it is called non-descript. It is a system, not an entity like Nebuchadnezzar's empire. The churches' "teeth of iron" (lies and deceptions), and the "nails of brass" (traditions and methods of control) will, and are now, forcing its members and followers to believe traditions, to accept false ideas (such as sodomy and pagan practices), and neglect the truths Jesus Christ said to know.

The reason most churches don't teach chapter by chapter and verse by verse is that the method would disprove many of their own traditions.

Daniel 7:20 "And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows."

The horn that fell is the little horn. This is the identification and description of the Antichrist.

Daniel 7:21 "I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;"

The Antichrist caused most of the saints of God (Christians) to fall. For we know only the elect of God who had prepared themselves, did not. Satan is the false Jesus.

Daniel 7:22 "Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom."

This happens at the last trump. The "Ancient of days" that will come is Jesus Christ. That is the end of this earth age, whereby mankind is born of woman. Those saints that have held to the faith, and not followed Antichrist, are the winners, and will jointly rule the kingdom through the millennium with Christ.

These events here are not simply salvation, but learning, knowing, and living in the meat of God's word.

Daniel 7:23 "Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces."

You can see this one world system now forming, with the false messiah will rule at its head. That's all it amounts to. The political system, or beast will receive a mortal wound, and end it's world rule for a very brief time, as we read in Revelation 13.

Revelation 13:3 "And I saw one of the heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast."

Remember that this beast is as a one world system, and in the beginning, this system takes a political form. We know the form today as the United Nations, with it's ten major agencies, which have the entire world under its ruling charter of international laws, treaties, and trade agreements. However, when the world wakes up to see the strength of this Godless beast, the political form will end. When a political beast is dead, it simply does not function as a government any more. This will set the stage for the coming of the Antichrist, Satan, and his arrival to earth.

Why will it be diverse of all kingdoms? Because it's going to be religious, with one ruler. Just listen to most newscasts and much of it deals strictly with affairs of it. It is seeking total control of the entire earth. What the United Nations does, it does only to promote its own agenda. As genocide went on in Cambodia, Bosnia, and elsewhere, the United Nations looked the other way. Kurds were being gassed in Iraq, and entire cities eliminated, and the United Nations' blinders were on. However, years later, after the fact, the United Nations used what it so blatantly overlooked, as the slaughter took place, as the excuse to move against Iraq when it took Kuwait and their oil.

The United Nations is still growing and moving to world wide control through its many agencies. We know, though, that the time of "breaking down" and "breaking it to pieces" has not yet come. This is future. However, it is a very close future. We may be talking about months instead of years.

Daniel 7:24 "And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings."

What were those ten horns? The same as the "ten toes" of the image in Chapter 2. These ten horns are ten kings.

Who is this that rises after the ten kings? We saw in Revelation that this beast (ten king system) rose from the sea. That sea is the peoples of the world. They are men, or ruling agencies by men. The description in Revelation 13 of the seven that were, and one yet to come is simply Satan's title.

Now in Daniel 7:24, the one that shall rise is also Satan. My Christian friend, the fourth kingdom of Daniel 7 is the same "one world system" of the ten kings of Revelation 13. And the one that shall rise after them is Satan, and his role as the Antichrist.

Daniel 7:25"And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time."

The three kings that are subdues out of the ten kingdoms, I feel, are the three nations representing Ephraim and Manasseh: the United States, Canada, and Great Britain. Though we talk about three kingdoms, it is still a "one world system", the "wearing out of the saints" is to afflict or deceive the saints. We see today how sodomites, and every other perverted organization, are out to change times (meaning seasons) and laws. The laws today are so twisted and worked over that murdered go free and jaywalkers get time in jail. Good is bad, right is wrong, and the absolute laws of God are diluted to mean little more than vague definitions.

The Heavenly Father states here He will allow it for three and one-half years. Jesus says that time will be shortened, and Revelations 9:5 makes it five months.

Revelation 9:5 "And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man."

If you do not know the truth before the Antichrist comes, it's too late. It's like the seal of the thunders. The thunder follows the lightening, thus when Satan comes (the lightening) the seal of understanding and being prepared is too late. Upon Satan's [the Antichrist's] arrival, you will be stung as the scorpion and rendered helpless.

Daniel 7:26 "But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end."

When is the end? At Christ's return. We will have victory then, and this earth age will be over

 

http://www.theseason.org/daniel/daniel7.htm

[Last Daze]

On ‎1‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 4:40 PM, MorningGlory said:

I have only one comment....Please stop referring to the Book of Revelation as 'Revelations'.  Its quite jarring to me.  Thanks.

That used to bug me too.  Technically, it is a series of revelations within the revelation; kind of like the Bible is a book of books.  I've come to accept the terms as synonyms.

[Serving]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Serving,

The 3rd beast of Daniel ch. 7 is a contemporary super power. It is trodden down by the 4th beast but will have its life extended into the Millennium.

`But as for the rest of the beasts ( 1, Lion/Eagle  2, Bear 3, Leopard) they had their dominion taken away, yet their lives were prolonged for a season & a time.` (Dan. 7: 12)

The 3rd super power, the Leopard, is contemporary, & started with 4 `heads,` 4 leaders that shared power.

My advice to you dear bro, is to not lock God`s word into the distant past or the future yet to come. God is very vocal about what is happening now, I believe.

 

Marilyn.

Hi M,

I have never read that the Leopard was ever trodden down by the 4th beast, in fact the 4th beast has a common history with the 3rd beast as ALLIES (Greco-Roman Empire) .. furthermore, Daniel also adds further insight into the makeup of this 4th beast, and shows that instead of hostility, a common historic link between the 3rd & 4th beasts actually exists .. even well into the last days .. for :

Daniel 7:19  19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet; 

Knowing that the bible is her own translator, I don't need to work very hard on the actual link between the two (iron & brass) nationally speaking, but only the meaning of that link.

For example, the terminologies of the metals is already defined for us in king Nebs dream statue so we do not have to speculate what BRASS stands for .. and Daniel reveals it is for the Greek and Iron is for Rome .. and this beast has both metals, granted the Brass is only in the nails, but present nevertheless ..  so a common link between the two is definitely established here.

So rather than the 3rd beast having been trodden by the 4th, we instead see a common relationship between the two beasts .. just as history also attests .. the Greco-Roman Empire backing my point strongly .. and that was one of alliance and not hostility.

Also, if I mention things as future prophecy, it NEVER means that I discount the NOW from where applicable, because it's takes the now to frame tomorrow in most cases .. I have no argument with you as to the coming global order being framed all around us, in fact I have been watching it for over 26 years now, long before we had internet or when everybody else jumped on board the 'conspiracy train' when it became 'trendy' for a while online (I used to buy Nexus magazines and that type of thing all the time for this kind of news) .. LOL .. even in my twenties I was like a 'old soul' .. always looking out for articles about THEM .. even when I was a sinner I was drawn to these things.  

So when I see in revelation the body of a leopard, feet of a bear, mouth of a lion given to the first beast descriptive .. it speaks to me of not only the beasts attributes but of it's diverse 'makeup' too .. after all, middle east nations were also within the Roman Empire, as I expect to see reflected in the coming order too which is TODAY at work behind the scenes .. just that they have not yet received power OPENLY YET.

Thanks M.

[WilliamL]

8 hours ago, Serving said:

I don't think geography any longer plays a dominant role (but is still present to a degree as in some founders from the Iron kingdom must needs be present) but instead see the 'seed' as the focus .. and the 'seed' is the SYSTEM which binds them all .. the same Greco Roman SYSTEM which dominates the western world today (whose western heritage is still today considered 'of the Roman').

Example ..  'western LAW' .. go to court and you'd soon realize that all the language and concepts are FRAMED in the Latin (Roman) come documentation time .. science still categorizes under the Latin too, so does the medical establishment and on it goes etc etc .. that same 'seed' or SYSTEM is the key .. the Iron beast system (Roman) that has Brass claws (Greco heritage too) .. that system or heritage, Greco-Roman sourced.

Very true. Why did the Russians call their emperors czars? Why did the Germans call theirs Kaisers? Because they both saw themselves as descendants of the Roman Caesars, of course: the name from which both derive. Romanism never died, whether people choose to see it or not.

But Romanism, being the 6th head of Rev. 17, the "one is" even in John's day, will someday be replaced by the 7th head, "the other [that] has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue for a short time." 17:10 Perhaps Islamic, but that remains to be seen.

[Last Daze]

9 hours ago, Serving said:

Rev 19:19-20

19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

This is part of the reason why I see the beast as a fallen angel rather than the kingdom he spawns.  The lake of fire was created for Satan and his angels.  Another reason is that the beast comes up out of the abyss.  I don't know of any scriptures that speak of kingdoms coming out of the abyss or getting cast into the lake of fire.

[WilliamL]

8 hours ago, n2thelight said:

Daniel 7:17 "These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth."

These four kings that arise do not come out of heaven or hell, but everyday life and living upon the earth. What is going to happen is going on right before our eyes, and we see it on television, read it in the papers, and know it as it happens. God is telling Daniel it will be much later, for we know it occurs in our day.

And here is the danger of relying solely upon English translations of the Aramaic. "Shall arise" is not necessarily the correct interpretation of this Aramaic imperfect verb. In Hebrew and Aramaic, verbs are closely tied to context, which is not always evident.

There is every reason to rightly translate quwm here as "arise," without any future connotation. Imperfect verbs denote uncompleted action, whether past, present, or future. The verse literally reads, "These beasts great which they [are] four: four kings arise from/out of [the] earth."

When they arise is not directly stated by the context.