Babylon, the Harlot and the Seven Headed Beast Explained.

[Salty]

6 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

This is the BEAST cast into hell, before the 1000 years..............As is the Little Horn that is cast into the fire in Daniel. 

The "little horn" role of Dan.7, is the "beast" (king) that the ten kings rule "one hour" with per Rev.17:12. In that Rev.17:12 verse it only says the word "beast", but that's about the idea of the beast king they rule with. And that's the "little horn" of Dan.7 that comes up among the ten horns and subdues 3 horns. That is the coming Antichrist or pseudo-Christ per Matt.24:23-26 and 2 Thess.2:3-8.

Thus the "little horn" is simply another title for the role the "dragon" (Satan) will play. That role is destroyed at Christ's coming, but NOT the "dragon" which is Satan himself. And THAT... is why you don't find the "dragon" included with the beast and false prophet thrown in the lake of fire at Jesus' coming.

You still... appear to have a problem with NOT recognizing the "dragon" is included with the working of the beast and false prophet in Rev.16, while also refusing to see that the "dragon" is NOT destroyed with them at Jesus' coming per Rev.19:20.

Edited January 7, 2017 by Salty

[Salty]

6 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

This clearly indicates the DEVILS are working Miracles.......For they (3) are the SPIRITS OF DEVILS, Working Miracles.

Don't let Satan bewitch you. When that Rev.16:13 verse declares what comes out of the mouth of the "dragon", you were supposed to already catch from Rev.12:9 that title is simply another name for Satan, and then you should have remembered the following from that Rev.12 chapter too:

Rev 12:15-16
15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
KJV

Our Lord Jesus really was good to us with revealing a whole lot in Revelation if we'd only listen to Him. He made that idea of the flood that comes out of the mouth being from both the one called "the serpent" and "the dragon" which Rev.12:9 revealed are simply other titles for Satan.

What comes out of one's MOUTH anyway? Is that really... that difficult to figure out?

 

6 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Rev. 20:10, the Beast AND the False Prophet are in Hell.............Thus they are both men, thus they are both BEASTS. 

The DRAGON is a "Beast" Animal so to speak also, John couldn't call this Creature he saw a Dragon, we would think its Satan, so he just called it a Beast............The 8th King is over the Seven, BUT.........He is a SPIRITUAL BEING. 

What beast? Rev.19:20 says just the word "beast", but we know already that word can apply to a beast kingdom or a beast king. So which one is it, or is it both that go into the lake of fire at Jesus' coming?

Don't try to change God's Word on that title of the "dragon", for our Lord Jesus revealed through John it is simply another title for Satan himself.

Rev 12:9
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
KJV

Those titles apply ONLY to Satan himself. Any other idea is an attempt to add or take away from God's Holy Writ.

[Salty]

17 hours ago, HAZARD said:

Jerusalem is not Babylon. The Antichrist will set himself up to reign in Jerusalem and call himself god.

Jerusalem in Rev.11:8 is being referred to SPIRITUALLY as Sodom and Egypt, both pagan sites.

So I think you well know and understand how Christ is applying the idea of Babylon SPIRITUALLY for Jerusalem when that Antichrist comes to sit as king in Jerusalem.

[douggg]

8 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Well, he does, you just have to figure out the riddle. That's why God told Daniel to go his way, for these secrets ill be locked up until the time of the end when knowledge has increased. Jesus told his own disciples when they asked him why he spoke in parables, that it was because the children of God were given the ability to understand, but those not of God, wouldn't understand no matter what.

No, your claim that  "So if you conquer that which belongs to God (Gods People) you are a Beast" is coming from you.... not God.      And your insinuation that anyone who does not agree with you are not  a child of God - is inappropriate, to say the least.     Anyone who is saved is a child of God; not whether they agree to your self-created ideas.    

[Revelation Man]

2 hours ago, Salty said:

That's an 'assumption' from men's traditions, just because the feet of ten toes is partly made up of iron, and the old Roman empire was the legs of iron.

 

You need to really stop using that "MEN'S TRADITION" thing because everything you disagree with is MEN'S TRADITIONS. Not that it doesn't happen at times, but this seems more of a vehicle with which to silent others opinions by calling them men's traditions, and I don't do men's traditions.........I do the Holy Spirit tradition, I Hear his small still voice. You can keep using it, but I don't think anyone thinks its anything other than you saying your understandings are all right and everyone else just goes by men's traditions. 

And NO........It has nothing to do with Legs etc. or the Toes, its common sense. The Roman Empire WAS the Fourth Beast, it WAS the Kingdom that ruled over John at the time he wrote Revelation, it was THE KING in Revelation 17 that WAS ALIVE AT THE TIME John wrote Revelation......5 have Fallen, ONE IS (Rome).  Rome of course ceased being a Super Power and the Israeli people were dispersed the world over, so there could be NO BEAST until 1948.

Then we see the 10 Kings arise out of the Head of the Fourth Beast which tells us these are 10 NEW POWERS, that spring forth froom the Fourth Beasts Old Stomping Grounds......Europe. Then a Little Horn Arises amongst the 10 and those 10 Kings give their powers unto the Beast (Anti-Christ).  

2 hours ago, Salty said:

A kingdom does not have a dominion, it IS... the dominion. It is the king... that has dominion over a kingdom. That's those beasts of Dan.7:12 is referring to the ten kings that rule one hour with the beast king of Rev.17. Jesus' coming and dominion are the events shown immediately prior... to that Dan.7:12 verse, which is why those beasts' dominion over those kingdoms is taken away, but their "lives" are preserved in the pit prison during Christ's 1,000 years reign, like the Isaiah 24 Scripture shows.

NO........If there is more than ONE KING then the Beast Kingdom has Dominion. And no, the Beasts that had their Dominion taken away but lives prolonged were the Four Beasts spoken of prior to the Last Beast, the Little Horn. It speaks about the rest of the BEASTS with an S, the Kings are not BEASTS.........They give their power to the Beast (Anti-Christ).  WOW....Placed in the pot a 1000 years. Yes Satan is placed in the Pit, but that has nothing to do with Dan. 12 and the rest of the Beasts.

2 hours ago, Salty said:

Just like you folks on men's traditions confuse the 1st beast of Rev.13:1-2 with thinking it's a person when it's actually a beast kingdom, likewise you do the same there in that Dan.7:12 verse with thinking it's about kingdoms when it's actually about the kings of the earth that rule with the little horn like Rev.17 shows.

Quote

Again...............

 

2 hours ago, Salty said:

Count the number of pieces of the beast statue image. It has ONLY FIVE PIECES, each one representing a beast kingdom. I realize because the feet of ten toes have iron in it some deem that means a revived Roman empire, since the legs of iron represented the old Roman empire. But that in red shows us all five of these pieces are manifest "together" for the end when Jesus, that "stone", comes to smite that beast upon its feet and the whole thing comes tumbling down... together.

The Statue has nothing to do with the BEAST KINGDOMS Per se, the Statue was representing all FALSE GOVERNMENTS from Daniel or NEBUCHADNEZZAR'S time on. The verses you cite only tell the story of Governments of the World or of Satan, being toppled by Jesus Christ. Just like the Statue is shown as ONE STATUE, the Beast in Revelation 13 and 17 are shown as ONE BEAST. The Statue did not per se represent every kingdom that conquered Israel, it represented Governments from fine Gold on down to Iron mixed with Clay, it was about Governments that tried to rule without God as its head. The Beasts Represent those Kingdoms that Conquered Israel, hence one is Precious Metals and Clay and the other are BEASTS.   I could care less about the TEN TOES. 

2 hours ago, Salty said:

The 4th beast kingdom idea with that 40th verse is the old Roman empire, legs of iron.

 

You are citing the Statue, NOT ME..........But the fact is, there is FIVE KINGDOMS THERE just like there are FIVE BEASTS counting the Little Horn. Then we have to understand via the 7 Kings in Rev. 17 that Egypt and Assyria were Beasts also. 

3 hours ago, Salty said:

So really, it's best to not get all hung up on the 4th beast idea in Dan.7.

In Rev.17:10, those are about beast kings, the 6th one being in Apostle John's days, the 7th one is the coming Antichrist at the end of this world. The 8th beast king points to Satan being loosed at the end of the 1,000 years to go tempt the nations one final time. There have been other beast kings and kingdoms of  history other than the four main ones the Book of Daniel mentions. (It didn't cover Egypt and that was a major beast kingdom in its time.)

The Seven Kings in Rev. 17 represent the Seven Kingdoms of Beasts. The 10 Kings/Horns represent 10 Kings that give their power the the LAST BEAST. The 8th King is not a BEAST that Conquers Israel in the physical, he is a DEMON but not the DRAGON. But he is OVER the Seven. 

[Revelation Man]

2 hours ago, Salty said:

The "little horn" role of Dan.7, is the "beast" (king) that the ten kings rule "one hour" with per Rev.17:12. In that Rev.17:12 verse it only says the word "beast", but that's about the idea of the beast king they rule with. And that's the "little horn" of Dan.7 that comes up among the ten horns and subdues 3 horns. That is the coming Antichrist or pseudo-Christ per Matt.24:23-26 and 2 Thess.2:3-8.

Agreed for the most part.BUT..............Below is off.

2 hours ago, Salty said:

Thus the "little horn" is simply another title for the role the "dragon" (Satan) will play. That role is destroyed at Christ's coming, but NOT the "dragon" which is Satan himself. And THAT... is why you don't find the "dragon" included with the beast and false prophet thrown in the lake of fire at Jesus' coming.

You still... appear to have a problem with NOT recognizing the "dragon" is included with the working of the beast and false prophet in Rev.16, while also refusing to see that the "dragon" is NOT destroyed with them at Jesus' coming per Rev.19:20.

The Dragon is Satan, a Demonic Spirit, he is not one of the BEASTS, he is over the Beasts. The Little Horn is a MAN....Read Daniel, he has the EYES of a MAN and speaks as a MAN. In Rev. his number is the number of a MAN. The Beast is cast into HELL in Rev. 20:10, while Satan is locked in the pit for 1000 years. Its not a ROLE, its a MAN. The MAN OF SIN.....You are trying way to hard to force Satan as the Beast and he is not. 

The Dragon/Apollyon is the 8th King, but he is not a PHYSICAL BEING as seen in our realm. The Beast/Little Horn gets his power from the Dragon. 

[Revelation Man]

35 minutes ago, douggg said:

No, your claim that  "So if you conquer that which belongs to God (Gods People) you are a Beast" is coming from you.... not God.      And your insinuation that anyone who does not agree with you are not  a child of God - is inappropriate, to say the least.     Anyone who is saved is a child of God; not whether they agree to your self-created ideas.    

That is only you speaking that, you can be of God, and Satan can confuse you like he did Peter i the Garden of Gethsemane. Now you are are acting like a Liberal crying about something not being fair, give me a break. I am stating what God has shown me, no one asked you to reply, if you like to, so be it, but do not cast aspersions at others please, its beyond the pale.

[Revelation Man]

2 hours ago, Salty said:

Don't let Satan bewitch you. When that Rev.16:13 verse declares what comes out of the mouth of the "dragon", you were supposed to already catch from Rev.12:9 that title is simply another name for Satan, and then you should have remembered the following from that Rev.12 chapter too:

I do not listen to Satan, Why would I ? LOL.  Rev. 13 is about the Devil Satan, the Anti-Christ and False Prophet sending out LYING SPIRITS to entice the Kings of the East (Persia/Iran/Muslims in General) into coming against Israel along with the Anti-Christ and European Kings. So when the Anti-Christ opens his mouth, he will LIE..........Out goes a lying Spirit of deception. Then whoever the False Prophet is will do the same, and Satan is ALWAYS LYING...........That is all the three Spirits are, THREE SPIRITS OF DECEPTION.

3 hours ago, Salty said:

Rev 12:15-16
15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
KJV

I understand what this means, so I don't get your overall point. The Dragon/Satan came after the Woman just like he came after BABY JESUS, by using a what ? MAN........Herod the Great............NOW he uses the Anti-Christ to come after Israel. Put it together man. But the EARTH HELPED HER.........Do you get that ? Just like in Exodus, the EARTH HELPED Moses and Israel escape the Egyptians/DRAGON, by the Sea Parting, here the Flee to the Wilderness (Maybe Petra) and God in some manner uses the EARTH TO PROTECT HER (Israel). 

3 hours ago, Salty said:

Our Lord Jesus really was good to us with revealing a whole lot in Revelation if we'd only listen to Him. He made that idea of the flood that comes out of the mouth being from both the one called "the serpent" and "the dragon" which Rev.12:9 revealed are simply other titles for Satan.

What comes out of one's MOUTH anyway? Is that really... that difficult to figure out?

Commands come forth from the Mouth.......I can't believe you do not understand that Satan is merely a SPIRITUAL BEING on Earth. Satan RULES but he must work via MEN.

3 hours ago, Salty said:

What beast? Rev.19:20 says just the word "beast", but we know already that word can apply to a beast kingdom or a beast king. So which one is it, or is it both that go into the lake of fire at Jesus' coming?

 

The LAST BEAST is a MAN.......There will be no successors. 

3 hours ago, Salty said:

Don't try to change God's Word on that title of the "dragon", for our Lord Jesus revealed through John it is simply another title for Satan himself.

Rev 12:9
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
KJV

Those titles apply ONLY to Satan himself. Any other idea is an attempt to add or take away from God's Holy Writ.

You keep repeating this, but it makes no sense. So Satan is the Dragon, what dies this prove ? That doesn't make him one of the SEVEN BEASTS, it makes him the Dragon or 8th King who was OVER THE SEVEN.

 

[Daniel 11:36]

"What beast? Rev.19:20 says just the word "beast", but we know already that word can apply to a beast kingdom or a beast king. So which one is it, or is it both that go into the lake of fire at Jesus' coming?"

 

This beast is not a kingdom [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 13:1-4; 17:8-18]

The descriptions given tell you who Satan's beast is .... no doubt

As long as you ignore this truth you will never unravel your current faulty views on the subject of this thread

[HAZARD]

6 hours ago, Salty said:

Jerusalem in Rev.11:8 is being referred to SPIRITUALLY as Sodom and Egypt, both pagan sites.

So I think you well know and understand how Christ is applying the idea of Babylon SPIRITUALLY for Jerusalem when that Antichrist comes to sit as king in Jerusalem.

Parenthetical - Mystical Babylon, (Rev. 17:1-18) Rev. 17 is the eighth parenthetical passage and is an account in some detail of Ecclesiastical Babylon, her identification, character, power, wickedness, judgment and destruction by the Antichrist and the ten kings, as well as an explanation of the beast and its seven heads and ten horns. It is clear that this passage is parenthetical because this religion is destroyed by the Antichrist and the ten kings in the middle of the Week so that the Antichrist worship may be established (Rev. 17:16-17).

Since the beast worship is during the last three and one-half years of the Week. Mystery Babylon must be destroyed at that time (Rev.13-1-18). Man destroys mystical Babylon (Rev. 17:16, 17), and God destroys literal Babylon (Rev. 18:5-8, 20).

God will put the idea into the hearts of the ten kings to give their kingdoms to the beast for the purpose of destroying Mystical Babylon (Rev. 17:14-17), while this is not true in the case of Literal Babylon.

The beast and the ten kings will rejoice over the destruction of Mystical Babylon (Rev. 17:16, 17) and they will mourn over the destruction of Literal Babylon (Rev. 18:9-19). Thus it is clear that there are two Babylon's in Rev. 16:17-18:24.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

According to many Bibles cholars and historians the great whore is identified as a great religious system, the RCC, which they claim will fulfil Rev. 17 and dominate the Antichrist for a short time during his rise over the ten kings and until the middle of the Week. Then the beast and the ten kings will destroy her (Rev. 17:9-17). Even Catholic divines admit Rev. 17 is a description of their church.

(See the writings of Cardinal Ballarmine and the French Prelat, Boussuet.) She has a name on her forehead, "Mystery Babylon The Great" (Rev. 17:5).