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The context of 1 Thess 5:1


Heb 13:8

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1 hour ago, Heb 13:8 said:

The 6th seal and Joel 2:31 are actually referring to the second coming at the end of the 70th week.

 

The alternative would be the sixth seal event is revealed at the mid point (AofD), and the wrath of trumpets and bowls is the latter 3.5 yr.

Brother Duke ...........     This is also the same as Matthew 24

29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

It's pretty clear from scriptures.

Immediately AFTER.....the tribulation of those days......

The AofD is at the midpoint. This kicks off the Great Tribulation. This is the fourth seal...Rev 6:8.....

 

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1 hour ago, JoeCanada said:

Brother Duke ...........     This is also the same as Matthew 24

29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

It's pretty clear from scriptures.

Immediately AFTER.....the tribulation of those days......

The AofD is at the midpoint. This kicks off the Great Tribulation. This is the fourth seal...Rev 6:8.....

Right, Matt 24 is describing the end of the 70th week at His second coming. So if the 6th seal is also at the end of the 70th week (sun moon stars), the 7th seal has to be prior to that which makes the seals non-chronological?

Or maybe just maybe, these two passages are describing two different events, one at the AofD and the other at His second coming. Could it be that "stars" in the sixth seal are fallen angels at the AofD, Rev 12:4, 9?

Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

Matt 24:29 "Immediately after the distress of those days "'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.'

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=TdhCW8TZGOiI_QaT04HAAw&q=does+the+moon+give+off+light+during+blood+moons&oq=does+the+moon+give+off+light+during+blood+moons&gs_l=psy-ab.3...1137.14238.0.14424.48.47.0.0.0.0.127.3999.36j11.47.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..1.44.3702.0..0j35i39k1j0i131k1j0i131i20i264k1j0i20i264k1j0i3k1j0i22i30k1j33i160k1j33i22i29i30k1j33i21k1.0.720Kj6SKJFI

Your thoughts. - Heb

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On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

Hi Ron....

I'm sure that you can agree that 1Cor 15:51-52 is referring to the rapture......

"Behold, I shew you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump.; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed"

Now add to this Math 24:29-31

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken; and then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory,  And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other"

The mention of the "great trumpet" occurs AFTER the "tribulation of those days".

Either this is the same as the "last trumpet" in 1Cor 15:51-52.......and if not, the real last trumpet occurs even later (in order to be last) which is still after the tribulation. Since the rapture occurs at the last trumpet, its after the tribulation.

How could anyone be raptured at the sound of the trumpet before the tribulation???

Hello Brother, I was busy all day today...........I will try to shed some light on this for you brother, I have no problem sharing with those seeking truth, after all that is what we are all supposed to be after, but sadly some are just after making presupposed assumptions fit. 

For starters, Paul often (you need to study this on your own) used SHADOWS of things to come. He used the Feasts of Leviticus, you really have to look for these things, but they are there. You see the LAST TRUMP of the Church Age doesn't have to be the last Trump ever blown, its just the LAST CALL for the Church and its not really a Trump call unto the Church, its Jesus' voice which REVERBERATES and only those with the Holy Spirit inside them will hear it, that is why the 5 Virgins are left behind, they do not have enough Oil to make it unto the Marriage call. 

Jesus Fulfilled these Fall Feasts:

1.) Passover (our passover blood).........2.) Unleavened Bread (Without Sin)...........3.) First-fruits (from the grave).

4. We are in the Harvest or Pentecost, its a 2000 year period. Notice, its on the Calendar all unto itself.

5. The "LAST TRUMP" is the next Feast in line, when the Feast of Trumpets blew the Harvest ALWAYS ENDED, and it was understood that the Feasts of ATONEMENT and TABERNACLE were nigh at hand. TRUMPETS ONLY ANNOUNCE THINGS !!

6. Who needs to ATONE? The Church or the Jews/Israel? Well of course its the Jews that MUST REPENT before the 70th Week prophecy can come to pass, so says Gabriel in Dan. ch. 9. So the Church Age ENDS (Harvest) and now Israel must ATONE/Repent from her sins against God. The Church is no longer needed on the earth, the Church goes to Heaven to Marry the Lamb, Jesus told the Church in John 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you........So we the Church go to be with Christ in Heaven for 7 Years, it just so happens the SON in the Jewish Marriage Tradition builds a room in his fathers house, the father tells the son when to go get the Bride, its usually after midnight, thus the Bride though EXPECTANT is also SURPRISED, then the couple stay in the Marriage Chambers for 7 DAYS !! (7 YEARS). 

7. The Feast of TABERNACLE only means that God DWELLS with us. And of course after Israel REPENTS Jesus/God will dwell with Israel in Jerusalem for 1000 years. So every FEAST has to come to pass in a like minded SHADOW so to speak. 

The LAST TRUMP only means the LAST TRUMP of the Church Age Brother, it ends the Church Age and calls Israel unto REPENTANCE !! The Trumpets in Revelation are Judgment Trumpets. The Trumpet in Matthew 24 is Jesus telling an Angel to CALL US IN HEAVEN........Notice, we are gathered from the FOUR CORNERS OF HEAVEN, we are in Heaven Marrying the Lamb, so f course the ELECT are Gathered from Heaven. 

Matthew 23:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Its the LAST CALL By Jesus to the Marriage in Heaven. NOTICE: 

Rev. 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter

2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

The TRUMPET is Jesus CALLING us to the Marriage in Heaven...........COME UP HERE !! His voice REVERBERATES like an Earthquake !!

Revelation 1:10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, 11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. 12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;

13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. 14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.

Its Jesus' voice that SOUNDS as a Trumpet my Brother, He calls the Church home to the Marriage with a SHOUT only we can hear.

The Groom returns with a shout, “Behold, the bridegroom comes!” 
Church - First Thessalonians 4:16 – “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.”

Let me insert an additional hope at this point. When the Lord Jesus comes for His Bride, the Church, we will not be totally surprised. Although the Jewish bride did not know the day or the hour, she was expectant. The Apostle Paul in speaking of “that Day” said, “But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day.” (First Thessalonians 5:4-5) Today, many in the Church are expectant and will not be totally surprised.

The Bride and Groom go to the wedding chamber.
Church – This period when the Bride and Groom spend time together seems to show that the Bride of Jesus will be with Him in Heaven. This appears to indicate a pre-Tribulation gathering of the Church, and is described in Isaiah 26:20; “Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be over-past.” Praise the Lord!

The Problem I see is people do not understand Paul is speaking of the LAST TRUMP (Call or SHOUT unto the Bride). The Trumps of Revelation are Judgment Trumps, the Trump via the Angel is calling us to go back to Earth to battle the Beast. The LAST TRUMP is the Trump that ends he Harvest or Church Age on Earth. Its a SPECIFIC CALL unto the Church to leave the Earth. Trumps have specific purposes. It will be the LAST TRUMP to end the HARVEST, now comes the 70th Week and JUDGMENT !!

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

The scariest part about the pretribulation rapture is that it promotes the concept that people will be given a second chance to repent and make things right with the Lord. They are told that the righteous will be taken away and that they will have seven years to find their faith and redeem their souls.

Its not a concept brother, its a fact. God deals with Israel after He takes the Church to Heaven to Marry the Lamb, Israel is ALREADY Married unto God. People that ARE NOT DEAD are not given any more of a chance than people during the Church Age who lived a full life, or someone who might have gotten Cancer at age 49 and then gave their lives unto Christ just before death. God is a loving God and doesn't desire that any should perish. Those who come to Christ during the Tribulation period must pay with their lives in all likelihood. They are the BEHEADED under the Alter and the one who rule ON EARTH with Christ 1000 years in Rev.20:4. Why is people coming to the Lord SCARY ? 

They are told nothing, they know they were not living for Christ, thus they couldn't be taken t Heaven, all sin must be purged before we go to Heaven. Thus they can now give their hearts to Christ or SERVE Satan, its their choice isn't it? We are all given FREE WILL after all. 

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

This concept is going to leave people confused and force them to believe other deceptions when they find themselves in the tribulation....without a rapture.

Or we WILL BE RAPTURED.........And we will be Raptured. No confusion then except to you guys flying through the air IN SPIRIT BODIES !! Our flesh bodies DIE and we change to Spirit bodies in the TWINKLING of an eye.

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

And that is why there will be a great falling away....as Paul talked about in 2Thes 2:3. 

 

There is NO SUCH THING.........It clearly means a DEPARTURE of the Church.

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

Something like 90% of Christendom have been taught pretrib rapture. 90%!!!!!! ......And that is also why Jesus talked about deception in the last days.

These truths are SELF EVIDENT to me brother.

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

" And many false prophets shall arise and shall deceive many".....Math 24:11

 

Firstly, quoting a scripture means nothing as pertaining to who is right or wrong. SECONDLY, verse 11 is about the 2000 year Church Age, not the Tribulation period. 

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

 You would actually be better off in teaching that the believers will face the Antichrist, and go thru the tribulation....(but not the wrath of God)......so that they can get their full armor on. And, if you're wrong, so what. You'll be zapped outta here before the SHTF......

 

Why would I teach an UNTRUTH Brother? 

On 7/7/2018 at 10:25 PM, JoeCanada said:

On the other hand, if you teach the pretrib rapture, and it doesn't come to pass, then your followers will be ill-prepared for what's ahead. And they'll say...." He was wrong about the rapture, what else is he wrong about...." And the fallout begins

"Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment."

I believe this will be Satan's greatest feat........To deceive the church in the end times. 

 

I don't worry about things coming to pass when Jesus/God/Holy Spirit teaches us these things. Satan is a WIMP, he can not ever have victory over the Church, that is why we must LEAVE THE EARTH before his weak self can come forth. 

Edited by Revelation Man
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On 7/8/2018 at 12:18 AM, Heb 13:8 said:

RM, look at your definition of harpazo. Did Jesus have to be carried off by force or be obtained by robbery? No, He had already defeated the devil. Now look below. Isn't robbery and thief not synonymous? Isn't that what the rapture is gonna be like to the world??

Jesus was TAKEN UP/Harpazoed.........That is what John and the writer of Acts saw. Why quibble with it? Its all the same. Most Greek and Hebrew words before the Greek had multiple meanings we have to use what fits properly. That is why the FIRST DAY in Genesis is a PERIOD OF TIME that lasts 9.2 Billion years. Not ONE 24 Hour Day. You can use Robbery if you want to, I refuse to even recognize that as a part of either passage we were speaking about. Keep it simple charlie........you confuse yourself it seems by overthinking things.

On 7/8/2018 at 12:18 AM, Heb 13:8 said:

Ok, then find one passage that shows "teknon" as Jesus Christ himself. I believe there's 99 references that have "teknon" describing either the church or believers in the church. I see John connecting the head with the body through first resurrection and rapture by using huios and teknon, Col 1:18.

Quote

My post stands on its own merits, the Genealogies were always about the males, so if either word were used its still about the MALE CHILD or MAKE SON. Its supposed to be ENCODED !! 

On 7/8/2018 at 12:18 AM, Heb 13:8 said:

Ok, so first you say it's a prophecy from 2,000 years ago, then you say it's about future Israel in the wilderness. And I'm confused?

 

Yes you are confused, the event that happened 2000 years ago is a PAST EVENT thus it can't be a Prophecy can it ? It happened before John wrote about it. I clearly stated it was a CODE to FIGURE OUT a PROPHECY. The Prophecy is a FUTURE EVENT, its Israel being chased by the Dragon and a LIKE-MINDED EVENT was shown in verses 12:1-5 where the Dragon via King Herod tried to KILL baby Jesus. Now we know the Red Dragon is Satan, and the Woman that gave birth to Jesus is Israel via Genesis 37:9. I warned everyone the September EVENT was not of God a few years back.

On 7/8/2018 at 12:18 AM, Heb 13:8 said:

Visions have meanings, and the entire chapter of Rev 12 is about the 70th week of Daniel from start to finish. The woman is Israel, the child being born is the body of Christ through rapture and the dragon is the antichrist system in Rev 13. The church was conceived at Pentecost 2000 years ago and is waiting to be born through first resurrection and rapture.

Even Paul said he felt abnormally born in 1 Cor 15:8 because he hadn't received his resurrected body yet, and as we can see in Rev 2:26-27, Rev 12:5 the church is being mentioned here as ruling with Christ with an iron scepter.

No its not, its about the Beast trying to kill the Jews that REPENT and them fleeing to Petra fr 1260 Days. The Child is Jesus who the Dragon tried to Kill, Jesus told us the Church could not be defeated by the GATES OF HELL, So there was no way Satan ever thought he could defeat the Church. He has always tried to defeat/destroy the Jews. 

On 7/8/2018 at 12:18 AM, Heb 13:8 said:

fulfilled, which is the end of the 70th week. Luke 21:20-28 is referring to the AofD all the way to the second coming.

The Gentile Church will be Raptured. Not understanding that throws ones Eschatology to the winds brother.

 

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17 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

HOW LONG IS THE DAY OF THE LORD

For the Lord has a day of vengeance, a year of recompense for the cause of Zion. (Isa 34:8)

To proclaim the favorable year of the Lord and the day of vengeance of our God (Isa. 61:2)

For the day of vengeance was in My heart, And My year of redemption has come. (Isa. 63:4)

Knowing that the Wrath of God begins on a day but lasts a year helps other scriptures fall into place.  Noah was in the Ark exactly one year and ten days.

In the second month, on the seventeenth day of the month, on the same day all the fountains of the great deep burst open . . . In the second month, on the twenty-seventh day of the month, the earth was dry.  (Gen. 7:11, 8:14)

The coming of the Son of Man is to be like unto the days of Noah. Noah was above the earth 1 year and 10 days while the unrighteous were judged. The righteous will be above the earth 1 year and 10 days after the Rapture while the unrighteous will be judged during the Day of the Lord.

Now, look at this from Deut:

When a man takes a new wife, he shall not go out with the army nor be charged with any duty; he shall be free at home one year and shall give happiness to his wife whom he has taken. (Deut. 24:5)

This prescription about marriage will be honored by Jesus. He will marry the Bride of Christ in heaven after the Rapture. Only a year later will he return to wage war against the Antichrist armies.  In Revelation 19 we see this exact order of events. The Wedding Supper of the Lamb takes place in heaven  first, only then does Jesus mount a white horse and return to the earth to fight Armageddon.  There is a one year period between the wedding and the return. That year will be the Day of the Lord.

Many of you hold to the Day of the Lord being the entire 7 years of Tribulation.

Where are your scriptures to prove this? I have shown from scripture that the Day of the Lord is a year long, not 7 years.

The Day of the Lord is a 3.5 Year Period of Gods Wrath. It starts with the FIRST SEAL and ends with the 7th Vial.

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13 hours ago, JoeCanada said:
On 7/7/2018 at 7:41 PM, Revelation Man said:

Malachi 4:5-6 tells is that Israel REPENT...BEFORE the Day of the Lord which starts at the 1260 Event or the Midway point of the 70th Week.

Hi Ron....

Malachi 4:5-6........"Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord....and he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse"

Can you explain to me where in these verses it says that Israel repents to God?

YES SIR.........Scriptures have to be understood LINE UPON LINE, here a little there a little !!

Mathew 17:8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only. 9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.

10 And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?

11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.

Now if someone wanted to they could try and twist Malachi 4:5-6 and say, no it doesn't QUITE SAY THAT....But Jesus says it does mean exactly that, Elijah will restore AL THINGS unto Israel as one of the Two-witnesses. So we have to put the bible together brother like a puzzle, these truths are there, we have to DIG THEM OUT. So we now agree right? Elijah comes BEFORE the Day of the Lord and RESTORES Israel unto God !!

13 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

u said.........."the Day of the Lord which starts at the 1260 Event or the Midway point of the 70th Week."

Scripture shows that they Day of the Lord is a year long...... 

For the Lord has a day of vengeance, a year of recompense for the cause of Zion. (Isa 34:8)

To proclaim the favorable year of the Lord and the day of vengeance of our God (Isa. 61:2)

For the day of vengeance was in My heart, And My year of redemption has come. (Isa. 63:4)

Here you have the Day of the Lord as 3 1/2 years long. Can you provide any scripture which backs up your claim?

Those Scriptures are just like the ones that call it A DAY.....Its a DAY that it starts, its lasts for years etc. etc. These are God not telling everything H knows or has planned, but giving us incremental clues all along the way. We know its called the LAMBS WRATH in Rev. ch. 6 so the Wrath of God starts with the very First Seal because God has PERFECT SYMMETRY. 

It is Jesus Himself who breaks the seals that launch each of the Seal Judgments recorded in Revelation 6. These judgments occur at the beginning of the Tribulation, and they are referred to as “the wrath of the Lamb” (Revelation 6:16).

All the judgments of Revelation are clearly superintended by God. That is the reason we are told in Revelation 15:1 that the Bowl Judgments at the end of the Tribulation will finish the wrath of God, not begin His wrath.

So it seems the Wrath of God covers all of the Seal, Trumpet and Vial Judgments, and since the first seal is the Anti-Christ going forth to Conquer, we know he Day of the Lord must last 42 Months or 3.5 Years.

8 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Hi Heb 13:8....

You are correct in saying that the Day of the Lord spans from the rapture......

At the 6th seal, there is a "great earthquake and the sun became black as sackcloth and the moon became as blood"....Rev 6:12

Again, God does everything in PERFECT SYMMETRY. Jesus is opening the seals, they are the Lambs Wrath. The humans on earth only understand via the 6th Seal that they are in the Day of he Lord or Gods Wrath because THEY SEE for the first tie the supernatural events that link events to he DOTL.

8 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

This is what Joel describes before the Day of the Lord....."the sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come"....Joel 2:31

As I have proven, this BEFORE here in Hebrew means IN HE PRESENCE (in the face of) of the Day of he Lord, so DURING the DOTL the Sun and Moon will be darkened etc. etc. Not BEFORE the DOTL comes.

8 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Then Rev 7......the 144,000 are sealed....... THEN the  RESURRECTION and RAPTURE......THEN the DAY of the LORD....And we know this to be the Resurrection/Rapture because John says that ......"AFTER this I beheld, and lo, a great multitude ....before the throne.....WEARING white robes......Rev 7:9

The 144,000 have zilch to do with the Rapture, that has already happened. The 144,000 are ALL THE Jews, probably 2 million Jews who REPENT and Flee Judea to Petra, they must be PROTECTED IN Petra before the rest of the Judgments can come upon BABYLON (The world) and AT HE EXACT SAME TIME we are then shown the Church which was Raptured over 3.5 years ago, SITTING IN HEAVEN, having already Married the Lamb thus the White Robes, they were also shown in Rev. chapters 4 and 5 with White Raiment on, thus this IS NOT 70th Week TRIBULATION Saints, they are told SPECIFICALLY by Jesus under the Alter at the 5th Seal that they MUST WAIT until all the Tribulation Saint Brothers die as they have died, then they are Resurrected and Judged at the Rev. 20:4 Judgment Seat.

9 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Then Rev 8.....the trumpets, followed by the bowls......these are the WRATH of God and the Lamb.....THE DAY OF THE LORD

The 6 seals span the first 6 years of the 70th week. The trumpet/bowls....ie The Wrath of God.....are the 7th year of the 70th week

Wow, brother your timing is WAY OFF. You need to star over brother. 

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On 7/6/2018 at 10:21 PM, Revelation Man said:

Firstly, quoting a scripture means nothing as pertaining to who is right or wrong.

 

I seriously can't believe you said this!

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On 7/6/2018 at 10:21 PM, Revelation Man said:

 

only those with the Holy Spirit inside them will hear it..... so it's going to be a secret then

 its the Jews that MUST REPENT before the 70th Week prophecy can come to pass...... please provide scriptural proof

The Trumpet in Matthew 24 is Jesus telling an Angel to CALL US IN HEAVEN........Notice, we are gathered from the FOUR CORNERS OF HEAVEN, we are in Heaven Marrying the Lamb, so f course the ELECT are Gathered from Heaven. ..........you're putting in words here. They are gathered together from the four winds, EARTH.......I don't believe HEAVEN has four winds

 

Rev. 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.............. It was John who was called up....."I will shew THEE"....singular, "you"

 

The TRUMPET is Jesus CALLING us to the Marriage in Heaven...........COME UP HERE !! His voice REVERBERATES like an Earthquake !!.........First Thessalonians 4:16 – “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.”........

So lets finish 1Thes 4:16......AND THE DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE FIRST. THEN WE WHICH ARE ALIVE AND REMAIN SHALL BE CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR........SO HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN THESE TWO VERSES. ONE IS JESUS CALLING US UP TO HEAVEN AND THE OTHER IS JESUS COMING FOR US...AND WE MEET HIM IN THE AIR

the Trump via the Angel is calling us to go back to Earth to battle the Beast. The LAST TRUMP is the Trump that ends he Harvest or Church Age on Earth. Its a SPECIFIC CALL unto the Church to leave the Earth.......DOESN'T MAKE SENSE

" And many false prophets shall arise and shall deceive many".....Math 24:11.........verse 11 is about the 2000 year Church Age, not the Tribulation period................AH YES, Lets pick and choose what doesn't fit. 

That is why the FIRST DAY in Genesis is a PERIOD OF TIME that lasts 9.2 Billion years. Not ONE 24 Hour Day.........ARE YOU EVEN SERIOUS????? This is the most ridiculous thing I've heard......You are obviously NOT a creationist.

 

This is what Joel describes before the Day of the Lord....."the sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come"....Joel 2:31

As I have proven, this BEFORE here in Hebrew means IN HE PRESENCE (in the face of) of the Day of he Lord, so DURING the DOTL the Sun and Moon will be darkened etc. etc. Not BEFORE the DOTL comes........Well well, The Holy Spirit says BEFORE...you says its not before.....Hmmmm, who shall I believe

The Day of the Lord is a 3.5 Year Period of Gods Wrath. It starts with the FIRST SEAL and ends with the 7th Vial......Scripture has 3 witnesses to the Day of the Lord being a year long.........but you say "Firstly, quoting a scripture means nothing as pertaining to who is right or wrong.......Well, I guess that's it in a nutshell about your belief in scriptures

 

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19 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Jesus was TAKEN UP/Harpazoed.........That is what John and the writer of Acts saw. Why quibble with it? Its all the same. Most Greek and Hebrew words before the Greek had multiple meanings we have to use what fits properly. That is why the FIRST DAY in Genesis is a PERIOD OF TIME that lasts 9.2 Billion years. Not ONE 24 Hour Day. You can use Robbery if you want to, I refuse to even recognize that as a part of either passage we were speaking about. Keep it simple charlie........you confuse yourself it seems by overthinking things.

RM, you don't over think things if you understand the context. You're trying to fit two definitions into one, and you failed.

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My post stands on its own merits, the Genealogies were always about the males, so if either word were used its still about the MALE CHILD or MAKE SON. Its supposed to be ENCODED !! 

Right, but teknon is referring to the male child or male son in the church, which is US, not Jesus Christ alone.

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Yes you are confused, the event that happened 2000 years ago is a PAST EVENT thus it can't be a Prophecy can it ? It happened before John wrote about it. I clearly stated it was a CODE to FIGURE OUT a PROPHECY. The Prophecy is a FUTURE EVENT, its Israel being chased by the Dragon and a LIKE-MINDED EVENT was shown in verses 12:1-5 where the Dragon via King Herod tried to KILL baby Jesus. Now we know the Red Dragon is Satan, and the Woman that gave birth to Jesus is Israel via Genesis 37:9. I warned everyone the September EVENT was not of God a few years back.

No, Rev 12:1-5 is a sign that came to pass on 9/23/17. A "sign" tells us of things to come, which is the 70th week of Daniel in the rest of Rev 12. This sign has nothing to do with King Herod. This sign is describing corporate entities in the future, not singular.

1. Israel - Woman
2. Body of Christ - Child
3. Antichrist system - Red Dragon (Rev 13)

Gen 1:14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years

This is astronomy, not astrology. - God bless

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23 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

The Day of the Lord is a 3.5 Year Period of Gods Wrath. It starts with the FIRST SEAL and ends with the 7th Vial.

The Day of the Lord is 1000 years,ie,the millennium period.

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